Who am I the everlasting question

[Guest guest]

I wrote this little line a long time ago, I think it could apply to this who

am I discussion.

 

'Mental concepts inhibit the clear flow of thought.'

 

Any concept or idea about yourself will stop the clear knowledge of yourself

to flow. I don't think I have direct experience of this, only a

metaphorical one .

 

Happy self inquisition

 

Steve Mclachlan

[Guest guest]

Dear Steve,

 

You wrote:

> 'Mental concepts inhibit the clear flow of thought.'

> Any concept or idea about yourself will stop the

> clear knowledge of yourself to flow.

 

Thinking is indeed a welcome thing that we humans *may* do. *Ideas* are what

we use to vizualize (Greek 'eidos') options and concepts. That is our way to

contribute to the ongoing process of creation (concept?), or to say it

differently, to the expansion to the universe (concept?). Actually, I have a

notion (idea?) that the expansion of the universe (concept?) causes us to

use our brain in that conceptualizing, creative, imaginative,

option-forming, option-weighing way.

 

Space abhors a vacuum,

Knowing abhores non-thinking. (Huh?)

 

Now, that is a different way of looking at 'thought' in this 'no mind' world

of meditation! :-)

So what is the problem? Freeze-drying our playful concept-driven conclusions

into a replicas of truth, 'cold truths'! That is the problem!

'Fundamentalizing' them by casting them into stone (blocks of ice really)

and thereby controlling other people's freedom in our world, causing freezer

burn. (Mixing metaphores, but what the heck!)

> I don't think I have direct experience of this,

> only a metaphorical one .

 

Just as much as many of us are learning to love our bodies and ourselves

authentically again by not basing our 'acceptance of self' on the

expectations, approval, demands and commands of an outside controlling

world, just as much *may* we learn to love our mind again. The concepts of

'no mind', 'stop thinking', 'silencing the mind', etc. are aids to

reintegrate ourselves, to reclaim our authenticity. Stopping to think (etc.)

helps us to stop the power of 'second hand' thoughts, other people's

thoughts, judgements, commands, directives, demands, expectations, as they

are so instilled into our (?) pseudo mind.

> I don't think I have direct experience of this,

> only a metaphorical one .

 

You do actually, Steve. And you know it!

Just rekindle the love for your mind by do not fighting YOUR mind, but by

fighting off the second hand contents of it, alien imprints into your mind,

other people's engraved thoughts, approvals, disapprovals, expectations,

comm....., etc.

 

"Gnoti seouton", "know thyself" (Plato) is to know yourself directly, not

through others. But you knew that. You DO have direct experience of that...

because who is reading this now?

 

Love,

Wim

[Guest guest]

 

Wim Borsboom <aurasphere

Thursday, November 09, 2000 3:14 AM

Re: Who am I the everlasting question

 

>Dear Steve,

>

>You wrote:

>> 'Mental concepts inhibit the clear flow of thought.'

>> Any concept or idea about yourself will stop the

>> clear knowledge of yourself to flow.

>

>Thinking is indeed a welcome thing that we humans *may* do. *Ideas* are

what

>we use to vizualize (Greek 'eidos') options and concepts. That is our way

to

>contribute to the ongoing process of creation (concept?), or to say it

>differently, to the expansion to the universe (concept?). Actually, I have

a

>notion (idea?) that the expansion of the universe (concept?) causes us to

>use our brain in that conceptualizing, creative, imaginative,

>option-forming, option-weighing way.

>

Well I did not mean that thinking is bad or limiting, I mean that sometimes

are ideas and preconcoived notions about things limit a clearer

understanding from coming to the surface. It is difficult to note an

example, perhaps an intuitive leap.

 

Concepts allow us to verbalise or conceptualise a series of feelings,

experienes, and notions about an object.

 

Can a concept or an idea about something ever be the complete truth about

anything big or small. Subjectively yes, but objectively I would say no.

 

sometimes to get a clear understanding, a different perspective we must let

go of all the ideas and concepts we think we have about something. Then

perhaps an intuitive leap can occur.

 

I read a problem solving technique I think it went something like when the

problem arises treat all things as if you have never seen them before.

 

This man who coined this gives this example, he was asked to help solve a

problem with an aeroplane design. It was something to do with the cockpit,

you couldn't see out of it or there was not enough room. He simply said to

put the cockpit on the underneath of the plane and it worked perfectly (i

know my story is very vague) but the point is noone had thought of this

because the concept that the cockpit in a plane goes on the top of the

planehad been for so long and so well imbedded that it was not questioned.

>Space abhors a vacuum,

>Knowing abhores non-thinking. (Huh?)

 

Don't know what you mean here, I find when I know something I don't need to

really think about it.

 

Do you mean that to know we must first think, I agree with that in part.

>Now, that is a different way of looking at 'thought' in this 'no mind'

world

>of meditation! :-)

>So what is the problem? Freeze-drying our playful concept-driven

conclusions

>into a replicas of truth, 'cold truths'! That is the problem!

>'Fundamentalizing' them by casting them into stone (blocks of ice really)

>and thereby controlling other people's freedom in our world, causing

freezer

>burn. (Mixing metaphores, but what the heck!)

 

Yes this is what I mean, concepts limiting us.

 

Do you have a problem with people who are narrow minded?

 

Freedom rights, I don't think there is a single thing you can do that

doesn't infringe on someones elses rights in some way.

 

I think by saying all this we are imposing on a persons right to be narrow

minded and stuck in their concepts and impose those narrow minded views on

others.

 

I suppose you would be hard to budge on the conclusion above.

>> I don't think I have direct experience of this,

>> only a metaphorical one .

>

>Just as much as many of us are learning to love our bodies and ourselves

>authentically again by not basing our 'acceptance of self' on the

>expectations, approval, demands and commands of an outside controlling

>world, just as much *may* we learn to love our mind again. The concepts of

>'no mind', 'stop thinking', 'silencing the mind', etc. are aids to

>reintegrate ourselves, to reclaim our authenticity. Stopping to think

(etc.)

>helps us to stop the power of 'second hand' thoughts, other people's

>thoughts, judgements, commands, directives, demands, expectations, as they

>are so instilled into our (?) pseudo mind.

>You do actually, Steve. And you know it!

>Just rekindle the love for your mind by do not fighting YOUR mind, but by

>fighting off the second hand contents of it, alien imprints into your mind,

>other people's engraved thoughts, approvals, disapprovals, expectations,

>comm....., etc.

 

Thank you... your encouragement was a real nice second hand experience.

 

I do know what you mean, what I do should be most important to me only. I

should do all that pleases me, and not care about what other people think.

I try to do this, but I think it is difficult alot of the time. If I do not

care about others judgements should they then not care about mine? If i do

not care what others think, should they care what I think? I view there

should be a balance, otherwise perhaps we could get too selfish.

 

Laws are one example of anothers approval we cannot really fight against

(well we can ), but without them things would be very difficult.

 

What I mean by balance is that we should be aware of others feeling and

emotion and how they affect us, and think about the same in reverse, but

also remeber that we are ourselves, while keeping in mind that we are not

the only person around.

 

Do you get what I mean here?

>"Gnoti seouton", "know thyself" (Plato) is to know yourself directly, not

>through others. But you knew that. You DO have direct experience of that...

>because who is reading this now?

>

>Love,

>Wim

>

My point originally is that can any concept we have about ourselves be the

whole truth about ourselves?

 

Well confusingly yours

 

Steve Mclachlan