Guest guest Posted August 2, 2001 Report Share Posted August 2, 2001 On 8/2/01 at 8:41 AM EBlackstead (AT) cs (DOT) com wrote: hamsayogini & Friends, The notion that this relative world is illusion has it's roots in ancient Vedic and Buddhistic thought, where it is posited that only that which "does not or can not change" is "real". Hence, only the Absolute is real, and everything else is illusion. This notion has been further reinforced by Hindu sages and the Buddha's observation that from the Realised state, this life appears to be as a dream. Hamsa Yogini, I, too, am a Saivite, and believe as you do that Maya is Yogamaya, the creative power behind this relative world. It seems to me that this is a much better conception of reality to hold to in the modern world. It is quite significant that Vedic and Buddhist Absolutism gave birth to sadhana's that are so radical from a modern perspective as to seem impossible of accomplishment. Consider the sadhana of Ramakrishna's vedantic guru, Totapuri. It is unimaginable that someone could adhere to such a strict unyielding system of practices outside of the traditional context of rural India. I'm glad to read your contributions to this list. yours in the bonds, eric A funny subject - why label life as dream or illusion? Not only did such labels raise suspicion about the labeler as unable to cope with life "as is", such labeling could be interpreted as 'the' supreme misunderstanding... Not only isn't there a borderline between spiritual and worldly, it could be argued that nonduality (unable to discriminate between 'i' and 'you') is a necessity, to live a happy life that is sustainable as long as the sun is a white dwarf... So what if living a "natural" life (love, marriage, kids, friends) the "proper" way would "deliver" nonduality not only as a "boon" to continue life & spread the good news but would "deliver" the "beyond love & compassion" (Nirguna Brahman) when the mind-body's term is finished? What would that mean to renunciators & cave-dwellers? Rare curiosities? Yes!!! That's no longer my cup of tea, dear friends Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 2001 Report Share Posted August 2, 2001 Dear Jan, color:navy;mso-color-alt:windowtext"> You wrote: color:navy;mso-color-alt:windowtext"> … why label life as dream or illusion? Not only did such labels raise suspicion about the labeler as unable to cope with life "as is", such labeling could be interpreted as 'the' supreme misunderstanding... (my italics) Jan, you are so right on. Thank you for stating this so succinctly… Jan: Not only isn't there a borderline between spiritual and worldly, it could be argued that nonduality (unable to discriminate between 'i' and 'you') is a necessity, to live a happy life that is sustainable as long as the sun is a white dwarf... color:navy;mso-color-alt:windowtext"> No discrimination… for sure, no “between Arial;color:#0F0F0F;font-style:italic"> yes"> 'i' and 'you' “at all… “Between,” be-tween, from Middle English “be-twene”, preposition & adverb, from Old English be- + two 12.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;mso-ascii-font-family:Arial;mso-hansi-font-family: Arial;mso-char-type:symbol;mso-symbol-font-family:Wingdings">à 10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial">betwEonum, (dative plural) Jan: So what if living a "natural" life (love, marriage, kids, friends) the "proper" way would "deliver" nonduality not only as a "boon" to continue life & spread the good news but would "deliver" the "beyond love & compassion" (Nirguna Brahman) when the mind-body's term is finished? mso-color-alt:windowtext"> Yes, neat! And may I suggest that we can even dispense with the “what if? When fully immersed in in-discriminate unity of human love, the steady state of unconditional blissful being is realized. Onlookers and observers alike can recognize this condition-less state as a ‘steady and irreversible state of eternal bliss, ecstasy and glory.’ This state is actually our original innate state of being… however grand those words may sound and however masked by the social, moral and religious persona that state may seem to be. The ‘person’ really is no more than a “respondent” to social, legal, moral and religious requirements and prerequisites. line-break"> That chimera of responsiveness to those requirements and prerequisites, the illusions of threats and promises, that chimera only veils our original state of bliss. While under duress, we humans consider these threats and promises as though they are more real than that our original and innate state of blissful selves. We came to believe that we could be manipulated to live in servitude with only conditional possibilities of freedom and happiness. But, our innate state of blissful selfhood has never left us, although it may seem to lie dormant for as long as it is un-seen, un-acknowledged, un-re-cognized and even denied. When we re-integrate ourselves, the recovery of our original blissful being is called realization. The answer to “Who Am I?” The reality of who we are authentically. color:#0F0F0F">That's no longer my cup of tea, dear friends Jan and I will have hot chocolate instead… Love, Wim Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.265 / Virus Database: 137 - Release 7/18/2001 Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.265 / Virus Database: 137 - Release 7/18/2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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