to Vicki: the newcomers look

[Guest guest]

Dear Vicki,

I am deeply moved about this sharing of you. As a newcomer one has

perhaps a certain freshness of sight and impressions, something like

an astonished child and is not yet too much involved. But the more I

move here I also see the complexity of this kind of interaction, the

different needs of people and also the "double-edged razors".

I see the crux in revealing oneself to others and suddenly and

unwillingly - in the beginning perhaps unnoticed - playing a certain

kind of ego-game. But nevertheless sharings are always human and a

mostly unmoderated and unrestricted list with such a great number of

members as Harshas will always be a kind of "spiritual potpourri".

 

I do not like to judge over anyone's state of mind or realization or

whatever. Simply I can't! Maybe some see themselves as realized and

want to share their insights and teach others. In the beginning I

also was more negative and quick in pressing the delete-botton, but

meanwhile I see I can learn something. At moment I am learning to

have a closer look - to read more carefully - and sometimes in the

second reading things are not as they seem to be in the first

reading. There is always the possibility to question back: what are

you meaning? What is it what you really want to say? There is always

the possibility that I have misunderstood something or not fully

understood or that I see someone in a wrong light. The ways of

expression are manyfold. Everyone is free to take what is of use for

him/her and leave the rest aside.

 

Dear Vicki, is it really as bad as you tell? That you must pray:

"Please help me not to delude myself and others...." There may be

misleadings and ego-games and .... You can't exclude such things or

prevent that they may happen. Even in Sri Ramana's sorroundings there

was a lot of it. One only can try to have a close look and question

one's own mind and heart. And - in the end - being a Ramana devotee -

we are at home. We also have every protection. Our part is more to be

in touch with the inner silence. Everything else is not so much

important.

 

None prevents you from praying to God, to Ramana... - not even the

"non-dualists" (if they are real ones). Praying is human. Devotees

always prayed to Sri Ramana - what a lot of prayer is and was there!

And why not? (I also like to pray to Ramana - sometimes very

childlike.)

 

Oh yes, I know, I have not your experiences with mailing-lists and

perhaps a too positive sight. But this is still the newcomers look.

 

Love and peace to you and everyone here

Gabriele

[Guest guest]

i am a little puzzled by those who do not love his teachings

and to a list dedicated to Ramana's teachings anyway ,

that is something that i want to understand ...

do you know why ?

Hi Vicki...

I'm here because I love being around Harsha and other good friends

I've made through-out the years.

You also wrote in another post:

i shall always continue to pray to Ramana in my heart ,

my question is again - if this is found astray here ,

then i find myself in front of a problem - where am i wrong ?

You aren't wrong! If you can't pray freely to Ramana,

then I don't want to be here either.

I'm not a Ramana devotee

but I've so much enjoyed getting to know him

and his wisdom and grace

through you, Harsha, and others.

I have no books of his to directly quote,

but I do recall he said, something to the effect of...

Don't look for truth; look for your fears, your illusions.

Those are what is standing in the way to what is true.

You are doing exactly that... and I hope we all still are!

So glad you are here.

Love,

xxxtg

[Guest guest]

Dear Vicki:

In the past few days I have wondered how to say some of the things

you have said so well in your post this morning. Not so much

wondering about correctness on the list as i know Harsha loves Ramana

as much as I do, but about people proclaiming self realization.

 

I like this list because I believe their are several people that are

far enough along to give inspiration truthfully and their honest

kindness and willingness assure me.

 

Ramana's life was so beautiful and beyond reproach that to use his

name for hyprocrasy and self promotion thus leading others away from

his true nature is a great sin no matter how one intellectualizes

concerning it.

 

The few moments a day that i have with him are the best that can be.

I love Sri Ramana and He fills my heart.

 

Love,

Bobby G.

[Guest guest]

Hi Vicki,

 

My understanding is that is a Satsangh of a devotee to

Ramana's teachings (Harsha), but isn't specifically dedicated solely

to the teachings of Ramana -- isn't there a RamanaMaharshi group with

that purpose?

 

Somebody please correct me if i'm wrong...

 

Love,

 

Tim

 

, "vioricail" <viorica@z...> wrote:

> i am a little puzzled by those who do not love his teachings

> and to a list dedicated to Ramana's teachings anyway ,

> that is something that i want to understand ...

>

> do you know why ?

>

> thank you Bobby...

[Guest guest]

Hi Vicki,

 

My understanding is that is a Satsangh of a devotee to

Ramana's teachings (Harsha), but isn't specifically dedicated solely

to the teachings of Ramana -- isn't there a RamanaMaharshi group with

that purpose?

 

Somebody please correct me if i'm wrong...

 

Love,

 

Tim

 

, "vioricail" <viorica@z...> wrote:

> i am a little puzzled by those who do not love his teachings

> and to a list dedicated to Ramana's teachings anyway ,

> that is something that i want to understand ...

>

> do you know why ?

>

> thank you Bobby...

[Guest guest]

Hi Vicki,

 

, "vioricail" <viorica@z...> wrote:

>

> Hi Tim ,

>

> i understand this the same way as you do now ,

> but there was a time when i made no distinction

> between this list and the devotees list ;

>

> promissing everybody to respect the distinction,

>

> nevertheless i would like to ask your

> understanding that i always loved posting Ramana's words and

> i always had to fight my way out of discussions

> and controverses , as Ramana's words are enough to me the way

> they are, and i feel i don't want my participation to have

> anything in common with struggle,fighting and unpleasant

> feelings on this list,on any part ,

 

Sure, you got it... i don't care much for arguing & unpleasantness

either, nor do i want to debate Ramana's teachings... they reflect

the truth as far as i see it, insofar as truth can be expressed in

words (although my favorite sage is Nisargadatta, yet the teachings

of these two sages are very similar --only methods vary).

 

Take Care,

 

Tim

[Guest guest]

, leteegee@a... wrote:

> In a message dated 12/30/2001 1:56:29 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> viorica@z... writes:

>

>

> > i am a little puzzled by those who do not love his teachings

> > and to a list dedicated to Ramana's teachings anyway ,

> > that is something that i want to understand ...

> >

> > do you know why ?

>

> Hi Vicki...

>

> I'm here because I love being around Harsha and other good friends

I've made

> through-out the years.

>

> You also wrote in another post:

> > i shall always continue to pray to Ramana in my heart ,

> > my question is again - if this is found astray here ,

> > then i find myself in front of a problem - where am i wrong ?

>

>

> You aren't wrong! If you can't pray freely to Ramana,

> then I don't want to be here either.

>

> I'm not a Ramana devotee

> but I've so much enjoyed getting to know him

> and his wisdom and grace

> through you, Harsha, and others.

>

> I have no books of his to directly quote,

> but I do recall he said, something to the effect of...

>

> Don't look for truth; look for your fears, your illusions.

> Those are what is standing in the way to what is true.

>

> You are doing exactly that... and I hope we all still are!

>

> So glad you are here.

>

> Love,

> xxxtg

 

Thanks TG for being here. I have not had the time to read the posts

on HS recently but I appreciate your telling Wim earlier to shut up

or something to that effect. I have no doubt he deserved it.

 

Sorry if I have missed some important posts but what is this I heard

about Ramana licensing Wim to talk about Siddhis or some such thing!

 

The aura machine stuff is bad enough and now this! :-). How long can

we be expected to look the other way?

 

Wim, when does your world tour begin? I understand that you will not

be able to keep in touch with us during your visit to many countries.

No problem.

 

Love to all

Harsha

[Guest guest]

Thanks TG for being here. I have not had the time to read the posts

on HS recently but I appreciate your telling Wim earlier to shut up

or something to that effect. I have no doubt he deserved it.

Many others here have more patience than me. Wim's a good buddy --

feels sorta like a brother to me, and I would tell my own brother to

shut up if he went on and on about one particular subject. :-) I

would hope he would do the same to me.

Sorry if I have missed some important posts but what is this I heard

about Ramana licensing Wim to talk about Siddhis or some such thing!

That Ramana is a character! He licensed me to tell Wim when he was

going too far in his talks about Siddhis!

The aura machine stuff is bad enough and now this! :-). How long can

we be expected to look the other way?

I think Gabriel and a few others were the ones who looked the other

way. What a lovely person Gabriel is! I''m enjoying having both

Gabriel and Vicki here, among many others. They bring such beauty to

the group.

It's also wonderful to have David Bozzi back with his poems. I've

missed reading them. One of the best things about his 'Master' poem

was it brought Holly out of lurking. Hi Holly!

It is so good to have you back with us Harsha. You were missed. How's

that sweet baby Mira? We'd all love to hear about her.

Happy New Year!

Love,

xxxtg

[Guest guest]

So much for unconditional love. I suppose it's unavoidable that

any "love" on these mailing lists will be conditional by default.

Yep.

If you aren't feeling/seeing/hearing the unconditional love,

and you want to...

then you must give it, if you want to see/feel/hear it.

If one is waiting on seeing it first,

ya' might have a long wait.

Love isn't anywhere to be seen

but to be extended.

Once that is done, it'll show up everywhere... even on these lists!

If it doesn't, it doesn't really matter.

You've swept your own front porch.

Love,

xxxtg <~~~ uses her broom for flying

[Guest guest]

, "vioricail" <viorica@z...> wrote:

> Hi Bobby ,

>

> i always knew there are on this list members who feel like you !

> Yes, yes, those to whom Ramana fills their heart ,

> those who really love the postings with his teachings;

>

> i am a little puzzled by those who do not love his teachings

> and to a list dedicated to Ramana's teachings anyway ,

> that is something that i want to understand ...

>

> do you know why ?

>

Hi Vicki:

 

When I first went online to find other people with whom I could

discuss ideas I considered important I was afraid the endeavor would

distract me from my meditation. I am glad now I have met and enjoyed

the company of so many wonderful people (even the ones that I don't

agree with).

 

I have read on other lists a lot of misinformation about Ramana. I

tried to defend the people who were vulnerable to being misled by

those posts by debating with the author. This led to an immense

amount of intellectualizing.

It seems that the Master and the Fool have one thing in common, they

both have certainty of what they say.

Discrimination is knowing the Self from the not-self. Knowledge is

the state where ignorance does not exist. I learned these things

from Sri Ramana.

I try.

Love,

Bobby G.

[Guest guest]

, "harshaimtm" <harsha-hkl@h...> wrote:

> Sorry if I have missed some important posts but what is this I

> heard about Ramana licensing Wim to talk about Siddhis or some such

> thing!

>

> The aura machine stuff is bad enough and now this! :-). How long

> can we be expected to look the other way?

>

> Wim, when does your world tour begin? I understand that you will

> not be able to keep in touch with us during your visit to many

> countries. No problem.

>

> Love to all

> Harsha

 

So much for unconditional love. I suppose it's unavoidable that

any "love" on these mailing lists will be conditional by default.

 

Whether "conditional love" has any true reality or existence is up to

each list member to figure out for themselves.

 

Tim

[Guest guest]

.....hmmm....do not conditional love and unconditional love reconciled arise

into higher love....higher love is certainly not sentimental....it is the

refining fire in which lesser love immolates itself....my prayer is that i

will burn as sacred incense on my beloved's holy altar until i am become

nothing but white ashes floating on her transparent breath.....^^~~~~~

 

further up and further in,

 

white wolfe

 

-

"fewtch" <coresite

<>

Monday, December 31, 2001 7:24 PM

Re: to Vicki: the newcomers look

 

> , "harshaimtm" <harsha-hkl@h...> wrote:

> > Sorry if I have missed some important posts but what is this I

> > heard about Ramana licensing Wim to talk about Siddhis or some such

> > thing!

> >

> > The aura machine stuff is bad enough and now this! :-). How long

> > can we be expected to look the other way?

> >

> > Wim, when does your world tour begin? I understand that you will

> > not be able to keep in touch with us during your visit to many

> > countries. No problem.

> >

> > Love to all

> > Harsha

>

> So much for unconditional love. I suppose it's unavoidable that

> any "love" on these mailing lists will be conditional by default.

>

> Whether "conditional love" has any true reality or existence is up to

> each list member to figure out for themselves.

>

> Tim

>

>

>

> /join

>

>

>

>

>

> All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside

back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness.

Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is

where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal

Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously

arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a.

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

[Guest guest]

, "fewtch" <coresite@h...> wrote:

> , "harshaimtm" <harsha-hkl@h...> wrote:

> > Sorry if I have missed some important posts but what is this I

> > heard about Ramana licensing Wim to talk about Siddhis or some such

> > thing!

> >

> > The aura machine stuff is bad enough and now this! :-). How long

> > can we be expected to look the other way?

> >

> > Wim, when does your world tour begin? I understand that you will

> > not be able to keep in touch with us during your visit to many

> > countries. No problem.

> >

> > Love to all

> > Harsha

>

> So much for unconditional love. I suppose it's unavoidable that

> any "love" on these mailing lists will be conditional by default.

>

> Whether "conditional love" has any true reality or existence is up to

> each list member to figure out for themselves.

>

> Tim

 

Harsha's criticism of Wim's displays does not preclude his having

unconditional love for Wim or anyone else on the list.

 

We don't have to "like" everything about someone to love them.