When the Tao was lost

May 27, 2001

"Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers

has stated , "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect,

so perfect that at first they did not know that there were things.

This is the most perfect knowledge .Nothing can be added.

Next , they knew that there were things , but did not yet make

distinction between them. They did not make any comparison

between them. Next , they made comparison but they did not

yet passed judgments upon them. When they proceeded

to pass judgments , the Tao was lost. "

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Consciousness Speaks

Ramesh Balsekar

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May 27, 2001

problem is, then we have nothing to talk about here in the satsangh

if we fail to discriminate and judge....^^~~~~

-

vicki

; ANetofJewels

Saturday, May 26, 2001 9:36 PM

When the Tao was lost

"Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers

has stated , "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect,

so perfect that at first they did not know that there were things.

This is the most perfect knowledge .Nothing can be added.

Next , they knew that there were things , but did not yet make

distinction between them. They did not make any comparison

between them. Next , they made comparison but they did not

yet passed judgments upon them. When they proceeded

to pass judgments , the Tao was lost. "

```````````````````````````````````````````````````

Consciousness Speaks

Ramesh Balsekar

``````````````````````````````````````````````````/join

All paths go

somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions,

and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back

into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It

is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self.

Welcome all to a.Your use of is subject

to the

May 27, 2001

> "Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers has stated

>, "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect, so perfect that at first

>they did not know that there were things. This is the most perfect

>knowledge .Nothing can be added. Next , they knew that there were things

>, but did not yet make distinction between them. They did not make any

>comparison between them. Next , they made comparison but they did not

>yet passed judgments upon them. When they proceeded to pass judgments ,

>the Tao was lost. "

"When they proceeded to pass judgments" = The Tree of the Knowledge of

Good and Evil?

May 27, 2001

hi ,

I can see a woman biting an apple ....

vicki

Dharma

> "Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers has

stated>, "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect, so perfect that

at first>they did not know that there were things. This is the most

perfect>knowledge .Nothing can be added. Next , they knew that there

were things>, but did not yet make distinction between them. They

did not make any>comparison between them. Next , they made

comparison but they did not>yet passed judgments upon them. When

they proceeded to pass judgments ,>the Tao was lost. ""When they

proceeded to pass judgments" = The Tree of the Knowledge ofGood and

Evil?

May 27, 2001

, Dharma <deva@L...> wrote:

> > "Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers has

stated

> >, "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect, so perfect that at

first

> >they did not know that there were things. This is the most

perfect

> >knowledge .Nothing can be added. Next , they knew that there were

things

> >, but did not yet make distinction between them. They did not

make any

> >comparison between them. Next , they made comparison but they did

not

> >yet passed judgments upon them. When they proceeded to pass

judgments ,

> >the Tao was lost. "

>

> "When they proceeded to pass judgments" = The Tree of the

Knowledge of

> Good and Evil

Namaste All,

There were two descents of beings from the 'heavens', kumaras. The

first wouldn't get involved in procreation and only wanted to meditate

so the second descent was required to multiply. These are the sons of

god of cayce and genesis 6: Bagavatham etc etc.ONS...Tony.

May 27, 2001

, "Tony O'Clery" <aoclery> wrote:

> , Dharma <deva@L...> wrote:

> > > "Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers

has

> stated

> > >, "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect, so perfect that at

> first

> > >they did not know that there were things. This is the most

> perfect

> > >knowledge .Nothing can be added. Next , they knew that there

were

> things

> > >, but did not yet make distinction between them. They did not

> make any

> > >comparison between them. Next , they made comparison but they

did

> not

> > >yet passed judgments upon them. When they proceeded to pass

> judgments ,

> > >the Tao was lost. "

> >

> > "When they proceeded to pass judgments" = The Tree of the

> Knowledge of

> > Good and Evil

>

> Namaste All,

>

> There were two descents of beings from the 'heavens', kumaras. The

> first wouldn't get involved in procreation and only wanted to

meditate

> so the second descent was required to multiply. These are the sons

of

> god of cayce and genesis 6: Bagavatham etc etc.ONS...Tony.

PS

Before that there were astral beings that descended through the planes

until they eventually ended up here. Addicted to the senses mainly sex

and mixed with all kind of beings producing mixtures. This was the

reason for the Kumaric Descents.......ONS Tony.

May 27, 2001

tonysan....you are such a dear....you make me talk to myself in such

categorical terms....you talk about poetry like it is fact....you

talk about facts like they are poetry....words, at best, are symbols

referrng to reality....when we use words as facts we create a complex

symbol we call a myth....a myth is a symbol pointing to or attempting

to explain a larger perception of reality....this is semiotics, the

study of language as symbol (a fun read on all this is Lost in the

Cosmos by Walker Percy).....in the end all these words are empty in

the sense that, at best, they are a symbol pointing us toward

reality....the mind is capable of too much discrimination, it breaks

things apart....the story about the lost tao is a story about the

proverbial 'fall'....it is the story about consciousness arising to

create languange and with it time, space and dukkha, the whole modern

existential dilemna.....the story, the modern myth that balances this

oneside of the coin story, is the myth of scientific evolution....Ken

Wilber does a great job on all this in Up from Eden and Theory of

Everything.... or if you prefer, go sit like a white wolfe and just

watch the moon.....waxing to wane....waning to wax.....it is all a

matter of perspective....the myths you telescope into one are all a

matter of cultural perspective at a given point in time and

space....they are not eternal realities....they are delusions of the

mind until perceived as suchand then they fade into just what they

are, sweet poetry.....the reality is in the rock you stub your toe

on, in the keyboard beneath your fingers and in the beloved.....it

has taken the divine millions and millions of profane ones to make

you.....you are the new one....but only the new until you surrender

to the many to bring forth a newer new one.....see brahman for what

brahman is....what atman for what atman is....just ways of talking

about sat chit ananda.....what is just a way of talking about the

tao.....the tao that can be desribed in not the true tao....like you

the tao is less then nothing and more than everything.....words

contain even begin to talk about it.....you are the way, tony.....i

am the way....interbeing....we are the way.....thank you for your

presence here, tonyson...thank you for sharing the way with

me.....namaste.....^^~~~~~

Re: When the Tao was lost

> , "Tony O'Clery" <aoclery> wrote:> >

, Dharma <deva@L...> wrote:> > > >

"Chuang Tzu , one of the most impressive Taoist teachers > has > >

stated> > > >, "The knowledge of the ancients was perfect, so

perfect that at > > first> > > >they did not know that there were

things. This is the most > > perfect> > > >knowledge .Nothing can

be added. Next , they knew that there > were > > things> > > >, but

did not yet make distinction between them. They did not > > make

any> > > >comparison between them. Next , they made comparison but

they > did > > not> > > >yet passed judgments upon them. When they

proceeded to pass > > judgments ,> > > >the Tao was lost. "> > > >

> > "When they proceeded to pass judgments" = The Tree of the > >

Knowledge of> > > Good and Evil> > > > Namaste All,> > > > There were

two descents of beings from the 'heavens', kumaras. The > > first

wouldn't get involved in procreation and only wanted to > meditate >

> so the second descent was required to multiply. These are the sons

> of > > god of cayce and genesis 6: Bagavatham etc etc.ONS...Tony.>

PS> Before that there were astral beings that descended through the

planes > until they eventually ended up here. Addicted to the senses

mainly sex > and mixed with all kind of beings producing mixtures.

This was the > reason for the Kumaric Descents.......ONS Tony.> > >

/join> >

> > > > All

paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and

subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not

different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of

the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always

Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart

to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the

Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It

Self. Welcome all to a.> > > > Your use of

Groups is subject to > > >

May 27, 2001

Yes, yes, yes

-

vicki

; ANetofJewels

May 26, 2001 9:36 PM