Which is the real K?

June 3, 2001

Dear Tony,

You wrote:

> My point which nobody seems to take up is

> that *it is all* conceptual and interpretive.

Of course not nobody takes it up, because it ain't so!

IT ALL IS

period

concepts are conceptual

period

interpretations are interpretive

period

You mistakenly and in confusion got those elements linked, Tony. You

can't help it, it comes from bad logic... fallacious philosophy that was

shoved on your plate when you were not looking.

We already understood what you in confusion are still convinced of

and... which we left it behind.

You do not understand what is meant really in discourses on truth and

reality, as the wrong cross links jump in before you have a fair chance

at clear insight.

And you almost got yourself left behind... but we won't let you. We love

you.

Most of us here have left the *fight* behind, the fight you are still

fighting.

Again we are urging you to do the same.

Remember: "Drop all your notions..."

And also while you are at it, why don't you drop 'habitual reactiveness'

as well?

> Is the real K the one with 7 cakras,

> 10 cakras or is it 14 cakras. Is it 300,000 nadis,

> 700,000 nadis or infinite nadis????as some aver?

Do you want to talk about chakras and nadis... ?

You know what? Each nerve end is a little chakra, each complex of nerve

ends is a major chakra, e.g solar plexus. Each nerve is a nadi and there

are bundles of nerves that can be called ida or pingala or sushumna

or... No Tony, don't say anything yet... There are also meridians, same

thing just a different paradigm, different description. Then there are

reflex zones and acupuncture points... Paradigm, paradigm, paradigm.

Same body, same body, same body...

You want to talk prana? Do you have time and would you lend me your ear,

really your ear?

Later...

And how do I know? Because, as you know, I have with many others in the

past as well as many others presently, somehow been able to retrieve the

use of some senses a bit more completely than most. Nothing special, it

just happens... and I wish it on every one.

I see, feel and hear nerve ends and the variety of their energetic

emanations. And as you know, I also see and feel energy centres or

chakras that emanate from the nerve complexes. Also, I see and feel and

can affect the human aura and the distribution of energy densities...

And... surprise? Every one of us does, but not every one of us is so

aware. And that is OK with me!

Those perceptions are not conceptions, they are not interpretations, it

is real observed stuff, empirically observed.

Many people as well as machines can now clearly view and sense those

energies, just as clearly as you see the light of the sun and feel the

heat thereof.

Whatever qualifications (some disdain and ridicule) you have applied to

those kinds of subtler realities... you somehow do not apply them to the

same energetic emanations from the sun or the infrared heat coming from

the heating element of your stove when you heat your food.

It is all the same thing...

Does your stove have to do with the "big or small 'I' ego."

Do you burn your hand and cry: "The world is unreal?" Of course not, you

say: "Ouch" as your nerves react and your muscles retract.

Chakras, nadis, nerves, nerve ends, neurotransmitters, "endocrine

transducers", "glands. hormones", etc. They are just differently

expressed scientifically perceived observations... not conceived ideas.

Culturally these perceptions differ only in expression and description,

either oriental or occidental, southern or northen, traditional,

classical or contemporary, some overlapping, some diverging, all

depending on different paradigms.

To keep it simple:

(You could visit my website or go through the list archives if you wish

to know more.)

7 Major chakras, their nervous plexi, a selection of glands and some

other organs and...

all personally experimented with during my 'self destructive /

reconstructive period':

.. Crown - cerebral plexus, pineal gland, meninges, ventricles,

cerebro spinal fluid.

.. Brow - medulla plexus, pituitary body,

.. Throat - carotid plexus, thyroid,

.. Heart - cardiac plexus, thymus, liver, lungs, lymph system

and lymph nodes.

.. Navel - solar plexus, epigastric plexus, pancreas, gall

bladder.

.. Sacral - hypogastric plexus, genitals, gonads, adrenals.

.. Root- pelvic plexus, intestinal tract, anal glands,

kidneyalso tonsils.

We do not have to discuss or argue the reality of any of that, we may

have to argue the approprietness of function and description, but that

would be to arrive at agreement not disagreement. It is just a matter of

different terminology and more accurate observations and perceptions.

Why discussing it as though it has to be argued? It is good to let go of

the arguing and to start to use all your perceptive faculties and expand

on them...

I offer a course on that in Victoria.

>Speaking within samsara that is.

And why always adding this type of line, Tony. There is no need to

belittle that we are human divine miracles, that you are indeed a human

divine being with more up your sleeve that we or you know as yet...

> My point is that sticking religiously to one belief about K,

> is fundamentalism, and scripturism.

You can hardly say that people on this list do that, you may see us

doing that... so that you may rant on...

> The K idea doesn't achieve moksha

> for it is in material illusory energy.

"Material illusory energy"?

Paradigm, paradigm, paradigm.

Material energy is not illusory, nobody discoursing on reality ever says

what you seem to understand.

> It is worshipping the physical, a more refined physical

> but material all the same.

Aha... there is the problem.

Moses, Aaron and the Golden Calf

Aaron, the serpents and the Pharao.

And above all deficiency centered religionism.

Tony will you come around?

Love, Wim

June 3, 2001

hey wim...maybe when tonysan visits you in Victoria you can hit him on the

head with a sacred meditation mallet (make sure it hard enough to make his

ears ring!) and see if he can decide for himself it that is all conceptual

and interpretive...^^~~~~~

further up and further in,

white wolfe