Guest guest Posted July 13, 2001 Report Share Posted July 13, 2001 Hi Jan, , "jb" <janb@a...> wrote: > º> "The highest form of detachment is the automatic renunciation of > º> the three qualities, the result of Self-experience" > º > ºDetachment couldn't be a good translation, since that is but the > ºopposite of attachment. "Unattachment" seems a little closer, but > ºthe word "automatic" helps clarify the above somewhat. > > The Dutch expression would be "you've been put on the wrong horse" > by the word "detachment". Essential is the phrase "automatic > renunciation" which hints at the fact that the issue of gunas has > become moot. Hence, renunciation itself isn't an issue either and > the author labels that with "highest form of detachment" as there > is no cause for it. The translator goes on to say "the result of Self-experience" though, which hints at a sort of 'cause'. Maybe because if that were left out, "automatic renunciation" might be taken as "something to 'do'(?)." > Here, the cessation of desire means that desire is impossible, not > that desire is suppressed or "non-dualized" by for instance "what > is". Certainly one would 'hope' that the mistake never would be made of thinking desire could be spppressed (not to "come out" again later). Regarding "non-dualized" by 'what is', that only sounds silly :-). > Hence, the impossibility of having desires is but another > expression for "automatic renunciation"... So there isn't a > discrepancy between the translations... That sounds like a good assessment. Joy & Happiness, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 13, 2001 Report Share Posted July 13, 2001 On 7/13/01 at 10:38 AM Omkara wrote: ºHi Jan, º º, "jb" <janb@a...> wrote: º> º> "The highest form of detachment is the automatic renunciation of º> º> the three qualities, the result of Self-experience" º> º º> ºDetachment couldn't be a good translation, since that is but the º> ºopposite of attachment. "Unattachment" seems a little closer, but º> ºthe word "automatic" helps clarify the above somewhat. º> º> The Dutch expression would be "you've been put on the wrong horse" º> by the word "detachment". Essential is the phrase "automatic º> renunciation" which hints at the fact that the issue of gunas has º> become moot. Hence, renunciation itself isn't an issue either and º> the author labels that with "highest form of detachment" as there º> is no cause for it. º ºThe translator goes on to say "the result of Self-experience" though, ºwhich hints at a sort of 'cause'. Maybe because if that were left ºout, "automatic renunciation" might be taken as "something ºto 'do'(?)." No, "the result of Self-experience" means this: In the same sense that when living in a room without windows where the roof suddenly disappears and the sky is seen, attachment (the roof) cannot be found anymore. Hence looking for a cause is futile as none is found because the memory of the effects of the roof disappears simultaneously with the roof. What remains in memory is the date (number), when the sky was seen º º> Here, the cessation of desire means that desire is impossible, not º> that desire is suppressed or "non-dualized" by for instance "what º> is". º ºCertainly one would 'hope' that the mistake never would be made of ºthinking desire could be spppressed (not to "come out" again later). ºRegarding "non-dualized" by 'what is', that only sounds silly :-). Desire will vanish in the same sense that the visibility stars gets less even before the rising sun becomes visible. But there will be a moment where the stars cannot be seen anymore. Manifested life could be said to revolve around desires, so it's unlikely they will "leave" that easy - particularly "pure" desires: "Freedom" could be said to be a kind of vacuum which Nature abhors. Add this to the 'moral and ethics' the 'holy men' are supposed to live up to and a drama like happened to Jnanadeva's parents will be predictable... º º> Hence, the impossibility of having desires is but another º> expression for "automatic renunciation"... So there isn't a º> discrepancy between the translations... º ºThat sounds like a good assessment. Although for some, the Sutras seem to be "dualistic", that is just what that may seem. To me, it is the most complete and yet concise, "roadmap"... Freedom, Jan º ºJoy & Happiness, º ºTim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.