Guest guest Posted June 18, 2001 Report Share Posted June 18, 2001 Namaste All, There are many people 'teaching', 'yoga', meditation, in the West many of them are 'Nightclub Buddhists/Hindus', or have read some books of sometimes eclectic mix. Many 'cherry pick', the observances of these spiritual groups. Others may be sincere but motivated by an impulse to teach. The only people that can teach real meditation are 'Realised Beings' like Ramana or Jesus etc. Or people close to that and only up to their level. I personally wouldn't try, even after 16 years of absorption into Hindu and Eastern meditation methods and time spent in India, because I am not realised, and in the land of the blind, the one eyed is king. A non realised person may teach some preliminary practices from a recognised school, reasonably safely. These being concentration mostly, which passes in the West as meditation. However the texts must be followed and only one path presented. There are many schools such as Sivananda Society etc. Many people are attracted to these lists and many are psychotic and schizophrenic. Some, are of the type that go off their meds, because they feel better etc. So calling themselves K active etc, gives them an excuse for their problems. It sounds a lot better than being psychotic. K has to be handled by experienced gurus, otherwise psychosis may occur. K is the mind but it is the Higher Mind. Playing around with personal control subverts the effort and leads to confusion and problems. Most people have to follow a path, otherwise the 'Inner Guru', of many may not be the Higher Mind but the normal lower mind. Following a spiritual path is going with the flow of the Higher Mind, so results in channeling the energy and avoids unnecessary pitfalls. I have personal knowledge of some of the results of wrong approaches, to people, etc etc. At least one I know of never ever recovered his sanity. This is what I mean by 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.' Anyone who isn't realised has only a little knowledge, including myself. Om Namah Sivaya….Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2001 Report Share Posted June 18, 2001 "K has to be handled by experienced gurus, otherwise psychosis may occur. K is the mind but it is the Higher Mind. Playing around with personal control subverts the effort and leads to confusion and problems" That is why I follow Nisaragadatta, because he does not give a list of do's and don'ts. Except to put you attention on your attention and watch the passing show. When I used to play the Synanon game, there was a guy in the group that said he guru told him that, if you meditate of the third eye without a guru, you could go crazy. What control freeks there are in this world. ONS, Alton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2001 Report Share Posted June 18, 2001 Hi Tony, , "Tony O'Clery" <aoclery> wrote: > The only people that can teach real meditation are 'Realised > Beings' like Ramana or Jesus etc. Or people close to that and only > up to their level. And how do you propose to judge "a Realised Being?" What criteria do you propose to differentiate "a Realized Being" from "an unrealized Being?" > Many people are attracted to these lists and many are psychotic and > schizophrenic. Is that so? And how many have confessed this to you? > Most people have to follow a path, otherwise the 'Inner Guru', of > many may not be the Higher Mind but the normal lower mind. The "Inner Guru" is unmistakeable. If 'discovered', it's as sure a thing as the sun rising in the morning. Along with the "Inner Guru" comes an unshakeable and unmistakeable sense of sureness. > I have personal knowledge of some of the results of wrong > approaches, to people, etc etc. At least one I know of never ever > recovered his sanity. Schizophrenia is not "induced" by practices, sadhanas, etc. but is an illness that usually manifests itself by age 24 or so. If it doesn't appear by age 30, it never will. It might be possible that a really nutty sadhana which includes severe mental or emotional austerities could cause some emotional imbalance, but that's all. Namaste, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2001 Report Share Posted June 18, 2001 , "Omkara" <coresite@h...> wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > , "Tony O'Clery" <aoclery> wrote: > > The only people that can teach real meditation are 'Realised > > Beings' like Ramana or Jesus etc. Or people close to that and only > > up to their level. > > And how do you propose to judge "a Realised Being?" What criteria do > you propose to differentiate "a Realized Being" from "an unrealized > Being?" > > > Many people are attracted to these lists and many are psychotic and > > schizophrenic. > > Is that so? And how many have confessed this to you? > > > Most people have to follow a path, otherwise the 'Inner Guru', of > > many may not be the Higher Mind but the normal lower mind. > > The "Inner Guru" is unmistakeable. If 'discovered', it's as sure a > thing as the sun rising in the morning. Along with the "Inner Guru" > comes an unshakeable and unmistakeable sense of sureness. > > > I have personal knowledge of some of the results of wrong > > approaches, to people, etc etc. At least one I know of never ever > > recovered his sanity. > > Schizophrenia is not "induced" by practices, sadhanas, etc. but is an > illness that usually manifests itself by age 24 or so. If it doesn't > appear by age 30, it never will. > > It might be possible that a really nutty sadhana which includes > severe mental or emotional austerities could cause some emotional > imbalance, but that's all. > > Namaste, > > Tim Namaste Tim, I fully understand Schizophrenia,( have you read molecules of the mind?), my first wife died as a result of it. It manifests much earlier than 24 or so, try 14 or so. I never did mention that spiritual practice caused it, some people who suffer from it are on these lists, especially K-lists I recognise it, having lived with it daily. It is not nutty sadhana but a misguided or unguided sadhana that can cause mental imbalance, especially in K. I know one guy who went completely around the twist, practicing what he thought he read in Brunton. Many people on the K lists from time to time, will talk about their mental imbalances, including schizophrenia. Check it out!! With regard to the inner guru, it takes a certain amount of spiritual maturity to recognise the difference between the antahkarana, and the normal lower mind. I said realised or close to it, I don't want to get into the sterile verbal non dualistic jargon. I can't recognise a realised person but I would punt on Jesus and Ramana. I always try and talk from the point of view of personal experience not intellectuality. Om Namah Sivaya..Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2001 Report Share Posted June 19, 2001 , "Omkara" <coresite@h...> wrote: > It might be possible that a really nutty sadhana which includes > severe mental or emotional austerities could cause some emotional > imbalance, but that's all. A really nutty sadhana ? Are you talking about life ? Love, A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2001 Report Share Posted June 19, 2001 Amanda, you slay me! ))))))))))))) ROTFL ))))))))))))))) >A really nutty sadhana ? > >Are you talking about life ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2001 Report Share Posted June 19, 2001 , Dharma <deva@L...> wrote: > Amanda, you slay me! ))))))))))))) ROTFL ))))))))))))))) > > > >A really nutty sadhana ? > > > >Are you talking about life ? Namaste, That wasn't my expression. I thought it was a chocolate bar...ONS..Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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