AW: A Repost/Question and Answer :-)

October 8, 2001

Dear Gloria,

allow me to return the compliment. Your words hit squarely at the core

of this subtle argument. You aren't an undercover professor of

philosophy, by any chance? :-)

Your quote of Wittgenstein is also very pertinent to the problem

discussed. Wittgenstein was very close to the philosophers of the

Vienna Circle (Wiener Kreis), a philosophical school of Logical

Positivism around Gödel (of Gödel's Theorem fame), Carnap, Waismann,

and others. I admired them greatly when I was a student, and still

do. Their work centered around the idea of analyzing and formalizing

language so that it could become a vehicle precise enough to

transport philosophical meaning. Well, it turned out that even Formal

Languages are inherently, and of necessity, fraught with limitations

and inconsistencies, so much so that we seem to be reduced to

Wittgenstein's famous dictum enunciated in his Tractatus

Logico-Philosophicus, "Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, davon muss man

schweigen." (What we cannot speak about we must pass over in

silence.)

Thanks, also, for your post of that little gem, "God Speaking." I will pass this on.

Michael

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----Von: Gloria Lee

[glee (AT) citlink (DOT) net]Gesendet: Friday, October 05, 2001 23:54An:

Betreff: Re: Re: A

Repost/Question and Answer :-)

Dear Mike,

It was puzzles like this that probably prompted Wittgenstein to remark

that "Philosophy is a trick played on humanity by the Greeks."

Paradoxes made only of language rules simply cannot exist in reality.

And you are correct that the way to solve it is simply to show how the

question is flawed. Now how did you get so smart?

Glo

- MikeSuesserott (AT) t-online (DOT) de

Friday, October 05, 2001 5:40 PM

AW: Re: A Repost/Question and Answer :-)

Dear Eric and James,

thanks for your replies, and my apologies for my responding so late -

seems I overlooked both your posts.

Can an all-powerful God create a stone too heavy to lift for Himself?

And if so, how can He be all-powerful since He cannot lift it? I do

not know the original source of this question, but I am reasonably

sure it was one of the paradoxa discussed in the Christian Scholastic

literature of the Middle Ages.

I would offer that these kinds of questions are instances of the human

intellect proving its own limitations. The finite mind of man,

circumscribed as it is by the law of causation, bound in the

categories of time and space, seems unable to deal with the qualities

of an Infinite Being that is without cause and beyond time and space.

I believe you can't even answer yes or no here. It just doesn't apply

- the question itself is already flawed. It's like asking, can an

architect build a house that is bigger than yellow? And if he can't,

how can he be an architect?

All the best,

Michael

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----Von: ErcAshfrd (AT) aol (DOT) com

[ErcAshfrd (AT) aol (DOT) com]Gesendet: Wednesday, October 03, 2001

17:38An: Betreff: Re:

Re: A Repost/Question and Answer :-)

Hi Mike and James, I think the answer is Yes also. Like the universe,

everything is self supporting. Only rocks that can actually be lifted

up can be dropped on you. Don't try this at home kids. smiles eric.

Hi Mike, The answer is yes. The stone is the question that you

asked (or its variations). Love, james ,

MikeSuesserott@t... wrote: > Dear Harsha, > > thanks for the

early-morning smiles your repost brought to this lister. I > had

taken a sabbatical from the list when it seemed there was too much

venom > going around here for a time; on returning, I am glad to see

a spirit of > love and friendship - and some good-humored banter, too

- in this satsangha > once again. > > Now here is another ponderous

question for which your ultimate view would be > needed. If God is

all-powerful, can He create a stone too heavy to lift even > for

Himself? > > Bet you can't answer that one. :-)) > > Take care, > >

Michael Suesserott > > > > -----Ursprungliche Nachricht----- > > Von:

Harsha [harsha-hkl@h...] > > Gesendet: Wednesday, October 03,

2001 00:07 > > An: ; Nisargadatta > >

Betreff: A Repost/Question and Answer :-) > > > > >

> I was deleting some mail and found this. Can't resist reposting it

again! > > :-). > > > > Harsha > > > > > >

Daniel Berkow [berkowd@u...] > > > > A question I have

here > > is when is nondefensive trust > > possible, when can

"the > > intent to be one-up" be released, > > when is equality

and > > honest sharing possible, > > including sharing > > of

critiques without defense -- > > according to your view? > > > >

______ > > According to my view,

based on top notch astrological research, this is > > possible when

Jupiter is in Pluto and Saturn is in Neptune and Mars is in > > Venus

while sun and the moon are both in harmony and are eclipsing each > >

other and the eclipse has become self-canceling so everything > >

appears bright > > in the daylight and dark at night. > > > > I

believe this is the definitive view because it is my view. > > > >

Thanks for asking > > Love > > Harsha > > > > > > > >

/join > > > >

> > > >

> > > > All paths go somewhere. No path

goes nowhere. Paths, places, > > sights, perceptions, and indeed all

experiences arise from and > > exist in and subside back into the

Space of Awareness. Like waves > > rising are not different than the

ocean, all things arising from > > Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness. Awareness does not come > > and go but is always Present.

It is Home. Home is where the Heart > > Is. Jnanis know the Heart to

be the Finality of Eternal Being. A > > true devotee relishes in the

Truth of Self-Knowledge, > > spontaneously arising from within into

It Self. Welcome all to > > a. > > > > > > > > Your use

of is subject to > > >

> /join

All paths go

somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions,

and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back

into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It

is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self.

Welcome all to a. Your use of is subject

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