Anthropic principle / Mark

[Guest guest]

Dear Mark,

 

I enjoy the strong version and it

totally makes sense, as stories go.

Yet, the duality of the strong version

remains as a limitation.

 

There still is assumed a separation

of universe and sentient entity.

 

"Overcoming" this dualism reveals

that a "really existing external

universe" only arises as a means

to explain an entity which "takes itself

to be a form" (to have a position)

as perception "gives itself" objects

(a universe).

 

In other words, the strong version reflects

and hides that the perceiver is the perceived,

that the observer as entity is formed

by the same "process" that an entity

"out there" seems to form.

 

In the story of time, sentient entities

must evolve, because without observation

there is no story of time.

 

Without a story of time, there can be

no such thing as a "possible universe appearing" --

for where would it appear and how?

 

If we get beyond the story of time, which is

the story of a "really existing, forward moving

universe of 'happenings'" --

we are the instantaneous "revelation"

in which observer/observation/observed

are unsplit and unsplittable.

 

There is and can be no story about this.

 

As stories go, the strong version of

the anthropic principle is coherent.

The story line hides and reveals this truth:

neither the universe nor the "sentient entity"

can be considered independent

existences with separate "beings".

 

To fully "know" this, one necessarily goes

beyond causality.

The universe didn't come into existence because

the sentient entity experienced it, not did the

sentient entity come into existence because

the universe produced it.

 

Science can come up to this point, at the instant of

the Big Bang, at the setting of the speed of light as

a limit -- but it can't "enter the point" --

 

where causality, explanation, and "relationship of this and that"

have no "place" to be established ...

where no observer can be ...

where no location for an observation is to be had ...

 

And yet ...

this is it!

 

Love,

Dan

 

Love,

Dan

 

>Hi Jan,

>

>This has it's counterpart in science as well. It's called the anthropic

>principle, and cosmologists love to play with it for one. I am not

>particularly well versed in it, but I understand there are at least two

>versions of it - the weak anthropic principle that states something like

>"you should not be surprised that sentience has arisen in this universe

>because if it hadn't, how would you have noticed?" That's probably not

>well stated, but the idea is that sentient beings will tend to find

>themselves living in universes which have produced sentient beings, and

>not in universes that have not produced sentient beings. That is not to

>suggest that there might not be universes which have not produced

>sentient beings, but they are not observed because sentience is required

>to do the observing. The weak anthropic principle allows us to ignore

>universes that do not produce sentient beings because we can't do

>anything other than ignore them anyway, so it cuts down on the paperwork

>involved in keeping track of all possible universes, which is good

>because cosmologists often don't have large budgets to work with

>anyway. The strong anthropic principle suggests that there could never

>be universes which don't produce sentient being sometime in their

>existence because universes are basically made in order to produce

>sentient beings. That is to say that universes appreciate being

>appreciated and that sentience is a requirement for appreciation. This

>sounds more like the mystical point of view to me, but I don't know what

>it's consequences are for cosmology. I think there are proponents of

>both anthropic principles, and also those who don't support either, but

>are too busy trying to get funded to think about these things.

>

>Love, Mark

>

>

>//

>

>All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

>perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and

>subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not

>different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the

>nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present.

>It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

>Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

>Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome

>all to a.

>

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