Exception to Upapada (UL) Position - Addendum

[Guest guest]

Dear Margarita and List Members,

 

I

just remembered what I forgot…In a hurry (as ususal), I neglected to give to

you the ONE exceptional ruling to

finding the UL or Al (Arudha Lagna) in any given chart…Sorry…L…So here it is:

 

If

you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with as being the AL or

UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from that sign as

being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those

signs (1st or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead,

you would then count from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign

from THERE, to arrive at the correct Al or UL.

 

1st

House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my previous example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the

12th, Venus, was posited in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign

from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs away) and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to

arrive at UL, we would still be back in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL.

We would then count 10 signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give

us an UL placement in Aquarius.

 

7th

House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same chart) and the 12th

lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius, and the 10th

from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from the original

starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we would then count to

the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and

arrive at Leo for the UL.

 

 

~Namaste~

Sandy

http://www.jupitersweb.com/

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much Sandy for the clarification

Margarita

 

Sandy Crowther [sandy]Sunday, October 21, 2001 9:03 PMAstrologyandtimingevents (AT) (DOT) Com Exception to Upapada (UL) Position - Addendum

 

Dear Margarita and List Members,

 

I just remembered what I forgot…In a hurry (as ususal), I neglected to give to you the ONE exceptional ruling to finding the UL or Al (Arudha Lagna) in any given chart…Sorry…L…So here it is:

 

If you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with as being the AL or UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from that sign as being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those signs (1st or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead, you would then count from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign from THERE, to arrive at the correct Al or UL.

 

1st House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my previous example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the 12th, Venus, was posited in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs away) and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to arrive at UL, we would still be back in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL. We would then count 10 signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give us an UL placement in Aquarius.

 

7th House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same chart) and the 12th lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius, and the 10th from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from the original starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we would then count to the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and arrive at Leo for the UL.

 

 

~Namaste~

Sandy

http://www.jupitersweb.com/

 

 

[Guest guest]

Namaste Sandy and list

 

this 'exception' you mentioned isn't followed by everyone - to be honest

can't say whether the majority follow this view or not - perhaps 'best' to

keep it in mind and 'play' with 'both' offerings and see what gives 'better'

results.

 

My personal thoughts at the moment for what they are worth (?) would be to

ignore this exception.

 

Best wishes as ever ......

 

Jai Sita Ram

 

Ram

 

>

> Sandy Crowther [sMTP:sandy]

> Sunday, October 21, 2001 8:03 PM

> Astrologyandtimingevents (AT) (DOT) Com

> Exception to Upapada (UL)

> Position - Addendum

>

> Dear Margarita and List Members,

>

> I just remembered what I forgot...In a hurry (as ususal), I neglected to

> give to you the ONE exceptional ruling to finding the UL or Al (Arudha

> Lagna) in any given chart...Sorry...:-(...So here it is:

>

> If you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with as being

> the AL or UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from that

> sign as being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those signs (1st

> or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead, you would then count

> from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign from THERE, to arrive at

> the correct Al or UL.

>

> 1st House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my previous

> example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the 12th, Venus, was posited

> in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs away)

> and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to arrive at UL, we would still be back

> in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL. We would then count 10

> signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give us an UL placement

> in Aquarius.

>

> 7th House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same chart) and

> the 12th lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius, and the

> 10th from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from the

> original starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we would

> then count to the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and arrive at

> Leo for the UL.

>

> Sandy

>

 

 

This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received

it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose

the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of

this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the

BBC, unless specifically stated.

[Guest guest]

Dear Ram,

 

Agreed…I

always assess both, and I’m not sure of what the majority do either, but I don’t

completely ignore this exception as it does seems to have relevance in many

situations. So it is a good idea to consider both, as you suggested, and then

to come to one’s own conclusion.

 

Another “exception”

is that some also use both Saturn and Rahu for Aquarius, and Mars and Ketu for

Scorpio…And the stronger of the two becomes the planet for making the

determination. I tend to use this theory much less than the ‘exception’ ruling

above, simply because I don’t believe we can that easily dismiss the ‘natural’

rulers of Aquarius and Scorpio…although, again, I do look at both.

 

~Namaste~

Sandy

http://www.jupitersweb.com/

 

Namaste Sandy and list

 

this 'exception' you mentioned isn't followed by everyone - to be honest

can't say whether the majority follow this view or not - perhaps 'best' to

keep it in mind and 'play' with 'both' offerings and see what gives

'better'

results.

 

My personal thoughts at the moment for what they are worth (?) would be to

ignore this exception.

 

Best wishes as ever ......

 

Jai Sita Ram

 

Ram

 

>

> Sandy Crowther

[sMTP:sandy]

> Sunday, October 21, 2001 8:03 PM

>

Astrologyandtimingevents (AT) (DOT) Com

>

Exception to Upapada (UL)

> Position - Addendum

>

> Dear Margarita and List Members,

>

> I just remembered what I forgot...In a hurry (as ususal), I neglected

to

> give to you the ONE exceptional ruling to finding the UL or Al (Arudha

> Lagna) in any given chart...Sorry...:-(...So here it is:

>

> If you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with as

being

> the AL or UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from that

> sign as being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those signs

(1st

> or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead, you would then

count

> from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign from THERE, to arrive

at

> the correct Al or UL.

>

> 1st House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my previous

> example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the 12th, Venus, was

posited

> in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs

away)

> and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to arrive at UL, we would still be

back

> in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL. We would then count

10

> signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give us an UL

placement

> in Aquarius.

>

> 7th House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same chart)

and

> the 12th lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius, and

the

> 10th from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from the

> original starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we

would

> then count to the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and arrive

at

> Leo for the UL.

>

> Sandy

>

 

 

This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received

it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose

the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of

this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the

BBC, unless specifically stated.

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Namaste Sandy

 

Re: Saturn/Rahu and Mars/Ketu certainly as far as Jaimini scholars are

concerned there is No controversy in this matter - both sets are termed as

'natural' rulers for the signs you mentioned. The 'strength' is generally

used to determine the 'dasa' years applicable to Sco and Aqu Rasi's and Not

necessarily to determine 'sole' rulership - hence continuing to use Sat and

Mars shouldn't be an issue(?) though again wouldn't rule out Rahu and Ketu

especially should they 'Rasi' aspect Aqu/Sco.

 

Certainly would be interested to see where you have found the Arudra

'exception' to be working(?).

 

Best wishes as ever .....

 

Jai Sita Ram

 

Ram

 

>

> Sandy Crowther [sMTP:sandy]

> Monday, October 22, 2001 4:13 PM

>

> RE: Exception to Upapada (UL)

> Position - Addendum

>

> Dear Ram,

>

> Agreed...I always assess both, and I'm not sure of what the majority do

> either, but I don't completely ignore this exception as it does seems to

> have relevance in many situations. So it is a good idea to consider both,

> as you suggested, and then to come to one's own conclusion.

>

> Another " exception " is that some also use both Saturn and Rahu for

> Aquarius, and Mars and Ketu for Scorpio...And the stronger of the two

> becomes the planet for making the determination. I tend to use this theory

> much less than the 'exception' ruling above, simply because I don't

> believe we can that easily dismiss the 'natural' rulers of Aquarius and

> Scorpio...although, again, I do look at both.

>

> ~Namaste~

> Sandy

> <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

>

> Namaste Sandy and list

>

> this 'exception' you mentioned isn't followed by everyone - to be honest

> can't say whether the majority follow this view or not - perhaps 'best' to

> keep it in mind and 'play' with 'both' offerings and see what gives

> 'better'

> results.

>

> My personal thoughts at the moment for what they are worth (?) would be to

> ignore this exception.

>

> Best wishes as ever ......

>

> Jai Sita Ram

>

> Ram

>

> >

> > Sandy Crowther [sMTP:sandy]

> > Sunday, October 21, 2001 8:03 PM

> > Astrologyandtimingevents (AT) (DOT) Com

> > Exception to Upapada (UL)

> > Position - Addendum

> >

> > Dear Margarita and List Members,

> >

> > I just remembered what I forgot...In a hurry (as ususal), I neglected to

> > give to you the ONE exceptional ruling to finding the UL or Al (Arudha

> > Lagna) in any given chart...Sorry...:-(...So here it is:

> >

> > If you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with as being

> > the AL or UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from that

> > sign as being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those signs (1st

> > or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead, you would then count

> > from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign from THERE, to arrive at

> > the correct Al or UL.

> >

> > 1st House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my previous

> > example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the 12th, Venus, was

> posited

> > in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs away)

> > and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to arrive at UL, we would still be

> back

> > in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL. We would then count 10

> > signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give us an UL

> placement

> > in Aquarius.

> >

> > 7th House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same chart) and

> > the 12th lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius, and the

> > 10th from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from the

> > original starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we would

> > then count to the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and arrive at

> > Leo for the UL.

> >

> > Sandy

> >

>

>

> This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received

> it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose

> the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of

> this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the

> BBC, unless specifically stated.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Ram,

 

My intent

was not to argue the matter, but to simple share some of the principles in

determining AL or UL as I understand them…nothing more. If you have differing

views, please feel free to present them to the list.

 

As far as

examples, while I do not have the time to go through my files, one that very

quickly comes to mind where the exception works very well is my own UL.

 

~Namaste~

Sandy

http://www.jupitersweb.com/

 

Namaste Sandy

 

Re: Saturn/Rahu and Mars/Ketu certainly as far as Jaimini scholars are

concerned there is No controversy in this matter - both sets are termed as

'natural' rulers for the signs you mentioned. The 'strength' is generally

used to determine the 'dasa' years applicable to Sco and Aqu Rasi's and Not

necessarily to determine 'sole' rulership - hence continuing to use Sat and

Mars shouldn't be an issue(?) though again wouldn't rule out Rahu and Ketu

especially should they 'Rasi' aspect Aqu/Sco.

 

Certainly would be interested to see where you have found the Arudra

'exception' to be working(?).

 

Best wishes as ever .....

 

Jai Sita Ram

 

Ram

 

>

> Sandy Crowther

[sMTP:sandy]

> Monday, October 22, 2001 4:13 PM

>

 

> RE:

Exception to Upapada (UL)

> Position - Addendum

>

> Dear Ram,

>

> Agreed...I always assess both, and I'm not sure of what the majority

do

> either, but I don't completely ignore this exception as it does seems

to

> have relevance in many situations. So it is a good idea to consider

both,

> as you suggested, and then to come to one's own conclusion.

>

> Another " exception " is that some also use both Saturn and

Rahu for

> Aquarius, and Mars and Ketu for Scorpio...And the stronger of the two

> becomes the planet for making the determination. I tend to use this

theory

> much less than the 'exception' ruling above, simply because I don't

> believe we can that easily dismiss the 'natural' rulers of Aquarius

and

> Scorpio...although, again, I do look at both.

>

> ~Namaste~

> Sandy

> <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

>

> Namaste Sandy and list

>

> this 'exception' you mentioned isn't followed by everyone - to be

honest

> can't say whether the majority follow this view or not - perhaps

'best' to

> keep it in mind and 'play' with 'both' offerings and see what gives

> 'better'

> results.

>

> My personal thoughts at the moment for what they are worth (?) would

be to

> ignore this exception.

>

> Best wishes as ever ......

>

> Jai Sita Ram

>

> Ram

>

> >

> > Sandy Crowther

[sMTP:sandy]

> > Sunday, October 21, 2001 8:03

PM

> >

Astrologyandtimingevents (AT) (DOT) Com

> >

Exception to Upapada (UL)

> > Position - Addendum

> >

> > Dear Margarita and List Members,

> >

> > I just remembered what I forgot...In a hurry (as ususal), I

neglected to

> > give to you the ONE exceptional ruling to finding the UL or Al

(Arudha

> > Lagna) in any given chart...Sorry...:-(...So here it is:

> >

> > If you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with

as being

> > the AL or UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from

that

> > sign as being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those

signs (1st

> > or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead, you would

then count

> > from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign from THERE, to

arrive at

> > the correct Al or UL.

> >

> > 1st House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my

previous

> > example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the 12th, Venus, was

> posited

> > in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs

away)

> > and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to arrive at UL, we would still

be

> back

> > in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL. We would then

count 10

> > signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give us an UL

> placement

> > in Aquarius.

> >

> > 7th House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same

chart) and

> > the 12th lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius,

and the

> > 10th from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from

the

> > original starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we

would

> > then count to the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and

arrive at

> > Leo for the UL.

> >

> > Sandy

> >

>

>

> This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received

> it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose

> the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of

> this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the

> BBC, unless specifically stated.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear List and Ram,

 

Looking over my Arudha notes, I neglected, (as usual L) to reference my source. So upon looking further, I

realized that my findings, as I shared them with Margarita and this list, are

based strictly on the teachings of Maharshi Parasara’s – out of the book BPHS, translated

by R. Santhanam, Ranjan Publications:

 

Chapter 29, Bhava Padas.

 

1-3. Method of Pada Calculations: An

example is given for Scorpio lagna, and no consideration is given to Ketu’s

involvement, strictly Mars as lord of Scorpio. There is no mention of Saturn

for Aquarius or Mars for Scorpio that I can find in the chapter. He writes:

 

“Scorpio is the ascendant and its lord Mars is 9 signs away from the

ascendant and is in Cancer. Hence we count 9 signs from Cancer and get Pisces.

Pisces is thus the Arudha or Pada of the Ascendant.”

 

Also, in Chapter 29:

 

4-5. Special Exceptions: He

clearly states the exceptions I listed earlier, when he states:

 

“The same house or the 7th

from it does not become its Pada. When the Pada falls in the same house, the 10th

therefrom be treated as its Pada. Similiarly when the 7th becomes

the Pada of a house, the 4th from the original house in question be

treated as its pada.”

 

 

~Namaste~

Sandy

http://www.jupitersweb.com/

 

Dear Ram,

 

My intent was not to argue the matter, but to simple

share some of the principles in determining AL or UL as I understand

them…nothing more. If you have differing views, please feel free to present

them to the list.

 

As far as examples, while I do not have the time to

go through my files, one that very quickly comes to mind where the exception

works very well is my own UL.

 

~Namaste~

Sandy

http://www.jupitersweb.com/

 

Namaste Sandy

 

Re: Saturn/Rahu and Mars/Ketu certainly as far as Jaimini scholars are

concerned there is No controversy in this matter - both sets are termed as

'natural' rulers for the signs you mentioned. The 'strength' is generally

used to determine the 'dasa' years applicable to Sco and Aqu Rasi's and Not

necessarily to determine 'sole' rulership - hence continuing to use Sat and

Mars shouldn't be an issue(?) though again wouldn't rule out Rahu and Ketu

especially should they 'Rasi' aspect Aqu/Sco.

 

Certainly would be interested to see where you have found the Arudra

'exception' to be working(?).

 

Best wishes as ever .....

 

Jai Sita Ram

 

Ram

 

>

> Sandy Crowther

[sMTP:sandy]

> Monday, October 22, 2001 4:13 PM

>

 

> RE:

Exception to Upapada (UL)

> Position - Addendum

>

> Dear Ram,

>

> Agreed...I always assess both, and I'm not sure of what the majority

do

> either, but I don't completely ignore this exception as it does seems

to

> have relevance in many situations. So it is a good idea to consider

both,

> as you suggested, and then to come to one's own conclusion.

>

> Another " exception " is that some also use both Saturn and

Rahu for

> Aquarius, and Mars and Ketu for Scorpio...And the stronger of the two

> becomes the planet for making the determination. I tend to use this

theory

> much less than the 'exception' ruling above, simply because I don't

> believe we can that easily dismiss the 'natural' rulers of Aquarius

and

> Scorpio...although, again, I do look at both.

>

> ~Namaste~

> Sandy

> <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

>

> Namaste Sandy and list

>

> this 'exception' you mentioned isn't followed by everyone - to be

honest

> can't say whether the majority follow this view or not - perhaps

'best' to

> keep it in mind and 'play' with 'both' offerings and see what gives

> 'better'

> results.

>

> My personal thoughts at the moment for what they are worth (?) would

be to

> ignore this exception.

>

> Best wishes as ever ......

>

> Jai Sita Ram

>

> Ram

>

> >

> > Sandy Crowther

[sMTP:sandy]

> > Sunday, October 21, 2001 8:03

PM

> >

Astrologyandtimingevents (AT) (DOT) Com

> >

Exception to Upapada (UL)

> > Position - Addendum

> >

> > Dear Margarita and List Members,

> >

> > I just remembered what I forgot...In a hurry (as ususal), I

neglected to

> > give to you the ONE exceptional ruling to finding the UL or Al

(Arudha

> > Lagna) in any given chart...Sorry...:-(...So here it is:

> >

> > If you ever arrive at either the SAME sign you started out with

as being

> > the AL or UL, OR your calculations bring you to the 7th sign from

that

> > sign as being the Al or UL, you would NOT use either of those

signs (1st

> > or 7th) as a determinant for the Al or UL. Instead, you would

then count

> > from the sign you arrived at, to the 10th sign from THERE, to

arrive at

> > the correct Al or UL.

> >

> > 1st House Example: If the chart had Gemini rising like in my

previous

> > example, (Divorce Chart # 1) and the lord of the 12th, Venus, was

> posited

> > in Taurus (OR in the 7th sign from Taurus, Scorpio - 1 or 7 signs

away)

> > and then we counted 1 sign (or 7) to arrive at UL, we would still

be

> back

> > in Taurus, so we would NOT use Taurus as the UL. We would then

count 10

> > signs from Taurus to arrive at the UL, which would give us an UL

> placement

> > in Aquarius.

> >

> > 7th House Example: Or if we had Gemini rising (using the same

chart) and

> > the 12th lord, Venus, fell in the 10th from Taurus in Aquarius,

and the

> > 10th from Aquarius brought us to Scorpio, (which is the 7th from

the

> > original starting place, Taurus, and therefore cannot be used) we

would

> > then count to the 10th from Scorpio, our last destination, and

arrive at

> > Leo for the UL.

> >

> > Sandy

> >

>

>

> This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received

> it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose

> the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of

> this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the

> BBC, unless specifically stated.

>

>

>

>

>