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Can a jnani help those who follow other paths?

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>From Vicki:

 

Suppose there is a hill. There will be many paths to climb it.

If he were to ask people to climb by the way he came ,

some may like it and some may not.

If people who do not like it are asked to climb

by that path only, they will not be able to come up.

Hence a jnani helps people following any particular path

whatever it may be.

People who are midway may not know about the merits

and demerits of other paths, but one who has climbed

to the summit and sits there observing others coming up

is able to see all the paths.

He will therefore be able to tell people who are coming up

to move a little to this side or that or to avoid a pitfall.

The goal is the same for all.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

BE AS YOU ARE, The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi

edited by David Godman

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Hi Vicki,

Thanks for that :-)

One of the great dangers of the path

is to believe one is at the summit

when one has done little more

than found (however profound)a ledge.

This is one of the reasons why

we acknowledge teachers (there is always

someone ahead).

When we start to pronounce on what

is right, we have been seduced by

the belief that God has a voice

or a spoken truth.

The Truth is something fluid,

sometimes it shines

sometimes it is Lucifer (the shining one

- the Beautiful Angel)

sometimes, all times it moves people

beyond where they are.

If you are happy where you are

that is OK. It depends

on whether perfection is arrived at

or arriving . . .

The things you once believed were true

the things you will believe are true.

Of course you do not have to believe

that and that too

is true . . .

 

 

Lobster

eXXo-

Beyond Belief

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Q: How does a shtitaprajna* recognize himself as such?

Is it by knowing the fullness of his enlightenment

or is it by cessation of objective awareness ?

 

A: In the firm , natural state , through that Supreme Silence

free from all vasanas , the jnani knows himself

as such without any doubt.(Maharshi)

 

* sthitaprajna = one of steadfast knowledge

````````````````

Sri Ramana Gita

 

 

Hi Vicki,

Doubtless a person without any doubts is something

that appeals. Spiritual confidence!

'I know who I am and what I am doing', type of attitude.

Most of us would be 'proud' (oops) to be like that.

Perhaps such steadfastness is a manifestation of arrival

and according to some philosophies (mahamudra and dzogchen

and Sufi philosophy that recognises

at least five stages beyond enlightenment

and Zen which also classifies depth of realisation)

a condition of enlightenment and certainty

just like that of pre-arrival and uncertainty

is part of a duality.

Enlightenment and Samsara are seen as dualistic

and partial experiences.

If the confidence of 'the Enlightened'

moves one into a preferred understanding then

this is good.

Believing one has arrived at completion and

certainty is then something that no longer

arises.

For the knowing of Self is without doubt

without end.

What is called the fullness of Enlightenment

is an empty experience like all

others.

Still

the sun shines and the day is born anew . . .

 

Day Light

Lobster

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Namaste All,

 

For a jnani there is only one path, which ultimately is no

path..ONS Tony.

 

 

, "vicki" <viorica@z...> wrote:

> hi Lobster,

> a true Master and a true aspirant will always

> recognize each other.

> no doubt about that.

> vicki

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, "vicki" <viorica@z...> wrote:

>

> "The Master is within ; meditation is meant to remove

> the ignorant idea that he is only outside.

 

******* Yes, meditation, the 'ol nickle drop trick! :-)

 

Judi

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On 4/25/01 at 5:59 PM judirhodes wrote:

 

º, "vicki" <viorica@z...> wrote:

º>

º> "The Master is within ; meditation is meant to remove

º> the ignorant idea that he is only outside.

º

º******* Yes, meditation, the 'ol nickle drop trick! :-)

º

ºJudi

 

The quote could be appropriate when K. is active: then, it will be possible to

"feel"

there isn't a difference whether or not in the presence of one fully awake.

But as long as the difference is felt, it is belief. And Ramana used to say "I

am

not the body" quite a few times - which didn't prevent seekers and disciples

from visiting.

 

Jan

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Indeed:

There is only the path that

Socrates and the Oracle

of Delphi called

"Know thyself" ...

And that path necessarily

becomes simultaneously

the studier, the studied,

and the studying ...

At which point, there is

"opening", yet no path

in sight ...

Namaste,

Dan

Namaste All,

For a jnani there is only one path, which ultimately is no

path..ONS Tony.

, "vicki" <viorica@z...>

wrote:

> hi Lobster,

> a true Master and a true aspirant will always

> recognize each other.

> no doubt about that.

> vicki

 

Sponsor

/join

All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and

subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not

different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the

nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always

Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to

be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome

all to a.

To from this list, go to the ONElist web site, at

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, "jb" <janb@a...> wrote:

> On 4/25/01 at 5:59 PM judirhodes@e... wrote:

>

> º, "vicki" <viorica@z...> wrote:

> º>

> º> "The Master is within ; meditation is meant to remove

> º> the ignorant idea that he is only outside.

> º

> º******* Yes, meditation, the 'ol nickle drop trick! :-)

> º

> ºJudi

>

> The quote could be appropriate when K. is active: then, it will be

possible to "feel"

> there isn't a difference whether or not in the presence of one fully

awake.

> But as long as the difference is felt, it is belief. And Ramana used

to say "I am

> not the body" quite a few times - which didn't prevent seekers and

disciples

> from visiting.

>

 

********** LOL! What a scream! :-))

 

Judi

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On 4/25/01 at 10:14 PM judirhodes wrote:

 

º, "jb" <janb@a...> wrote:

[...]

..

º> But as long as the difference is felt, it is belief. And Ramana used

ºto say "I am

º> not the body" quite a few times - which didn't prevent seekers and

ºdisciples

º> from visiting.

º>

º

º********** LOL! What a scream! :-))

º

ºJudi

 

It is funny - of course there were those for whom Grace was

ever present since the first visit to Ramana and then, there were those,

discovering that after his physically passing away.

The point is, when "at the end of the rope", Grace will strike

whenever, wherever - it could be called "extreme" and it is rare.

The other extreme is, when starting to feel Grace after repeated visits

and some talks to remove doubts. Those "gradual converts" are likely

to do the writing :) - like for instance Paul Brunton.

 

Jan

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, "jb" <janb@a...> wrote:

> On 4/25/01 at 10:14 PM judirhodes@e... wrote:

>

> º, "jb" <janb@a...> wrote:

> [...]

> .

> º> But as long as the difference is felt, it is belief. And Ramana

used

> ºto say "I am

> º> not the body" quite a few times - which didn't prevent seekers

and

> ºdisciples

> º> from visiting.

> º>

> º

> º********** LOL! What a scream! :-))

> º

> ºJudi

>

> It is funny - of course there were those for whom Grace was

> ever present since the first visit to Ramana and then, there were

those,

> discovering that after his physically passing away.

> The point is, when "at the end of the rope", Grace will strike

> whenever, wherever - it could be called "extreme" and it is rare.

> The other extreme is, when starting to feel Grace after repeated

visits

> and some talks to remove doubts. Those "gradual converts" are likely

> to do the writing :) - like for instance Paul Brunton.

>

****** Oh Lord, save me from the gradual converts. :-) lol

 

Judi

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On 4/25/01 at 11:22 PM judirhodes wrote:

 

[...]º****** Oh Lord, save me from the gradual converts. :-) lol

º

ºJudi

 

You can't be saved twice :)

 

Jann

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, "jb" <janb@a...> wrote:

> On 4/25/01 at 11:22 PM judirhodes@e... wrote:

>

> [...]º****** Oh Lord, save me from the gradual converts. :-) lol

> º

> ºJudi

>

> You can't be saved twice :)

>

> Jann

 

***** Damn! :-)

 

Judi

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