Dasosmi

Jai Sadhu!! Your words are like nectar.

Very inspiring Prabhuji!! Yamunacharya has a similar saying: yadavadhi mama cetah krsna-padaravinde nava-nava-rasa-dhamanudyata rantum asit tadavadhi bata nari-sangame smaryamane bhavati mukha-vikarah sustu nisthivanam ca "Ever since I have been in the transcendental loving service of Krishna, realizing ever new pleasure in Him, whenever I think of sex pleasure, I spit at the thought and my lips curl with distaste."

Hare Krishna. This is indeed very fascinating. It's almost addicting. I feel like I HAVE to write back. Perhaps it's my false ego or maybe I enjoy a friendly conversation. I believe what Krishna says: yam imam puspitam vacam pravadanty avipascitah veda-vada-ratah partha nanyad astiti vadinah kamatmanah svarga-para janma-karma-phala-pradam kriya-visesa-bahulam bhogaisvarya-gatim prati TRANSLATION Men of small knowledge are very much attached to the flowery words of the Vedas, which recommend various fruitive activities for elevation to heavenly planets, resultant good birth, power, and so forth. Being desirous of sense gratification and opulent life, they say that there is nothing more than this. It seems like we hit a dead end on this point. I believe: trai-gunya-visaya veda nistrai-gunyo bhavarjuna nirdvandvo nitya-sattva-stho niryoga-ksema atmavan Translation The Vedas deal mainly with the subject of the three modes of material nature. O Arjuna, become transcendental to these three modes. Be free from all dualities and from all anxieties for gain and safety, and be established in the self. This is again based on our different perspectives. I would quote you the same verses I already quated to defend the same points I have already tried to defend for the same point you have already made. Goal of Bhakti is to serve the Supreme Lord. How can that be compared to mayavad philosophy? If you look at actions of those who attain the goal of Bhakti and the actions of Mayavadis who attain their goal, you will notice a vast difference. Thus this example is not applicable. India "mainly" contains Indians. That means there are also others that are there. What's the difficulty in understanding that? Since we have a disagreement on the following verse, your statement above can not be applicable in this situation. It is like saying exactly what Krishna says: trai-gunya-visaya veda nistrai-gunyo bhavarjuna nirdvandvo nitya-sattva-stho niryoga-ksema atmavan Translation The Vedas deal mainly with the subject of the three modes of material nature. O Arjuna, become transcendental to these three modes. Be free from all dualities and from all anxieties for gain and safety, and be established in the self. As far as my little brain allows me to understand, I have read the verse quoted above and accepted its translation as it is. Kindly quote refrences from Sri Madvacharyas point of view since you have understood his point of view.

Hare Krishna, Jahnava Nitai Prabhuji is highly qualified to answers your questions. Some thoughts crossed my mind reading your statements so I decided to share them. Please forgive any errors. The conclusion and the entire contents are not always 100% the same. Vedas knowing Krishna and the reader of the Vedas understanding Krishna are 2 different things. Do we understand the Vedas 100%? Krishna can not be known by anything except His own desire to be known to the individual. Therefore not only is he the greatest but he is also the smallest because simply based on our sincerity, he will reveal himself to us no matter how smart or dumb we may be. ye yatha mam prapadyante tams tathaiva bhajamy aham tesam satata-yuktanam bhajatam priti-purvakam dadami buddhi-yogam tam yena mam upayanti te Vedas certainly contain plenty of pages on activities in different modes. It would be sastra-ninda if anyone is denying the authority of Vedas. The point is simple. Once you achieve Krishna, then you become indifferent to the Vedas because you have reached the goal. If you reach your destination, the address you scribbled down would be of no use or harm to you. Although you may choose to hold on to it. Realised souls may act on the level ordinary people can relate to. The Vedas deal "MAINLY" with the 3 modes. Yes they contain plenty of mantras to worship Vishnu. The conclusion and the entire contents of Vedas are not 100% the same. As you have smartly pointed out:"Because in the Vedas it is often misunderstood that attainment of heavenly pleasures is the goal, people are often not aware of the actual, hidden, or esoteric meaning which deals with Vishnu." So therefore, let us not get caught up in confusion and accept the essenes..Bhagavad Gita, which clearly tells us to surrender to Krishna. sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja Sripad Sankacharya says: sarvo panishado gavo dogdha gopala nandanah partho vatsah sudhir bhokta dugdham gita amritam mahat (Gita-mahatmya 6) (6) All the Upanishads are the cows, the one who milks the cows is Krishna, Arjuna (Partha) is the calf. Men of purified intellect are the enjoyers; the milk is the great nectar of the Gita.The only scripture is the song of the son of Devaki. The only deity is the son of Devaki. The only mantra is His Names. The only action is the service of That Deity. ekam sastram devaki-putra-gitam eko devo devaki-putra eva eko mantras tasya namani yani karmapy ekam tasya devasya seva In this present day, people are very much eager to have one scripture, one God, one religion, and one occupation. Therefore, ekam sastram devaki-putra-gitam: let there be one scripture only, one common scripture for the whole world--Bhagavad-gita. Eko devo devaki-putra eva: let there be one God for the whole world--Sri Krsna. Eko mantras tasya namani: and one hymn, one mantra, one prayer--the chanting of His name

Hare Krishna. It is indeed so sad to see mother cows being mistreated so much. It is even sadder to think that we are supporting such industry. I am sure you have all heard of this argument..what about when you buy milk and offer it to Krishna. Are the cows not getting some punya by having their milk offered to the Lord?

The translations quoted are from Bhagavad gita as it is. The verse above is text number 52.Krishna started convertation on this topic starting at text 39 where he says "Thus far I have declared to you the analytical knowledge of sankhya philosophy. Now listen to the knowledge of yoga whereby one works without fruitive result. O son of Prtha, when you act by such intelligence, you can free yourself from the bondage of works." He goes on talking on this topic and on verses 42-43 he says "Men of small knowledge are very much attached to the flowery words of the Vedas, which recommend various fruitive activities for elevation to heavenly planets, resultant good birth, power, and so forth. Being desirous of sense gratification and opulent life, they say that there is nothing more than this." On verse 45 and 46 he says "The Vedas mainly deal with the subject of the three modes of material nature. Rise above these modes, O Arjuna. Be transcendental to all of them. Be free from all dualities and from all anxieties for gain and safety, and be established in the Self. All purposes that are served by the small pond can at once be served by the great reservoirs of water. Similarly, all the purposes of the Vedas can be served to one who knows the purpose behind them." On verse 49 he says "O Dhananjaya, rid yourself of all fruitive activities by devotional service, and surrender fully to that consciousness. Those who want to enjoy the fruits of their work are misers." Then on verse 52, the verse on current discussion he says "When your intelligence has passed out of the dense forest of delusion, you shall become indifferent to all that has been heard and all that is to be heard." It seems obvious that this verse is referring to being indifferent to the vedas that deal mainly with 3 modes of material nature by knowing who is to be known by them. It's like saying, Tom is a good person. He is also very short. Now if someone simply quotes the sentence saying he is short, then yes, there's no Tom in that sentence. But if one looks at the sentence before that, its very obvious who its referring to.

Dear Sambya, (we are way off the topic from the original post). I agree bhava-artha or the inner meaning should be the focus of our journey back home. Let us not then get carried away and blame a certain institution for producing few contradictory points while it creates wonderful opportunities for many many souls to take shelter of the Lord. It is very clear what ISKCON's intentions are. So let's look at the intention of this wonderful society rather than pouring salt on the few scratches it has. With all due respect, I would like to make a humble suggestion. I agree with your point of view on many subject matters regarding our scriptures. I would like to beg you to kindly stop talking about "ISKCON" as a whole based on certain actions or words of its selected few members. If we have an issue with a certain person, it is better we address it to that individual rather than blaming the entire society. Few spots on the moon does not prevent it from spreading its rays. Lord Jagannaths glories are being heard in so many corners of the world. Is this not a reason to rejoice? ISKCON is one and its members are many. Blaming the society blames all its members. The ideal leader of ISKCON is non other than His Divine Grace A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada. You have already come to two conclusions (1) Bhava artha (2) Prabhupadas clear intentions. Let's reap the fruits of those to conclusions. Hare Krishna.

If you accept other religious teachings as scriptures, then there is a great deal of explanation regarding this issue taught by the Mormons. For your convenience, I found a quote that may enlighten your understanding on this matter. Mormon website: "To the Mormon, salvation means resurrection from the dead. To the Mormon, eternal life means exaltation after the resurrection. It is the goal of the Mormon to obtain exaltation, because everyone ever born into the world will be resurrected, but according to Mormon belief, only the select Mormon believers will be exalted. Even among Mormon believers, most will be exalted, but only a few will actually attain to the ultimate, that of becoming a god and ruling over their own planet". It is further explained that Jesus too rules a planet of his own. Our Srila Prabhupada was preaching to people from all sorts of backgrounds and thus he quoted many references from different sources with the aim of spreading love of god. I am not implying that he quoted Mormon philosophy (maybe he did) but the point is there are lots of refrences on this matter. From vedic point of view we can easily accept the possibility by looking at many examples of great devotees that have achived and rule planets of their own. Hare Krishna.

Thank you very much to all of you wonderful devotees for your kind reply.

Hare Krishna. Please accept my obeisances. All glories to Guru and Gauranga. You are certainly very senior to me both by birth and also by education. You seem to know so much about everything. I tried hard not to reply to your post but I felt I had to. I do not think ISKCON is a failure at all. I know its one of the most successful societies ever made. Perhaps you are so far ahead in spiritual life that you can't appreciate the little things ISKCON centers around the world help with for some beginners like myself. I am sure you have valid reasons for your conclusions. It would be nicer if you shared them with people in private because this forum is open to the general public. Certainly every fruit bearing tree has some rotten fruits but I would not go as far to chop down the entire tree. Perhaps it is for selfish reasons I ask you not to post such negative thoughts about ISKCON. I am here to learn and grow in spiritual life and the aim of this forum seems to be just for that reason. I do not think such negative comments will encourage us to talk open heartedly and teach us to love one another as spiritual brothers and sisters rather than Indian and American. Please accept my humble obeisances and forgive me if I made any mistakes in my assumption.

Hare Krishna. This question may be more suitable for those who were introduced to KC via ISKCON and those currently involved with ISKCON. I had approched a senior devotee with this question once but he did not get back to me. I am in a very confused stage of my life rite now. I was fortunate enough to have the privilege to attend Vrindavan Gurukula since a very young age. Thus I am eternally indebted to Srila Prabhupada for his causeless mercy. I am now at a point in life where I feel that I should take initiation to be formally connected to the Guru Parampara. Having been brought up in ISKCON I strongly feel that I should stay within the house of Prabhupada and be initiated under his authority. Or is this my ignorance? Am I committing an offense by having such thoughts? After all Krishna is specially dear to so many Gaudiya devotees and there are plenty of sources that are linked to the Parampara system. My dilemma has been further troubled after I saw the RITVIK debate video. I would really appriciate any sincere answers to help me.

Predicted in Brahma-vaivarta Purana 4.129.*. The fourth part of the Brahma-vaivarta is called Krsna-janma-khanda. Chapter 129 is called Golokarohanam, because it describes how Krsna returns to His abode. The general dialogue is between Lord Narayana and Narada Muni. This specific dialogue is between Lord Krsna and Mother Ganga. Verse 49 is a question by Ganga, verses 50-60 are Krsna's answer. Text 49: bhaagiirathy uvaaca he naatha ramaNaSreStha yaasi golokamuttamam asmaakaM kaa gatiScaatra bhaviSyati kalau yuge "Ganges said: O protector, Supreme enjoyer, on your departure for the perfect abode, Goloka, thereafter what will be my situation in the age of Kali?" Text 50 Srii-bhagavaan uvaaca kaleH paMcasahasraaNi varSaaNi tiSTha bhu-tale paapaani paapino yaani tubhyaM daasyaMti snaanataH "The Supreme Personality of Godhead said: On the earth 5,000 years of Kali will be sinful and sinners will deposit their sins in you by bathing." Text 51 man-maMtropaasakasparSaad bhasmibhutaani tatkSaNaat bhaviSyaMti darSanaacca snaanaadeva hi jaahnavi "Thereafter by the sight and touch of those who worship Me by My mantra, all those sins will be burnt." Text 52 harernaamaani yatraiva puraaNaani bhavaMti hi tatra gatvaa saavadhaanam aabhiH saarddhaM ca SroSyasi "There will be chanting of the name of Hari and reading of the [bhagavata] Purana. Reaching such a place, attentively hear. [note: In Puranic language, when "Purana" is used alone it refers to Bhagavata Purana. Otherwise it will specify Skanda Purana, Visnu Purana, etc.] Text 53: puraaNa SravaNaaccaiva harernaamaanukiirtanaat bhasmibhutaani paapaani brahma-hatyaadikaani ca "Sinful reactions including the killing of a brahmana can be nullified be hearing the Purana and chanting of the names of Hari in the manner of devotees." Text 54: bhasmibhutaani taanyeva vaiSNavaaliMganena ca tRNaani SuSkakaaSthaani dahaMti paavako yathaa "Just as dry grass is burnt by fire, by the embrace of Vaisnavas all sins are burnt." Text 55: tathaapi vaiSNavaa loke paapaani paapinaamapi pRthivyaaM yaani tiirthaani puNyaanyapi ca jaahnavi "O Ganges, the whole planet will become a pilgrimage sight by the presence of Vaisnavas, even though it had been sinful" Text 56: madbhaktaanaaM SariireSu santi puteSu saMtatam madbhaktapaadarajasaa sadyaH putaa vasundharaa "In the body of My devotees remains eternally [the purifier]. Mother Earth becomes pure by the dust of the feet of My devotees." Text 57: sadyaH putaani tiirthaani sadyaH putaM jagattathaa manmaMtropaasakaa vipraa ye maducchiSRbhojinaH "It will be the same in the case of pilgrimage sites and the whole world. Those intelligent worshipers of My mantra who partake My remnants will purify everything." Text 58 maameva nityaM dhyaayaMte te mat praaNaadhikaaH priyaaH tadupasparSamaatreNa puto vaayuSca paavakaH "They are more dear to Me than My life, who everyday meditate only on Me. The air and fire become pure simply even by their indirect touch." [Note: Sastra says that of all material elements, fire and air are always pure. Even though the air carries some impurities it always remains itself pure. This verse indicates that the Vaisnavas will purify even the pure elements of fire and air, therefore the purifying potency of the Vaisnavas referred to in this verse is not material but completely spiritual. I.e. the air and fire are _already_ materially pure, therefore the Vaisnavas purity is spiritual and not material.] Text 59: kaler daSa-sahasraaNi madbhaktaaH saMti bhu-tale ekavarNaa bhaviSyaMti madbhakteSu gateSu ca "For 10,000 years of Kali such devotees of Mine will fill the whole planet. After the departure of My devotees there will be only one varna [outcaste]." Text 60: madbhaktaSunyaa pRthivi kaligrastaa bhaviSyati etasminnaMtare tatra kRSNadehaadvinirgataH "Devoid of My devotees, the earth will be shackled by Kali. Saying this, Krsna departed."

What are the proper steps for acquiring a Guru? I read and hear how important a Guru is and how its not even possible to reach the Lord without the causeless mercy of a Guru. I also hear that a guru is revealed to you when you are ready. Perhaps I can't make correct judgement with my mental speculations but as far as my mind is concerned, I am ready. I feel that there is no use of chasing anything in this world because that's all I have been doing for so many years and I am still incomplete. I have decided to completely surrender my life to a Guru. Is it possible to go back home simply by studying from different scriptures or must one get a Guru? Please advise.