Avoid reading books of Wayne Liquorman and Ramesh balsekar

[Guest guest]

All books are misinterpretation of Advaita and never touch any of

these books who are misguiding people for personal benefits.

 

Read this story..I have the recording and proof.

" The true Guru will never humiliate you, nor will he estrange you

from yourself. He will constantly bring you back to the fact of your

inherent perfection and encourage you to seek within. He knows you

need nothing, not even him, and is never tired of reminding you. But

the self-appointed Guru is more concerned with himself than with his

disciples. "

 

-

Nisargadatta Maharaj

 

 

InnerQuest has been promoting Ramesh Balsekar since 1996 and many

people have visited him through our recommendation. Therefore, I

feel that it is my duty to inform everyone of the traps and

contradictions that have recently become apparent in

Ramesh's 'teaching', which he claims is part of the Advaita Truth. A

true Advaita master would never abuse or ask anything from his

disciples for his own interest. Ramesh conveniently uses Advaitic

concepts, like 'non-doership', to permit any kind of behaviour. When

he claims that " he is not the doer " , then one has to ask, " Who then

is asking for sexual favours from his disciples? " The Self never

asks for anything because It is complete and that is why a true

master has no desire.

 

Ranjit Maharaj and Nisargadatta Maharaj (Ramesh's Master) are both

disciples of the great Master Siddharameshwar Maharaj. I had the

extreme good luck to spend much time together with Ranjit Maharaj,

in his small room in Bombay, in Paris and in Brittany. I saw that He

was an authentic Master, living from the Final Reality - That which

we all are, beyond name and form, beyond all knowledge. When He

taught, He always said, " This is not my teaching. All credit goes to

my Master. " He was extremely devoted to His Master and to Freedom.

His essential message was: " How can something exist in nothing? " ,

which is the true Advaita teaching. Maharaj would say, " You suffer

because you have taken the touch of the mind and have love for the

illusion. In Reality, nothing happens and nothing is real. The

choice is yours now - either you take it to heart or you do not. "

Sri Ranjit lived by His words and had no interest, whatsoever,

in 'worldly affairs'. For me, He was Absolutely Free and a real

Advaita teacher.

 

Below is an account written by a good friend of mine who attended

the last Kovalam retreat in December 2004 with Ramesh in Kerala,

South India. Considering the seriousness of the situation, I feel

the necessity to act by conveying his account to sincere seekers of

Freedom. I have always felt that once the truth of a situation is

revealed, I must follow my heart and act upon it out of deep respect

for the Truth. Following my heart, in the light of Advaita, has

always been my true Master. I encourage you to listen to your heart

after reading the account below.

 

Darrell

InnerQuest, Paris

 

 

ACCOUNT FROM AN ATTENDEE OF THE KOVALAM 2004 RETREAT

 

I hope that what I have written below will serve to reveal actual

facts, and thereby lead the reader to investigate the reality of the

deeper meaning behind those facts.

 

Two years ago I traveled to Bombay for my first meeting with Ramesh

Balsekar, in order to verify whether his teachings were genuine or

not. I subsequently went there to see Ramesh again several times.

The last time I saw Ramesh was in Kovalam, Kerala in December 2004.

These are some of the things, which I observed occur in Bombay and

at Kovalam.

 

In Bombay, in the large room, next door to the satsang room in

Ramesh's residence, I noticed numerous photographs of Ramesh, some

of which showed him when he was young, in a pose like that of a

statue of a Greek athlete of antiquity. Every photograph was for

sale at a rather high price for India. I was puzzled, ill at ease,

finding it surprising, and even out of place, that a 'sage' would

expose his physical body in such a way and make money out of selling

photographs such as these.

 

Before seeing these photos, I had just been listening to Ramesh give

a rather basic talk on humility, and on the absence of pride and

arrogance in a sage. And here I was face to face with these more or

less questionable photographs being sold in apparent total

contradiction to the discourse I had just heard.

 

I also noticed books being sold on the premises. Many people

purchase books there, and I often heard Ramesh himself encourage

visitors to buy copies. The sale of the audio recording of the day's

talk on a CD caught my attention because of its price: 500 rupees,

(approximately $12 US, or 9 Euros), which is also a high price for

India.

 

One fact which always surprised and shocked me was that Ramesh often

told his listeners that he only teaches those who already live a

comfortable life, those who have no material worries. Clearly,

Ramesh's visitors are neither poor or financially needy, and many

are actually wealthy. One cannot avoid noticing that money appears

to be quite important to Ramesh.

 

On one of my stays in Bombay, I asked Ramesh questions on the

absolute essential truth (paramartha satya), and on the relative

expressed truth (samvritti satya). These words relate to traditional

Indian teachings. I ever only received vague and superficial answers

from him, which did not help me at all. If Ramesh was not responding

clearly, I wondered whether it was due to ignorance on his part, or

due to lack of understanding of the questions?

 

Then, I made my way to the 2004 Kovalam seminar. Among the 155

participants representing about twenty countries were two wealthy

Indians. Half of the attendees were meeting Ramesh for the first

time. A group of Germans, who seemed to have known Ramesh for a long

time, were organizing and running the seminar.

 

The general content of what was being taught at the seminar was

identical to what I had already heard in Bombay.

 

The first thing which struck me was Ramesh's response to a

psychiatric medical doctor of Jewish origin who spoke of the

suffering that had pursued him all his life. His father had died in

the Nazi camps. The fact that he had never met his father had always

been a source of major suffering for him. His sincere account was

touching as he expressed it openly in front of everyone.

 

Ramesh's callous response was, " This is just a happening, and you

have not had any choice. You can only accept! "

 

I will add that on several occasions Ramesh put " a Hitler and

hundreds of Mother Teresas " on the same level. I wondered why Ramesh

approached someone's suffering with such shocking and useless words.

(I will remark here that several participants were of Jewish origin.)

 

Then this same doctor asked Ramesh, " I have the impression of a

feeling of energy in your presence, could you explain why to me? "

 

Ramesh's nonsequitur response was, " You have spent a thousand Euros

for this seminar, but if you come to my house, it is free. Although

this should not prevent you from making a donation. " The German

staff had a lot of fun with this reply.

 

The topic of donations was raised several times during the seminar.

Each time, Ramesh reminded the audience that the donations which

benefit the donor, are those which 'pinch' the donor, and that

without " feeling this pain " the donation cannot be positive for the

donor.

 

A young American of Russian origin, who was very shocked by these

words, spoke to several of us and expressed his indignation, " But

how can a guru ask for money like this? "

 

Right up to the last day, this chap was very unhappy about how the

seminar was turning out. He was not the only one to be so shocked.

 

Several of us came to understand that the profits from the seminar

turned out to be quite a large sum for Ramesh. It is a known fact

that using pseudo-spirituality as a means to pressure people into

giving large sums of money has always been a handy way for the

teacher to grow rich at the expense of others.

 

On the second to last day, the German organizer handed each

participant a paper which explained how hard the cooks worked in the

hotel where we had our meals. On this paper, he suggested that each

one of us give a tip of 1,500 rupees at the end of the seminar. A

tip which he would personally hand out. (To the cooks, we wondered?)

Several people expressed their indignation at being requested to

give such a large sum of money (the price of the seminar being

already high), as well as their doubts as to where this money was

actually going.

 

One of them told me: " It is impossible that this organizer would

hand 225,000 rupees, [approximately $5,000 US, or 4,000 Euros] over

to the cooks. I do not believe it! "

 

I also saw that the price of the books being sold at Kovalam was

higher than their usual price.

 

Toward the middle of the seminar, several women appeared to be quite

ill at ease and unhappy, whereas they did not appear at all like

that at the beginning.

 

Ramesh's German staff themselves appeared a little agitated,

distant, preoccupied and difficult to approach.

 

I observed all of this wondering what could be the reason.

 

A young American woman, who appeared to be unhappier than the

others, seemed quite affected. She remained isolated, sad and

withdrawn in her own corner. A Mexican American man was comforting

her. He did the same for several women who appeared to go to him for

support. Two other men were also offering them help. Again, I was

wondering what was going on.

 

At the end of the second to last satsang, a young western doctor,

who had studied traditional Indian medicine, asked Ramesh: " Do you

think that a guru can use his teaching to justify his own actions,

to justify his own behavior? "

 

The question was direct. Ramesh appeared to be taken aback, and gave

a vague reply, " Whatever happens is only an event, the will of God,

a cosmic law... and the guru is not concerned by the event. " As it

was the end of that satsang, a woman came out to play the harmonium

and sing a devotional song.

 

During the week Ramesh told a story, (which he also told in Bombay),

about the sex life of a well known guru who lived not far from

Bangalore.

 

A disciple, who had been with this guru for over twenty years,

caught him in the middle of a sex act with young boys. He had never

previously known that his guru did this. Very shocked, he came back

to see the guru telling him that he could not tolerate such actions,

and that he was leaving the ashram immediately. The guru's response

was, " You have created the problem. Now you have to solve it! "

 

Ramesh expressed his agreement with this response and

said, " Everything is only an event ruled by cosmic law and by divine

will... It is the programming of the body-mind mechanism... and

nothing can be done about it... the guru is not concerned! "

 

Ramesh then told us another similar story about another guru living

near Bombay. I later took it that he was referring to Satya Sai Baba

and Muktananda respectively.

 

Then he attempted to impugn the moral standing of Nisargadatta

Maharaj himself.

 

I asked myself: " Why is Ramesh telling these upsetting/sordid

stories that shock so many people in the assembly? " I had the

feeling that he was attempting to 'destroy' the criteria of what an

authentic guru is.

 

Ramesh added that he taught a 'negative path', and that Nisargadatta

Maharaj taught a 'positive path', meaning that he, Ramesh taught

only the 'neti, neti,' 'not this, not this,' (or 'negative'

approach, which uses concepts to lead beyond all concepts), whereas

Maharaj taught a 'positive' approach, relying on whatever the

concepts point to as being real.

 

I remember that these words raised indignation in several people.

After the satsang, an English lady came to share her annoyance with

me: " Nisargadatta teaching a 'positive path'?!... What does Ramesh

mean to say about him? It is not true. Maharaj has always taught

the 'negative way'! " I also disagreed with Ramesh's words.

 

An important moment took place when Ramesh stated that bhakti

(devotion to God) was totally useless and had no meaning, and that

only jnana (knowledge) was important. He added, " You are probably

surprised to hear this, because it must be the first time you are

hearing it, isn't it? "

 

A man seated behind me started crying, as if he had just lost all

references. I tried to comfort him as well as I could. I was

troubled and disturbed seeing the impact Ramesh's words were having

on the psyche of this sensitive spiritual seeker.

 

Simply speaking, I felt that Ramesh was trying to say to us that he

was the only one who had right understanding, and not the gurus who

had gone before him. I was bewildered. Later, a young Australian

student in neuro-psychology told me that Ramesh's behavior and

demeanor were troubling to him.

 

On the second to last day, I was informed by a lady participant that

Ramesh had had a mistress for a number of years (as well as other

women before that), and since the relationship had to be kept

hidden, his mistress was suffering from this abnormal and difficult

situation. I also was told that the events with women taking place

in Kovalam also took place in Ramesh's Bombay home. I could not

believe my ears. I wonder if Mrs. Balsekar and her children know

about all this, and if so, how they feel?

 

Then came the last morning. The organizer of the seminar gave a long

speech to us from the platform. He went on for about twenty minutes

before Ramesh arrived. The organizer appeared visibly troubled and

ill at ease. He said, " I have known Ramesh for twenty-five years.

Each one of us has his faults and his qualities... Even if Ramesh

has some faults, I am ever grateful to him. For me this seminar is

important... " Then, he traced back his history with Ramesh.

 

I and some of the participants looked at each other. We felt we knew

what was troubling him, (the news about Ramesh and women). But we

were far from imagining what was about to happen, of which we were

all going to be witnesses.

 

At the very beginning of the satsang, a woman, who was about fifty

years old, and who had known him for a long time, spoke to Ramesh in

tears, saying, " Why? Why do you do this... with your teaching...? "

She was distraught and at a loss, apparently torn between a teaching

which she considered to be essential, and a series of facts which

she was now discovering.

 

Then the young western doctor asked Ramesh, " Do you have a mistress? "

 

Ramesh responded, " No, no. " At that point Ramesh was lying.

 

He went on to then say, " Each event is just a 'happening', a part of

the body-mind mechanism's programming, and the guru is not

affected... "

 

Ramesh then pulled out a paper which had been placed next to him,

and read a letter of apology which he had prepared beforehand, " If I

have hurt you I apologize... But all this is only a happening, and

it does not concern me... "

 

I observed the German organizer at the back of the room, who seemed

very uneasy. It seemed to me that he had known about it all, and for

a long time.

 

In the end, it appeared to me that Ramesh simply did not give a damn

about the hurt he had caused. He said, " You have created the

problem. Now solve it... you have been asking me for hugs and

whatever happened afterwards is your fault... I have nothing to do

with it... It is you who are creating the problem. "

 

The young American woman, who had appeared unhappy and withdrawn on

the previous days, and whose emotional condition I now surmised was

probably the result of Ramesh's sexual advances, stood up and

addressed herself to him by reading a quote from Shakespeare. Ramesh

responded by saying that he had never read anything of Shakespeare.

 

She then asked him several times: " Do you plan to stop behaving in

this criminal way? " She spoke quite forcefully. (Oddly enough, some

of the participants said later during the meal that she should not

have spoken out.).

 

This appeared to be a very difficult moment for Ramesh, as this

young woman had been very determined in her manner of speech.

 

Then another woman of German origin, (but living in the US), stood

up and expressed her indignation by telling him how much she had

trusted him, saying that Ramesh was going to have to face others, as

well as those who still trusted him, and those who did not trust him

any longer, including some men.

 

An old time disciple, whose name is Elka, tried to defend Ramesh,

but she was not very convincing considering what had just been said

and heard.

 

I was struck by the way people looked at the end of the seminar, by

the way that 'denial' seemed to play its part as a protective

mechanism against anguish and anxiety, and by the emotional shock

which the poor participants seemed to be in, not knowing what they

should do or think.

 

For my part, I left the seminar with a feeling of disgust, as well

as a feeling of compassion for all those who undoubtedly would be

suffering from such a strange experience. What shocked me the most

at the end, was to see that what had just been undeniably heard, was

already being 'denied' by some of the participants.

 

I have written all of this from memory, and I regret not having had

the presence of mind to write down or record what I heard as it was

happening. I know that some of the participants did so, and I would

encourage them to share with others their direct recording of the

events which took place.

 

I would also advise everyone to practice viveka (discrimination) in

considering the events which occurred, and in considering the worth

of Ramesh Balsekar as a spiritual teacher in the light of such

events.

 

I am in full agreement with Timothy Conway's two essays below (after

the message from Wayne Liquorman). They show an evident erudition

guided by an authentic understanding of the paths to realization,

one of which is Advaita Vedanta.

 

Nirodhânanda

March 25th, 2005

[Guest Guest]

Wow.. somebody is clearly not a fan of Ramesh. Not sure what I'm supposed to have learnt from reading that... Ramesh's books and talks cost money. People often cried in the talks. Not everyone found the talks easy and enjoyable. And there were rumours that in his late 80s, he was still sexually active! Well thanks for sharing, whoever you are.

 

As a fan of Ramesh, I've no clue or care how accurate the allegations of sexual adventures are (impressive as they may have been at his age)! Whether they are true or not, makes no difference to his teaching. To my knowledge, he's NEVER said that an authentic teacher will or won't behave in a certain way. On the contrary, one of his most basic concepts was that everyone behaves the way they're constructed to behave by cosmic forces etc. But I guess the above writer was constructed to see things differently, so...

[Guest Guest]

Does anyone see the courage Ramesh had in reading out a letter of apology? I know of another Guru in the line of Kripalvananda who had a similar event in his life, he took years to own up to it. Ramesh did it on the spot. This is a case of level confusion, the body-mind is not enlightened, the Self is transcendent and functions through the body-mind, according to its proclivities. I too feel for those who suffered, I have actually been through the same, although I turned down the advances. The Guru it happened with in my own case, is my Guru as on our first meeting the Self was revealed. However I never took to his teachings and found Ramesh, years after the awakening to be the first to say "all action is spontaneous" which had already been revealed. The point is to stop putting Guru's as persons on the pedestal, the Guru function is happening through that apparent person. The personality is not an entity with volition. Due to the nature of the manifest, good and bad, light and dark co-exist within each personality. I knew Ramesh was with a certain girl in Mumbai, it was clear, no one told me but Ramesh was jealous of my friendship with her. So what? If you want to meet a saint, go find a saint, if you want to know the Absolute, find a sage, they are not the same. There is no such thing as an enlightened person. I do hope an pray that those who suffered will find the peace in their hearts that is beyond time and space!

[Guest Fabio]

Dear all

 

I had the chance to be with sathya sai baba and ramesh balsekar since 1991 but It seems the experience of this "eastern body mind instrument" was meant to be different since I have only greatfullness for both of them.

Be aware of what advaita means and the topic in question will be immediately clarified. "There is not an individual doer, there is the illusion of a doer, there is only one will...God's will" If you have understood these basic concepts there is no place to question or criticize, then if the concepts are just part of the intellect, the question arises since there is a feeling of someone who disagrees with what is seeing, forgetting there is nothing to agree or disagree.

 

Neti Neti, Om Sai Ram

[tensriram]

Do not say Ävoid Reading....: 

I would say read with discrimination and do not trust all that is in print

 

There are few enlightened Advaita teachers around and many commercial teachers

keep away from the commercial teachers

 

Read the works  original masters and

not the second generation works based on  an individuals coprehension or interpretation or, revised updates , etc

The originals works  are difficult to comprehend, search an good teacher, who is more your friend than a GURU

Reading alone does not give the full comprehension of Advaita a personal guide is a must