Guest guest Posted May 31, 2001 Report Share Posted May 31, 2001 Namaste All, It is good for filling bookshelves and money making. I feel a lot of it is just good old psychism, or schizophrenia or just delusions and fantasies. I mean if one wants to experience 'K', well just go to a pop concert or a football game, or even a revivalist or charismatic service. Or being a teenager!!! K is everywhere there is nothing so common as K. It is the mind!!!! What people refer to as K is really prana cleaning their dirty old sheaths of samskaras so as they can become more spiritual. And yes as you know, I have had all these K experiences as well. The chakras can be 'opened', which really is to do with the inner subtle chakras that co-respond with various sheaths and planes of consciousness. Chakras are just the subtle equivalent of the endocrine system. From the subtle comes the material. In the end result the good old rosary and japa will raise the K and channel it without all the loose cannon stuff that people seem to thrive and boast about. My sheath is dirtier than yours, look what a hive of activity it took to clean me!!!!!!!! Also it is much more trendy and vogue to have K rather than a psychotic episode of some kind. It is still attachment to energy and material and does not ever result in liberation moksha. So lets quit the BS and go and pray or meditate!!Ecstasy and bliss will come from that too, if thats the drug of choice. Om Namah Sivaya....Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2001 Report Share Posted June 1, 2001 Hi Tony, >It is good for filling bookshelves and money making. I feel a lot of >it is just good old psychism, or schizophrenia or just delusions and >fantasies. >snip< > >What people refer to as K is really prana cleaning their dirty old >sheaths of samskaras so as they can become more spiritual. How can both be true, Tony? Can "psychism, or schizophrenia or just delusions and fantasies" actually do the job of "cleaning their dirty old sheaths of samskaras so as they can become more spiritual"??? And BTW, since when have you objected to people cleaning up their sheaths? Or getting rid of samskaras? Are you objecting to people becoming more spiritual? >And yes as you know, I have had all these K experiences as well. If you had, you wouldn't talk like this about it. >The chakras can be 'opened', which really is to do with the inner >subtle chakras that co-respond with various sheaths and planes of >consciousness. Which chakras are the "inner subtle chakras"? Aren't they all? >In the end result the good old rosary and japa will raise the K and >channel it without all the loose cannon stuff that people seem to >thrive and boast about. My sheath is dirtier than yours, look what a >hive of activity it took to clean me!!!!!!!! You don't get it. Everybody who grows up human has problems and blocks. Some people work them out through the events of their lives. Some people spend years going to psychiatrists. It's a whole lot faster to just zap 'em with Kundalini! )) Actually, the "Give-it-to-God/dess" method will work even without active K., I think. I know it worked for me many years before I had active K. >Also it is much more trendy and vogue to have K rather than a >psychotic episode of some kind. Oh, is it an either/or choice? Are you saying you'd rather have a psychotic episode? >It is still attachment to energy and material Kundalini is not attachment! Kundalini IS energy. > and does not ever result >in liberation moksha. Active Kundalini is not necessary for that. But for you to say that it does not _ever_ result in that - you're making a blanket statement of something that you cannot possibly know about. >So lets quit the BS and go and pray or meditate!!Ecstasy and bliss >will come from that too, if thats the drug of choice. You know, if you would quit all the intellectualizing and the intellectual/emotional blasting away at everything that scares you, you might actually get into the real experience. But just keep on filling your mind and your time with the intellectual stuff, and you won't have to face the real. Love, Dharma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2001 Report Share Posted June 1, 2001 , Dharma <deva@L...> wrote: > Hi Tony, > > >It is good for filling bookshelves and money making. I feel a lot of > >it is just good old psychism, or schizophrenia or just delusions and > >fantasies. > >snip< > > > >What people refer to as K is really prana cleaning their dirty old > >sheaths of samskaras so as they can become more spiritual. > > How can both be true, Tony? Can "psychism, or schizophrenia or just > delusions and fantasies" actually do the job of "cleaning their dirty old > sheaths of samskaras so as they can become more spiritual"??? > > And BTW, since when have you objected to people cleaning up their sheaths? > Or getting rid of samskaras? Are you objecting to people becoming more > spiritual? > > >And yes as you know, I have had all these K experiences as well. > > If you had, you wouldn't talk like this about it. > > >The chakras can be 'opened', which really is to do with the inner > >subtle chakras that co-respond with various sheaths and planes of > >consciousness. > > Which chakras are the "inner subtle chakras"? Aren't they all? > > >In the end result the good old rosary and japa will raise the K and > >channel it without all the loose cannon stuff that people seem to > >thrive and boast about. My sheath is dirtier than yours, look what a > >hive of activity it took to clean me!!!!!!!! > > You don't get it. Everybody who grows up human has problems and blocks. > Some people work them out through the events of their lives. Some people > spend years going to psychiatrists. It's a whole lot faster to just zap > 'em with Kundalini! )) > > Actually, the "Give-it-to-God/dess" method will work even without active > K., I think. I know it worked for me many years before I had active K. > > >Also it is much more trendy and vogue to have K rather than a > >psychotic episode of some kind. > > Oh, is it an either/or choice? Are you saying you'd rather have a > psychotic episode? > > >It is still attachment to energy and material > > Kundalini is not attachment! Kundalini IS energy. > > > and does not ever result > >in liberation moksha. > > Active Kundalini is not necessary for that. But for you to say that it > does not _ever_ result in that - you're making a blanket statement of > something that you cannot possibly know about. > > >So lets quit the BS and go and pray or meditate!!Ecstasy and bliss > >will come from that too, if thats the drug of choice. > > You know, if you would quit all the intellectualizing and the > intellectual/emotional blasting away at everything that scares you, you > might actually get into the real experience. But just keep on filling your > mind and your time with the intellectual stuff, and you won't have to face > the real. > > Love, > Dharma Namaste Dharma, Your post is a good example of what I was saying. Yes I have had K experiences,sinc I was a child, mostly steady and pleasant energy, except for when I started meditating and had some tremendous event with my heart Chakra.( the only other time was when I went through a spiritual type experience with some native communion food!!!!) I still have smooth experiences daily, when preparing for meditation and concentration. Again a lot of psychotics and mentally imbalanced people are also claiming K, the old K list was like a cuckoo's nest!! Yes it is about cleansing and the 'dirtier', the sheath the more the a activity, I guess. In fact K happens karmically at the right time, however many unspiritual people have no preparation and the result can be terrible, read Feuerstein's book on Tantra. The Chinese have about 10 chakras the Hindus 7 or sometimes 8, some chakras are below the mudadhara, 7 is suggested. So obviously it is all concept and interpretation. There are chakras behind chakras and all have different colours it is a kaleidescope, chakras are everwhere. The pranamayakosa as is all prana is active, otherwise what would creat? So it is our awareness that rises as the samskaras are cleansed. It is our attention that moves the chakras etc. It is all concentration and anything will do actually, just a set of rosaries for japa etc. There is so much rubbish written and claimed about K. It is just energy in the end like the material, something that is ultimately an illusion and to be disavowed, as causing attachment. K is a cleansing process, those who are spiritual may have no experiences at all, nothing to clean. Om Namah Sivaya,..Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2001 Report Share Posted June 1, 2001 Dear Tony, There is so much disdain in your writing... You are starting to sound like a bitter, grumpy old man... I don't think that your material, which is starting to verge on the side of 'ridiculing', should be directed to this list... Of course, it is absolutely OK for you express bitterness, sourness and ridicule, but aren't you directing it to the wrong address? Check it out! Don't you need to direct you reactions to the real party in your past who duped you originally...? And it is not 'God or so' as you suggested before... You reactively respond to many things I write to you, but it is interesting that the words that need direct response get avoided and side stepped by you... There is a clear pattern in that. It means that you are actually way more aware of the real issue than you let on or... are allowed to let on. Who is still controlling you? What you are NOT telling... is very telling... It is not useful for you to criticize people or groups of people and diminish the value of their work with gripy and sour expressions. Of course there is a lot of fancy and not so fancy stuff around, but is that YOUR business? Could it be that your old pattern of guru bashing has now dispassionately turned into people bashing. Your rightful need to bash the real cause of your illusive deficiency has to help you find that cause and bash THAT right on the head. No use to beat around the bush or barking up someone else's tree. Your business is to take care of YOUR business... You are not too old for it, but some stubbornness in you (your thick skin) is now showing calluses, signs of premature aging rather than rejuvenation. You seem to be afraid to address the cause of your 'illusive' deficiency straight on... You pattern is to slip yourself away from that personal issue by sidetracking yourself and resigning to third party bashing, while leaning on third party knowledge... Get it together with yourself by finding out who the second party was in your life who attempted to take your original happiness away by making it conditional upon third hand urges, commands, judgements and expectations. Do you actually know that so far you have *exclusively* been showing symptoms of denial? My dear Tony, how much more direct can I be with you, other than visiting you in person and bashing you on the head ? :-)))))) Love you, Wim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2001 Report Share Posted June 1, 2001 , "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphere@h...> wrote: > Dear Tony, > > There is so much disdain in your writing... > You are starting to sound like a bitter, grumpy old man... > I don't think that your material, which is starting to verge on the side > of 'ridiculing', should be directed to this list... > > Of course, it is absolutely OK for you express bitterness, sourness and > ridicule, but aren't you directing it to the wrong address? Check it > out! > > Don't you need to direct you reactions to the real party in your past > who duped you originally...? > > And it is not 'God or so' as you suggested before... > > You reactively respond to many things I write to you, but it is > interesting that the words that need direct response get avoided and > side stepped by you... There is a clear pattern in that. It means that > you are actually way more aware of the real issue than you let on or... > are allowed to let on. > Who is still controlling you? > What you are NOT telling... is very telling... Namaste Wim, Hahaha this has nothing to do with my good or bad past. It is just strong debate on Kundalini, which is much touted abused and misunderstood. If you want to debate, don't attack me debate what I have said.....ONS....Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2001 Report Share Posted June 2, 2001 Hi Tony, >> There is so much disdain in your writing... >> You are starting to sound like a bitter, grumpy old man... >> I don't think that your material, which is starting to verge on the >side >> of 'ridiculing', should be directed to this list... >Hahaha this has nothing to do with my good or bad past. It is just >strong debate on Kundalini, which is much touted abused and >misunderstood. If you want to debate, don't attack me debate what I >have said.....ONS....Tony. You have written to two lists today, asking for debate. But it's your urge for constant debate that gets in your own way. I have no interest in intellectual debate. Perhaps you could find it better on an intellectual list than a spiritually oriented one? Love, Dharma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2001 Report Share Posted June 2, 2001 , Dharma <deva@L...> wrote: > Hi Tony, > > >> There is so much disdain in your writing... > >> You are starting to sound like a bitter, grumpy old man... > >> I don't think that your material, which is starting to verge on the > >side > >> of 'ridiculing', should be directed to this list... > > >Hahaha this has nothing to do with my good or bad past. It is just > >strong debate on Kundalini, which is much touted abused and > >misunderstood. If you want to debate, don't attack me debate what I > >have said.....ONS....Tony. > > You have written to two lists today, asking for debate. But it's your urge > for constant debate that gets in your own way. > > I have no interest in intellectual debate. Perhaps you could find it > better on an intellectual list than a spiritually oriented one? > > Love, > Dharma Namaste Dharma, With all due respect reams of cut and paste of Tibetan and Theosophical scriptures isn't spirituality either. At least I try to strike out on my own......ONS...Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2001 Report Share Posted June 2, 2001 , "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphere@h...> wrote: Namaste Wim, The only Guru Bashing I did was to help expose Sai Baba. I have not attacked any others personally. Although there are a lot of 'road show',gurus around. I must say that since leaving sb my awareness has increased. http://www.saibabaguru.com ONS...Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2001 Report Share Posted June 2, 2001 Dear Tony and Alton, > With all due respect reams of cut and paste of Tibetan and > Theosophical scriptures isn't spirituality either. At *least* I try to > strike out on my own......ONS...Tony. With all due respect as well, Tony, but your quoting and using so many Sanskrit expressions, which you are so good at, is just as much cut and paste... So at *last*... strike out on your own..., do not just try... Note to Alton (Komo Kasha) concerning Tony. Tony is one hard nut to crack... (, and boy, do we love nuts! It's the empty shells we compost! The neat thing about Tony is, that he unknowingly invites us to come up with some well written stuff! On the other hand, he urgently needs a replacement, so that he can realize that his holding out can come to a stop... Would you like to step in his place, Tony also needs to go to Amsterdam, Sodom and Gomorra 2001. http://www.planetaviation.com/virtualairlines/battle/archives/2000_atlan tis/06_briefing.htm In serious jest, Love, Wim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2001 Report Share Posted June 2, 2001 Dear Borsboom: Thanks for you kind words. I typed mine in though. You all talk so much of EGO's. Look, we all have them as long as we do not get that cellular transformation, that will say that we are no longer a person we imagined ourselves to be. They did not post my last one, probably because it came from and attachment post. So, I will repeat just is case it went awry. This is all God's Dramatics and we are all just playing roles that are cast in immutable stone. All thoughts words, deeds, experiences already were set, and this stuff is just a reanactment of the scrip. All the above IMO. Meta, Alton , "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphere@h...> wrote: > Dear Tony and Alton, > > > With all due respect reams of cut and paste of Tibetan and > > Theosophical scriptures isn't spirituality either. At *least* I try to > > strike out on my own......ONS...Tony. > > With all due respect as well, Tony, but your quoting and using so many > Sanskrit expressions, which you are so good at, is just as much cut and > paste... > > So at *last*... strike out on your own..., do not just try... > > Note to Alton (Komo Kasha) concerning Tony. > > Tony is one hard nut to crack... (, and boy, do we love nuts! It's > the empty shells we compost! > The neat thing about Tony is, that he unknowingly invites us to come up > with some well written stuff! On the other hand, he urgently needs a > replacement, so that he can realize that his holding out can come to a > stop... Would you like to step in his place, Tony also needs to go to > Amsterdam, Sodom and Gomorra 2001. > http://www.planetaviation.com/virtualairlines/battle/archives/2000_atl an > tis/06_briefing.htm > > > In serious jest, > Love, Wim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2001 Report Share Posted June 3, 2001 Hi Alton, >They did not post my last one, probably because it came from and >attachment post. This list is not moderated... that is, no one is approving and censoring the mail. But attachments are separate. I think on the website they show up with the messages. On my computer they do not show with messages but come into a separate folder. >So, I will repeat just is case it went awry. >This is all God's Dramatics and we are all just playing roles that >are cast in immutable stone. All thoughts words, deeds, experiences >already were set, and this stuff is just a reanactment of the scrip. If that is what you believe, why do you bother to do anything? Or write anything? Love, Dharma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2001 Report Share Posted June 4, 2001 Tony O'Clery wrote: > don't attack me debate what I > have said..... Who attacked who? NetZero Platinum No Banner Ads and Unlimited Access Sign Up Today - Only $9.95 per month! http://www.netzero.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2001 Report Share Posted June 4, 2001 Tony O'Clery wrote: > I must say that since leaving sb my awareness has > increased. Who are you endorsing? NetZero Platinum No Banner Ads and Unlimited Access Sign Up Today - Only $9.95 per month! http://www.netzero.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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