Guest guest Posted April 27, 2001 Report Share Posted April 27, 2001 "Paul J. Cote" <pjcote@l...> Fri Apr 27, 2001 5:15 pm concentration vs... witnessing.... I have found peace in doing Japa Yoga... Nevertheless, I read an article by a Zen Master where she purports that concentration doesn't really clean anything up cuz you never deal with your stuff, but it is better to feel the knot of your ego and deal with it, welcome it, so that you can become one with it... ( I guess) and it sort of melts and then it shouldn't come back... whereas if you just do concentration (maybe japa is concentration, I don't know) then, your stuff keeps coming back, because you never deal with it.... Does anybody have any opinion on this stuff? __________ I will pass my response to other lists as well. There are no universal formulas that fit everyone. Japa Yoga helps in concentration. Concentration can lead to increasing sensitivity to body's energies and the actualization of Mantra practice facilitates gradual movement of the contents of the unconscious to the surface to be assimilated in the conscious personality. At another level, Japa Yoga can lead to Super conscious states, so one can investigate the nature of consciousness in waking, sleeping, and dreaming. As pointed out by Ramana Maharshi, witness consciousness and Japa Yoga (mantra practice), or any other spiritual practice are not mutually exclusive. When the witness consciousness has nothing left to witness for a time period (due to large gaps between successive thoughts), then the witness disappears into the Heart, Recognizes It Self as the Heart, and the Heart Reveals It Self As Pure Being At Perfect Rest. The Self-Witness with nothing to Witness, The Self-Seeing with nothing to see, The Self Knows It Self as Pure Consciousness, Pure Existence, Pure Joy. Sat-Chit-Ananda. Pure and Simple. Whole and without divisions. This is not the self of Buddhists which is made of different elements and so on and on some subtle level or anything. It Is simply THAT, prior to all possibilities. Here all possibilities disappear entirely. It is utterly beyond the void of the Buddhists, although one can call it Shunya, without loss of meaning. It is beyond the self and the non-self and all that. It cannot be captured by thought. Who remains to understand it when the Self shines forth, and yet It Reveals It Self Perpetually in all conditions and states as simple Being-Awareness! As Sages have said, To Know It, Is To Be It! It Is From Here that the Cosmos emerges and it is into THAT, everything disappears. Love to all Harsha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 27, 2001 Report Share Posted April 27, 2001 Chiming in with you guys, Paul, what do you mean by "stuff"? Do you mean the mere presence of thought? Do you mean anger, fear and desire? Or do you mean issues surrounding parents, loved ones, self-esteem, etc.? Or abuse/neglect/abandonment? The witnessing spoken of by Harsha and Ramana is the end of all stuff and possibilities altogether, even warm puppies and vanilla ice cream. And what is wonderful is that this witnessing is the case even now! What the Zen teacher seems to be talking sounds like emotional encumbrances. Two observations about "stuff." One, the traditional teachings on non-dualism (advaita in India; Madhyamika emptiness teachings in Tibet and China) were carefully dispensed to students only after the teacher was satisfied that the student had the fruits of the preliminary practices of karma, bhakti and raja yoga. Shankara has laid out a set of pre-requisites for becoming a student. In the Madhyamika emptiness teachings, it is said that if the student doesn't burst out in tears at the mere mention of the word "emptiness," then teaching them about emptiness would be premature and cause nihilistic spiritual tendencies. So much of what is commonly called "stuff" was gone before the teachings ever began. Two, nothing that helps is incompatible with one's spiritual path. In today's world, all teachings are easily available at Amazon and Barnes & Noble, as well as the local zendo and satsang. So it is not uncommon to actually pursue various healing work, even psychotherapy, at the same time as their spiritual work. Many people have done this, including the long-time meditation teachers Joseph Goldstein and Jack Kornfield. It was relationship and/or mother issues in their cases. Specific tools can deal with specific stuff; non-dual tools are for all stuff whatsoever. If I haven't welcomed you to the various lists, WELCOME! --Greg At 05:16 PM 4/27/01 -0400, Harsha wrote: > "Paul J. Cote" <pjcote@l...> > Fri Apr 27, 2001 5:15 pm > concentration vs... witnessing.... > > >I have found peace in doing Japa Yoga... Nevertheless, I read an >article by a Zen Master where she purports that concentration doesn't >really clean anything up cuz you never deal with your stuff, but it >is better to feel the knot of your ego and deal with it, welcome it, >so that you can become one with it... ( I guess) and it sort of melts >and then it shouldn't come back... whereas if you just do >concentration (maybe japa is concentration, I don't know) then, your >stuff keeps coming back, because you never deal with it.... > >Does anybody have any opinion on this stuff? >__________ >I will pass my response to other lists as well. > >There are no universal formulas that fit everyone. Japa Yoga helps in >concentration. Concentration can lead to increasing sensitivity to body's >energies and the actualization of Mantra practice facilitates gradual >movement of the contents of the unconscious to the surface to be assimilated >in the conscious personality. At another level, Japa Yoga can lead to Super >conscious states, so one can investigate the nature of consciousness in >waking, sleeping, and dreaming. > >As pointed out by Ramana Maharshi, witness consciousness and Japa Yoga >(mantra practice), or any other spiritual practice are not mutually >exclusive. > >When the witness consciousness has nothing left to witness for a time period >(due to large gaps between successive thoughts), then the witness disappears >into the Heart, Recognizes It Self as the Heart, and the Heart Reveals It >Self As Pure Being At Perfect Rest. > >The Self-Witness with nothing to Witness, The Self-Seeing with nothing to >see, The Self Knows It >Self as Pure Consciousness, Pure Existence, Pure Joy. Sat-Chit-Ananda. Pure >and Simple. Whole and without divisions. > >This is not the self of Buddhists which is made of different elements and so >on and on some subtle level or anything. > >It Is simply THAT, prior to all possibilities. Here all possibilities >disappear entirely. It is utterly beyond the void of the Buddhists, although >one can call it Shunya, without loss of meaning. It is beyond the self and >the non-self and all that. It cannot be captured by thought. Who remains to >understand it when the Self shines forth, and yet It Reveals It Self >Perpetually in all conditions and states as simple Being-Awareness! As Sages >have said, To Know It, Is To Be It! > >It Is From Here that the Cosmos emerges and it is into THAT, everything >disappears. > >Love to all >Harsha > > > >/join > > > > > >All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. > > > >Your use of is subject to > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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