Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 Sorry, JB...I can't take your humor seriously. It just seems to lack real sincerity. Methinks it's time for you to return to the cave. Ed...abiding the inner smile. <s> , "jb" <kvy9@l...> wrote: > On 12/23/01 at 9:49 AM Ed wrote: > Can one be a Realized Being without fully understanding human nature? > > <Humor on> > I asked both the dog and the cat: they remained silent. > That sparkled some great insight in the nature of realization > <Humor off> > > Is human nature more clearly understood as an aspect of "something" beyond yet inclusive > of it, such as the "nature of existence"? > > <Humor on> > I asked the cat and she transmitted the following: > There is no such thing as "human" nature - creatures > behave according to their programming which is but a set > of "eat, multiply and die". > <Humor off> > > Can human nature or the human aspect of existence be clearly understood without understanding > how the physiological, psychological, social, economic, political, geographic, historical, and > metaphysical factors affect each other? (Must have missed something here.) > > Yes, missed the unrecorded history of mankind > > Given the conditioning and the pressures of survival that fix our attention to specific areas of daily > living: how can we possibly have a full understanding of human nature? > > <Humor on> > The dog said: "don't ask humans - they are biased. > Ask my alien friends from the Dog Star" > <Humor off> > > PLEASE...serious answers are sorely needed. <s> > > Yes, more answers to generate more questions... > Cats, dogs and mice love to play > > Cartoons forever, > Jan > > neEDy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 On 12/25/01 at 2:57 PM stillpointed wrote: ºSorry, JB...I can't take your humor seriously. Great - seriousness is a lethal, contagious disease... When infected, don't worry, the thread continues º ºIt just seems to lack real sincerity. Isn't that a matter of observing? Mirror, mirror on the wall - who is the sincerest of all: The liar with the sweetest words or the bard with harshest verse? º ºMethinks it's time for you to return to the cave. Thanks for the laugh: The cave never has been left - it just expanded a bit. Fortunately, it doesn't have an address and isn't visible. Yet room for one only hence no visitors allowed "Nature is fractal in nature" Jan º ºEd...abiding the inner smile. <s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 Dear Ed, As long as one is convinced that one has a special and personal reason to hold on to one's difficulties, one will not recover one's innate freedom. Human nature, just like any other natural manifestation is by nature divine. What we usually call 'human nature is really de-natured human. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.306 / Virus Database: 166 - Release 12/4/2001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 , "Wim Borsboom" <wim@a...> wrote: > What we usually call 'human nature is really de-natured human. Or "non-human nature" -- if you think about it, it's the same thing, except that the phrase may be objectionable to those who cling to the label "human" and feel that "humans" are superior somehow. Cheers, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 On 12/26/01 at 12:16 AM fewtch wrote: º, "Wim Borsboom" <wim@a...> wrote: º> What we usually call 'human nature is really de-natured human. º ºOr "non-human nature" -- if you think about it, it's the same thing, ºexcept that the phrase may be objectionable to those who cling to the ºlabel "human" and feel that "humans" are superior somehow. º ºCheers, º ºTim There are some, considering the possibility that humans aren't superior, but "upgraded Neanderthals" (too funny for words): http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/genesis/index.htm and regarding the human origin, the last word probably hasn't been said.. Prosit, Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 Hi Jan, That's an interesting link... i used to speculate the "christian god" was satan, and the so-called satan was "god" (this was when such concerns still meant something :-). Regarding human origin, it's interesting this is an "issue" for many... who cares? When trying to make sense of life, everything is an issue -- when not, it doesn't matter. Cheers, Tim , "jb" <kvy9@l...> wrote: > There are some, considering the possibility that humans aren't > superior, but "upgraded Neanderthals" (too funny for words): > > http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/genesis/index.htm > > and regarding the human origin, the last word probably hasn't been > said.. > > Prosit, > Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 On 12/26/01 at 1:31 AM fewtch wrote: ºHi Jan, º ºThat's an interesting link... i used to speculate the "christian god" ºwas satan, and the so-called satan was "god" (this was when such ºconcerns still meant something :-). As usual - "Lucifer" means something like "bringer of light" - light with a capital l of course. º ºRegarding human origin, it's interesting this is an "issue" for ºmany... who cares? When trying to make sense of life, everything is ºan issue -- when not, it doesn't matter. º ºCheers, º ºTim For those, milling the mind for a "solution" to improve the situation regarding violence, exploitation, environment etc., it could serve as an answer. Often, seemingly complex questions can have a surprisingly simple answer. It is fairly easy to spot the "nondual component" in ancient myths and legends - yet the previous age was the most violent one in recorded history. Prosit, Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 , "jb" <kvy9@l...> wrote: > On 12/26/01 at 1:31 AM fewtch wrote: > > ºHi Jan, > º > ºThat's an interesting link... i used to speculate the "christian > god" > ºwas satan, and the so-called satan was "god" (this was when such > ºconcerns still meant something :-). > > As usual - "Lucifer" means something like > "bringer of light" - light with a capital l of course. Interesting too that the "dualistic religions" (Christianity, Islam, Judaism) present the idea of a "heaven" which resembles the Garden of Eden -- "All desires satisfied," but at the price of slavery under a God... the desire for "eternal bliss" and all pleasures provided prompting such actions as happened 9/11/2001 (many others, too). Most religions also referring to "sin" -- none other than issues of shame and guilt buried under layers of conditioning, with "God" the parental figure -- although maturity of the body may be happening at a younger age, the mind never changes after adolescence (other than added conditioning). Psychiatrists also agree, most adults are at the "emotional age" of around 12. > For those, milling the mind for a "solution" to improve > the situation regarding violence, exploitation, environment etc., > it could serve as an answer. Often, seemingly complex questions > can have a surprisingly simple answer. It is fairly easy to spot > the "nondual component" in ancient myths and legends - yet the > previous age was the most violent one in recorded history. > > > Prosit, > Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 On 12/26/01 at 2:06 AM fewtch wrote: º, "jb" <kvy9@l...> wrote: º> On 12/26/01 at 1:31 AM fewtch wrote: º> º> ºHi Jan, º> º º> ºThat's an interesting link... i used to speculate the "christian º> god" º> ºwas satan, and the so-called satan was "god" (this was when such º> ºconcerns still meant something :-). º> º> As usual - "Lucifer" means something like º> "bringer of light" - light with a capital l of course. º ºInteresting too that the "dualistic religions" (Christianity, Islam, ºJudaism) present the idea of a "heaven" which resembles the Garden of ºEden -- "All desires satisfied," but at the price of slavery under a ºGod... the desire for "eternal bliss" and all pleasures provided ºprompting such actions as happened 9/11/2001 (many others, too). In a certain sense, ancient Rome could be called such a 'paradise' - no matter how strange that may sound. A few years ago a study based on archeological founds was published, showing that the slaves had a more pleasant life than many a 21st century laborer. Of course, at the cost of total obedience - but with 3...5 days of work/week, free housing, entertainment, then, not a problem.. Not to forget the good organically grown food of those days º ºMost religions also referring to "sin" -- none other than issues of ºshame and guilt buried under layers of conditioning, with "God" the ºparental figure -- although maturity of the body may be happening at ºa younger age, the mind never changes after adolescence (other than ºadded conditioning). Psychiatrists also agree, most adults are at ºthe "emotional age" of around 12. Animals don't feel shame - living up to the feelings of the moment. It might have taken a while for "starting" humanity to develop the potential to feel shame. Guilt can be seen in for instance dogs too.. That as a rule, mind doesn't change after adolescence sure does ring a bell... It means, development comes to halt although as a result of processing of experience, change should be continuous... When "awake" such a change is impossible to prevent... And it happens, while aware of it. In Dutch Rosicrucian books, often the apparent gap, dividing mankind, is discussed as it can divide families too: the ability to understand there is "something" beyond the mind, that thought cannot grasp, and feeling attracted to "it". º º> For those, milling the mind for a "solution" to improve º> the situation regarding violence, exploitation, environment etc., º> it could serve as an answer. Often, seemingly complex questions º> can have a surprisingly simple answer. It is fairly easy to spot º> the "nondual component" in ancient myths and legends - yet the º> previous age was the most violent one in recorded history. º> º> º> Prosit, º> Jan º Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2001 Report Share Posted December 25, 2001 , "jb" <kvy9@l...> wrote: > Animals don't feel shame - living up to the feelings of the moment. > It might have taken a while for "starting" humanity to develop the > potential to feel shame. Guilt can be seen in for instance dogs > too.. No surprise then, dogs regarded as "man's best friend" <laugh>. Dogs have been bred over centuries to serve such a role -- 'selective breeding' none other than a sort of conditioning. > That as a rule, mind doesn't change after adolescence sure does > ring a bell... It means, development comes to halt although as a > result of processing of experience, change should be continuous... > When "awake" such a change is impossible to prevent... And it > happens, while aware of it. It also shows that the mind-body are not separate -- adolescence as an "event" can't be pinpointed merely to changes in the body. > In Dutch Rosicrucian books, often the apparent gap, dividing > mankind, is discussed as it can divide families too: the ability to > understand there is "something" beyond the mind, that thought > cannot grasp, and feeling attracted to "it". No surprise -- and that it could appear divisive (but only for those not understanding, of course). Where else could the ideas of "enlightenment" and "ignorance" have appeared (yet another "two sides of the same coin"). Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2001 Report Share Posted December 26, 2001 , "Wim Borsboom" <wim@a...> wrote: > Dear Ed, > > As long as one is convinced that one has a special and personal reason to > hold on to one's difficulties, one will not recover one's innate freedom. > > Human nature, just like any other natural manifestation is by nature divine. > What we usually call 'human nature is really de-natured human. Yes, it's all in how it is seen. Very often someone else's "difficulty" is just a projection of our very own. Ed...abiding with you in the unseen <s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.