Guest guest Posted December 15, 2001 Report Share Posted December 15, 2001 Dear Wayne, At one point in my life, about 38 years ago, I was actually a fledgling young Trappist monk. My monastic name was Frater Didymus Borsboom OCSO, in the abbey "Maria Toevlucht" in Zundert, the Netherlands. I will not go into too much detail about what happened to me there, but some may know already. What I can tell you though is that it was an immensely important experience. More than just obliquely, the issue raised in the incident with Mark, has to do with Thomas Merton and some admirers of him there. One of them was a very unhappy and deeply suffering man, a man with more than paedophile tendencies, who at the moment, is in the process of getting things sorted out. Maybe at some point I will tell the story of how I got to become a monk, how I was a monk and how I left a monk... and what happened to me after... still a monk but in a Buddhist sort of way..., let me say Tantric... Vajrayana. Of course very few of you on the Thomas Merton and Perceptions of Life list knew of my existence prior to the unfortunate incident with Mark, but (as some of you did) drawing conclusions, without first inquiring for more information, was rather premature... Wayne, you wrote to Jerry Katz: >>>I appreciate what you had to say, but I still see no place for this kind of "stuff" in this Merton group or for me any other group.<<< Wayne, with all due respect, this is not about "stuff"... This incident had to do with unconditional love and truth being vilified... "Turning the other cheek...", as someone mentioned? Oh, I have no problem with that... some of you were already slapping it... Thank you :-))) >>> For some of us, we have just remembered the death of Merton as of December 10. <<< Good that you mention the date of Thomas Merton's transition into eternal life, that was indeed December 10, 1968 in Bangkok, (It was still December 9 in the USA, the feast day of Our Lady of Immaculate Conception.) Now, what does that have to do with me? My wife (Emmy, who by then had read pretty well all of Merton's books translated into Dutch) and myself got married on December 9, 1968 in Holland. The date and time of our wedding ceremony, considering the time difference with Bangkok, was on the very same day and at the very same time that Thomas Merton's shower accident occurred in Bangkok. Incidentally, my wife Emmy was the sister of a Trappist monk Pachomius also from Zundert, who, while I was in "Abdij Maria Toevlucht" introduced me to Thomas Merton. On December 8, 1963 I became a novice Trappist monk... on the feast of the Immaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary (which feast was originally celebrated on December the 9 in the Oriental Catholic church). After I left monastic life, I came to work in a parish and church devoted to "O. L. V. van Onbevlekte Ontvangenis" or Our Lady of Immaculate Conception! Interesting coincidences regarding dates and Mary's Immaculate Conception...? There's more, on December 9, 1944, during the hunger winter in Holland, I was a dying baby in a, by the Germans, occupied hospital. My mother, after praying fervently to Our Lady of Immaculate Conception, got a message from Her to rush to that hospital with a pram and rescue me... In the nick of time...! It was just decided by the German overseer, that I was not to receive any medical help and I was literally discarded to die. I still remember the physical shock of being 'thrown' down... I have since been able to sort things out with this, now beautiful, man. He passed on three years ago in Germany. There was an enormous amount of suffering in that man and the compassion that surrounded his release three years ago was indeed miraculous... Guess on what date this got sorted out... December 9, 1998. So on December 9, 1944, my mother, when she picked me up from that hospital, got me out of my second near death experience (I have had seven). I remember so many details..., details that I could luckily compare and corroborate with my mom's memories this last summer when she visited us here in Canada from Holland. She passed into eternal life a month ago, lovingly united with my father who went over into eternity a year ago. By the way, it was because of Thomas Merton and the later abbot of 'Maria Toevlucht', Jeroen, that my interest in Buddhism got rekindled. Rekindled indeed, as, when I was 14 years old, I wrote a major essay on Buddhism after I had received a personal visionary visitation by Gautama Shakyamuni, the Buddha. He told me personally what he meant by illusion and suffering, which is not exactly what is traditionally taught in the more "religious" versions of Buddhism (Hinayana or better Theravada.) On my website www.aurasphere.org in some pages, I go into more detail about the meaning of suffering and illusion, based on the way the Buddha Gautama divulged it to me. But let me state it here more succinctly: Culminating in a period of ecstatic samadhis when I was 18, which eventually had me enter monastic life, allowing myself to live in a steady state of unconditional love, inspired wisdom and bliss, (the glorious presence of divine humans or human divines) it is the following that I discovered through the Buddha when I was 14: .. The stagnant state of abject life that people usually and habitually live, is a game of manipulative and illusive negative strategies. This is called suffering. .. This suffering is illusion, as it is based on the over-mentalized conceptual dualism of polarities in the brain (yin and yang) as well as action and anti-action in the body. .. This stagnate state of abject illusion is treated as more real or substantial than living, playing and enjoying the natural state of physical reality as it is lived through and with the dynamic and scalar frequencies of light energy. (The multidimensional and poly-individual gradations and interferences within form and void. The empty vessel holding the ten thousand things.) .. Only when we dissolve this conceptual and illusive states of dualism and polarities and its game rules of posing, opposing and supposing, do we, through the illumination of clarity, insight and joyousness, recover the play that life is, living in glory and wisdom. Love, Wim wayneburnsB [wayneburnsB] Friday, December 14, 2001 12:09 PM thomasmerton Re: [thomasmerton] Digest Number 764 Jerry: I appreciate what you had to say, but I still see no place for this kind of "stuff" in this Merton group or for me any other group. We have personal email addresses for that... To me it would be so good to deal with the life and work of Thomas Merton. But, it seems to me that that is not the reason most are in here. However, I have been wrong before. For some of us, we have just remember the death of Merton as of December 10. Wayne --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.306 / Virus Database: 166 - Release 12/4/2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2001 Report Share Posted December 15, 2001 In a message dated 12/15/01 4:26:07 AM Pacific Standard Time, wim writes: << By the way, it was because of Thomas Merton and the later abbot of 'Maria Toevlucht', Jeroen, that my interest in Buddhism got rekindled. Rekindled indeed, as, when I was 14 years old, I wrote a major essay on Buddhism after I had received a personal visionary visitation by Gautama Shakyamuni, the Buddha. He told me personally what he meant by illusion and suffering, which is not exactly what is traditionally taught in the more "religious" versions of Buddhism (Hinayana or better Theravada.) >> Hello William! Hey, your buddy Shakyamuni told ME he was just playing with your head! Loved the autobiography though! )) love, jerrysan rinpoche Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2001 Report Share Posted December 15, 2001 Hi, my dear Jerry, You wrote: >>>Hello William! Hey, your buddy Shakyamuni told ME he was just playing with your head! Loved the autobiography ***though!*** )) <<< Though??? What though??? Play though??? Grey matter play dough??? I see, Shakyamuni was playing with your head as well then... hehe hehehe... :-) Well by the looks of it, he gave you as big a smile as he gave me )) love and play la lila lila play and love lila lila li love your play, y'r play hey li lalita lay hey ! Hey, Jerry, I like it that you call me William, you can call me Wilhelm as well... That's how they call me in Connecticut... (Shall I tell you the story of my ancestry??? Nothing to do with William Tell though. 's Got to do with Wilhelm of Orange and Julius Caesar and Joshua... hahe haheha) Love you, Jerry, Wim )) --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.306 / Virus Database: 166 - Release 12/4/2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2001 Report Share Posted December 16, 2001 In a message dated 12/15/01 2:21:54 PM Pacific Standard Time, wim writes: << Hey, Jerry, I like it that you call me William, you can call me Wilhelm as well... That's how they call me in Connecticut... (Shall I tell you the story of my ancestry??? >> Uhhh ..... no. Please. jerrysan rinpoche )) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2001 Report Share Posted December 16, 2001 .....hmmm.... "If you try hard enough, you can remember anything." -Rodman Philbrick in "Freak the Mighty" .....i met a bodhisattva on the road and she didn't say anything....she picked up her bag and headed further up the mountain....i'm still following her....funny thing is that every time i try to pass her i end up stumbling backwards a step or two to discover that she is also behind me to catch me and make sure i don't fall too far....funnier still, when i look into the mirror in the morning after waking from dream she is always looking right back at me....funniest thing of all, she never says anything to me because she is always listening and waiting for me to say the right thing....when i do, she smiles and merely picks up her bag again and heads down-stairs, makes breakfast, washes the dishes and then takes the dog for a walk in the park....as i walk with her through throughout the day i find she is holding my hand helping me to stop forgetting that i am always, no matter the appearances of things, walking further up and further into the sacred mountain.....after each successive 'enlightenment' the dirty dishes are still there to teach us that always the journey begins again.....what does my bodhisattva teach me, what do i hear myself telling her?.....humility is infinite.....the ground of humility is love....all that is, exists between these poles....this grand duality is reconciled by the compassion in the sacred heart of the noble warrior.....i follow my beloved....my mirabai teaches me, to paraphrase the motto written in her heart, our hearts are carved out of eternal suffering by immortal love.....redemption is realized as we discover that the goal is the journey....the lover and the beloved are one.....as long as one creature suffers, i am and remain....^^~~~~~ further up and further in, white wolfe > He told me personally what he meant by illusion and suffering, which is not > exactly what is traditionally taught in the more "religious" versions of > Buddhism (Hinayana or better Theravada.) > >> > > Hello William! Hey, your buddy Shakyamuni told ME he was just playing > with your head! Loved the autobiography though! )) > > love, > jerrysan rinpoche > > > /join > > > > > > All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. > > > > Your use of is subject to > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2001 Report Share Posted December 17, 2001 Dear Mark, Could you please tell me why you started your response to the exchange between Jerry and myself with...: >>> ....hmmm.... "If you try hard enough, you can remember anything." -Rodman Philbrick in "Freak the Mighty" <<< I had written: > He (my buddy Shakyamuni :-) told me personally what he meant by illusion and suffering, > which is not exactly what is traditionally taught in the more "religious" > versions of Buddhism (Hinayana or better Theravada.) Jerry wrote: > Hello William! Hey, your buddy Shakyamuni told ME he was just playing > with your head! Loved the autobiography though! )) Mark, in a post from you, a while ago, you urged me to read the deeper meaning behind words. I may need some help with this, how am I to read your "...hmmm..." and your quote? How am I to read the reason for you sending me this quote? I have only read reviews of the "Mighty..." books by Philbrick. Just going by the gist of the reviews, am I to understand that you are telling me that I live in a world of imaginations? Are you telling me that I am making this all up, this Buddha, Jesus, Adam, etc. material that I write about? Are you telling me that what I write about is beyond or beside the truth? What ARE you telling me? Remember your 'apology'! Was this just a short lived apology? You wrote: >>>Please accept this email as a second attempt and sincere at a formal apology for any errors in good judgment I made while addressing you in cyberspace.<<< Does your apology still stand? Is your good judgement still good and free of errors? Do you still have doubts about my integrity? The last Near Death Experience that I went through, the one in Denver in April 1999 (after the Columbine shooting), made me realize that, "Indeed, we will remember everything." It is indeed what happens on that ' verge between modes of existence ', usually called death. It is the most wonderful experience, during which one also realizes that 'memories' are neatly separated out between the ones that are illusive and the ones that are real. The demarcation between these two kind of memories is quite exquisite. The illusive ones carry the memories of 'suffering manipulation while being (ab)used under duress'; the real ones are the memories of the episodes of truth, where love, clarity and reality reign supreme. It is the real ones, that help one find that bottomless source of compassion to help release one's suffering abusers. I may want to play with your quote a bit... "If you try hard enough, you can remember anything." can become "Even if you try hard enough, you can't forget anything, because... you don't have to, as the glorious reality of love and clarity dissolve the suffering of illusion and makes one realize that only love is." Love you, Mark, Wim --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.306 / Virus Database: 166 - Release 12/4/2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2001 Report Share Posted December 17, 2001 Wim: Mark, in a post from you, a while ago, you urged me to read the deeper meaning behind words. I may need some help with this, how am I to read your "...hmmm..." and your quote? You can try reading it from left to right... however, from right to left may have an acceptable outcome too... How am I to read the reason for you sending me this quote? I have only read reviews of the "Mighty..." books by Philbrick. Just going by the gist of the reviews, am I to understand that you are telling me that I live in a world of imaginations? One may imagine that one is to understand that one is telling one that one.... However, how to verify this. You may be only imagining that you are to understand anything at all.... One may understand all as a world of imaginations in which one lives, or understand it as a world of truth in which one doesn't live, or as life in which one imagines truth. or as truth in which one imagines world.... Maybe.... just maybe.... nothing is what it seems to be... maybe you have been "taken by the nose?" Are you telling me that I am making this all up, this Buddha, Jesus, Adam, etc. material that I write about? Are you telling me that what I write about is beyond or beside the truth? What ARE you telling me? errrrr? (can be read left to right or vice versa) If there is truth... then what is beside it? Does truth have a beside? Remember your 'apology'! Was this just a short lived apology? You wrote: >>>Please accept this email as a second attempt and sincere at a formal apology for any errors in good judgment I made while addressing you in cyberspace.<<< Does your apology still stand? Is your good judgment still good and free of errors? Do you still have doubts about my integrity? Ooooh, now that is sad.... someone having doubts about your integrity... that is absolutely unacceptable.... maybe you should sue the guy... The last Near Death Experience that I went through, the one in Denver in April 1999 (after the Columbine shooting), made me realize that, "Indeed, we will remember everything." It is indeed what happens on that ' verge between modes of existence ', usually called death. It is the most wonderful experience, during which one also realizes that 'memories' are neatly separated out between the ones that are illusive and the ones that are real. Wowowow... an independent source that can actually discern between real memories and illusive memories... Of course the existence of such independent authority depends on the assumption that there actually is such thing... but who or what would be verifying that? The demarcation between these two kind of memories is quite exquisite. The illusive ones carry the memories of 'suffering manipulation while being (ab)used under duress'; the real ones are the memories of the episodes of truth, where love, clarity and reality reign supreme. Thus creating a wonderful split reality.... Don't you love the power of creation? I just love duality.... It is the real ones, that help one find that bottomless source of compassion to help release one's suffering abusers. I may want to play with your quote a bit... "If you try hard enough, you can remember anything." can become "Even if you try hard enough, you can't forget anything, because... you don't have to, as the glorious reality of love and clarity dissolve the suffering of illusion and makes one realize that only love is." As long as you believe that "only love is", and the rest is not... well... I think that's a "lovely" belief... but still... just a belief.... You know what? I much prefer satsangs quote.... it truly sums it up "Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home." No place like home huh? Mira Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2001 Report Share Posted December 18, 2001 Dear Mira, I wrote: >>>The last Near Death Experience that I went through, the one in Denver in April 1999 (after the Columbine shooting), made me realize that, "Indeed, we will remember everything." It is indeed what happens on that ' verge between modes of existence ', usually called death. It is the most wonderful experience, during which one also realizes that 'memories' are neatly separated out between the ones that are illusive and the ones that are real.<<< You wrote: >>>Wowowow... an independent source that can actually discern between real memories and illusive memories...<<< Let me just state it more precisely. The characteristics of memories of illusions (illusive memories) and memories of reality (real memories) are quite distinct at the moment of passing from one mode of existence to another (e.g. at the instance that we usually call 'death'.) The illusive memories dissolve very, very quickly under the clarity of divine compassion... I had to be very much and very quickly on my toes, so to say, to notice that 'melting point'. Mind you, as I have stated before, I have had 7 NDEs... One gets good at this... :-) It is my job, so to say, to figure this out... So, as you say: >>>Wowowow... an independent source that can actually discern between real memories and illusive memories...<<< Yes, yes, yes... ! But...what do I detect there Mira? A bit of scorn maybe? :-))) Mira, why, rather than reacting the way you do, why don't you just ask me how (what I experienced) it is possible, or how it comes about, or how one discerns the illusive from the real? Or... oh shoot... Wim... :-((( Did I just mistakenly read 'scorn' into your response, Mira? Maybe... you were really in awe when you said, "Wowowow..." Do you have a sense of humour??? Yes Mira, that what I wrote in that paragraph is ACTUALLY what happens on the verge of that transition phase when that, what people call 'death', occurs.... And by the way... I am not the first one to attest to that. It is actually quite neat, there is quite some mythical, spiritual and religious history behind all this... Ramana Maharshi calls this discernment of reality, "Subjective Self Inquiry," which is advaita..., having nothing to do with duality. People who still adhere to the concept of polarity, kind of 'skew and twist' this singular discernment with a 'torque-ish turn', causing a kind of distortion like 'double vision', some sort of philosophical a-stigmatism. They come to 'see' a conceptual distinction between 'evil and goodness' or to say it in more contemporary terms, a conceptual distinction between 'negative and positive'. (Which view, by the way, is now mathematically and scientifically untenable and has been fully surpassed, as evidenced by current macro-cosmic and micro-cosmic theories using measurements of scalar or gauge relationships exclusively.) During extended periods of time in human history, this set of flawed dualistic views of polarized distinctions within a singular reality, got ' within the mind's eye ' transposed or projected to an extrapolated and humanized, external philosophical and religious entity, a being that used to be called God/dess. (Or any other patriarchal or matriarchal variant or combination of variants of this.) Of course that still happens, it happens to people who 'believe'. 'People of belief' still tend to take something, e.g. a system of beliefs, on someone else's authority, very often for the benefit of a reward or for merit if they do, or under the threat of punishment (demerit) if they do not. These are usually people who, while under duress, were forced to lose their franchise to someone else's authority. An authority, often culminating into an extrapolated image, of a God/dess who is still more or less positioned 'up there' or 'down here', very often in a symbolic manner and garbed with appropriate language and imagery: the Father God (in Heaven) or the Mother God (on Earth); no matter what, a judicial power that (in Dutch) "het kaf van het koren moet scheiden", separating grain from chaff and straw in a moral sort of way. You wrote: >>> Of course the existence of such independent authority depends on the assumption that there actually is such thing... but who or what would be verifying that?<<< I do, you do... or at least you can... but such independent authority is NOT extrapolated, it is WHO answers to the question "Who am I?" I wrote: >>> The demarcation between these two kind of memories is quite exquisite. The illusive ones carry the memories of 'suffering manipulation while being (ab)used under duress'; the real ones are the memories of the episodes of truth, where love, clarity and reality reign supreme.<<< You write: >>>Thus creating a wonderful split reality....<<< No, no... why don't you ask me what I mean, instead of understanding it your usual way. (You could of course also read my previous posts on this...) The 'SEEMING REALITIES' of THREATENED punishments and PROMISED rewards, are strategies and manoeuvres that a manipulator or power monger tries to convince you of THAT THEY ARE REAL. It is interesting that in the 'game of chess' these manipulations are done with real puppets, while in the game of 'pseudo life' these manoeuvres are done as manipulations within the theatre of the mind: mind games. In the game of chess, both players have a chance to win, or at least the 'loser' may actually learn from the strategies of the winner and may eventually come out a better player. In the manipulating game of pseudo life, the chances to win are much less, and strategies for winning are kept hidden through ploys of confusion and ambiguity. Perpetrators of dependency and slavery (these only 'seem' to be old fashioned words) do that through the fear, angst and terror that they instil. That 'seeming reality' actually does not exist, except in token exemplary punishments and token exemplary rewards that only 'look real enough', but most of the time just hang above the heads of the manipulated or abused. Fear, angst and terror are just more serious forms, as well as, at the same time, characteristics of paranoia, which... also does not exist except... within the theatre of the mind. Paranoia, just like angst, fear and 'scares' are not for nothing filed away under the headings illusions or delusions. They do not exist in the reality of the world of perceptions through the senses. They do not exist period, except in the chimeras of the mind, that is why they are called illusions or delusions. (And by the way, 'illusion' or 'nothing' is not the opposite of reality, reality has no opposite! ... ... ... Just hang in there... or if you wish... try to follow me :-) Whatever conceptual idea we may have about the opposite of reality cannot exist in reality. If it is not reality, it simply does not exist, non existence cannot exist, non existence has absolutely no sense of reality, 'nothing' makes no sense in reality. It simply is not, also 'it is not even not'. If it is anything it is only an ambiguous thought pattern run amok, like a number divided by 0 makes infinite non-sense. Only 'what is' exists, 'what is not' is a non-sense statement, a philosophically flawed concept, just a pathology of erroneous or deluded brain/mind functioning. This pathology can be defined as: "Thinking an imaginative thought is as good as or as real as giving it shape in reality" This just makes no sense as it does not even make or reach the senses...) The strategies behind manipulation, which all lead to deep MENTAL experiences of suffering, are taken more seriously than the freedom of love, truth and happiness, as the threats behind the manipulations are shown to be more real through exemplary executions of punishment; shown to be more real by examples of inflictions of pain or the threats of such inflictions, merely showing what would happen if one does not succumb manipulative authority. What use is it to power mongers to really exterminate the people who he or she aims to control? The perpetrator of malice would not have anything to control if their threats were realized, MADE REAL. They could not afford to make the illusive threats fully real, act out the threats to the fullest extent, lest they lose their victims... A dead victim is worthless to a person of malicious intent...Terrified victims are the pawns in their game of make belief... You wrote: >>> Don't you love the power of creation? I just love duality....<<< Could it be that you are mistakenly using the word 'creation'. The word 'creation' in origin has only to do with conCREte matter, KRI in Sanskrit, making real things, res in Latin, reality. Reality is the world of perceived THINGS, perceived, captured so to say with the senses, weighed and measured (the original Sanskrit meaning of the Sanskrit term 'Maya'.) Whatever else is out there... is illusion, that is why it is 'out there...', 'out of this world...' >>>...The power of creation...?<<< You must have had the word 'imagination' in mind..., yes it is confusing, as you were probably made to be confused.... And by the way, in 'creation' (as in the meaning of 'nature'), 'the world of the concrete' there is no duality, that has been scientifically demonstrated, starting off with Einstein's laws of relativity. Duality only 'persists' in the conceptual mind of an imaginary conceptual beholder, it does not exist ... except in a conceptual sort of way. I wrote: >>> I may want to play with your quote a bit... "If you try hard enough, you can remember anything." can become "Even if you try hard enough, you can't forget anything, because... you don't have to, as the glorious reality of love and clarity dissolves the suffering of illusion and makes one ***realize*** that only love is."<<< You wrote: >>> As long as you believe that "only love is", and the rest is not...<<< I did use the word 'realize', I did not use the word 'belief' Someone living in reality simply does not need beliefs., >>>I think that's a "lovely" belief... but still... just a belief....<<< For you, Mira, that maybe so, I don't know... But love is real, as real as truth and reality...(love is 'ananda', real is 'sat', truth is 'chit'.) Did you know that Sat Chit Ananda refers to that? Sat is what exists, Chit is knowing that existence intimately through our sense organs and Ananda is the bliss you get from that intense knowing as you love it. (That is where originally the term 'carnal knowledge' came from.) >>> You know what? I much prefer satsangs quote.... it truly sums it up "Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness.<<< Of course, how can Harsha have it wrong? I concur... Notice that he in no way uses words like 'concept' or 'belief' or 'ignorance from confusion and ambiguity'. That "Space of Awareness" is absolutely real, filled as it is with more concreteness than what you are sitting on right now... Filled as that Space of Awareness is with Forms that elicits Awareness... as the Bodhisattva Avalokiteshvara says in the Prajna Paramita Hhridaya Sutra (Diamond Sutra): Emptiness is Form, Form is Emptiness, etc. (Scientifically we could even say that the Space of Awareness is filled with Gravity Waves.) Harsha: "Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, ***all things arising from Awareness*** are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home." And what is Home without Inhabitants (and all things miraculous... like eh... furniture)? And what are Inhabitants without Home (and all things miraculous... like eh... furniture)? Mira, do you know the nature of equations? What is on the one side of the equal sign is equivalent to what is on the other side, and vice versa. "All things arising from Awareness" "Awareness arising from all things" Like you said, you can read it from left to right and from right to left. Awareness cannot be without all things. All things cannot be without awareness... Awareness without a relatedness to things is nonsense, does not make sense, it does not make (reach) the senses. Form is Emptiness is sometimes 'understood' by people who do not understand it, as "form is in principle empty". But that is not what the equation states, it states that emptiness IS form, no duality there, just a conundrum that is disappears when one lives reality, love, truth. In That All Yours, Mira, Wim. (Awareness cannot be without Things, just as Emptiness and Form cannot be without each other, just like a Lover cannot be without a Beloved who in oneness celebrate the overcoming of two-ness into a three-ness, as Mark and also Arthur Avalon (Sir John Woodroffe) from "The Serpent Power" says. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.306 / Virus Database: 166 - Release 12/4/2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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