Guest guest Posted May 30, 2002 Report Share Posted May 30, 2002 Hello everyone or Onlyone!? My name is Shawn and I just joined this group. It looks like I finally found a group that actually saying all the stuff I've been wanting to talk about... My first Sangha and it's an e-sangha... This was the first message I read...Perfect! Wonderful, I can feel the shakti.... MMMMMgood e-company. Mazie is amazing and I really enjoy your poetic Love-confessions. Thank you Harsha for this group.I have barely dipped my toe in the water and already it's warm friendly and even some small waves. I am a painter living in hawaii and have been a seeker off and on for a long time. Shawn , "Mazie Lane" <sraddha54@h...> wrote: > Dearest Friends, > > A good way to understand the world of humans is to understand yourself, not in an intellectual way, or even in an emotional or so-called spiritual way, but just drilling down into the heart of the prime motivation, the core "story" that returns us again and again to the fixated expression of consciousness we call "our life". It may be discovered there that there is, at the root, something like an innocent misunderstanding. > > What is being pointed at here is the actual evolution of consciousness itself. This human drama is not a mistake. Most of the cherished Eastern teachings infer that this human life is some kind of error or unfortunate occurrence - something to transcend. But if we really inquire into this, we can see that consciousness has taken form for a reason. It has come into form so that it can be conscious as form. That's the beauty of this amazing human birth. Consciousness can become self-aware through this human form. It can not only become self-aware, but can finally manifest that liberation through form, through human-ness, in the way that we act in the field of space and time. > > To be "liberated" from being a human being is not enough. The consciousness itself has an impulse to manifest itself in the world of space and time. This where some confusion enters in. To be able to have this realization function in the world seems to be the true call of evolution. Ultimately, the manifestation is a creation. It's a birthing from an act of indescribable Love. It's certainly not some terrible mistake that we need to escape from into some transcendental realm. That's the goof of dualism. So many teachers confuse people here, but if it's all One, it is truly ALL ONE! There is no reason why that Oneness can't express Itself in the world of space and time just as much as in the Infinite. Such distinctions can be seen as mere notional indulgence, when all this messiness of our humanity is allowed to be liberated from such judgements of belief and conceptual filtration by the Power of Awakeness. > > Nevertheless, there is some real confusion when consciousness takes form and tries to become self-aware. It seems to be a risk that consciousness takes in its maturation process, or its evolving into becoming truly self-aware through form. It is simply a matter of getting confused about its ultimate identity. It comes into form, and then it thinks that it is that form. The purpose is to discover its True Nature, and then to manifest it in the world. Full incarnation is the moment to moment demand that all excuses be abandoned for acting anything less than from the complete awakening in this daily life. > > If this inquiry takes one into the head it will feel very dry, very intellectual. If it stays grounded in one's actual heart "experience", it won't feel in the least bit abstract. In fact, it is actually quite marvelously joyously drenched in the juicy Happiness of Being and Life! > In the place where consciousness is really unified, where it sees the true nature of both formlessness and form, such phrases as "I am That" are actually true. It becomes perceivable. One's sense of self expands to include everything. Here nothing is really outside of oneself. This view of unity consciousness is much vaster than the view of formless consciousness. One needs to go beyond mind into one's own direct experience to really hear this. It would initially appear that this experience of unity consciousness is complete, once there is the realization that "I am That", "I am everything". It may seem that there is nothing more to see. And yet if inquire proceeds further, there is something very simple to recognize. > > Even in this unity consciousness there is an awareness of this unity consciousness. There is a very simple wakefulness of it, in which this unity consciousness is arising. This awakeness has no qualities whatsoever. No bliss, no peace, no presence - not even consciousness. Any effort to define or even experience it is fruitless, any more than one can experience that which one is - one can only BE that which one IS. Sometimes this "Original Face" is called Emptiness. Yet it is even empty of any qualities of emptiness. Here there is no self or Self. It is not a state of consciousness, and yet it does not cancel what it transcends. Separate self-consciousness, Formless consciousness, Unity consciousness are all arising within this, are all birthed within It. They are actually illuminated, or seen through, and thus become Liberated from any identification within this, with any > fixation at any level of consciousness. > > Since everything arises from this wakefulness, there is nothing that needs to be eliminated. The only "problem" that ever arose was the fixation on any level. From this wakefulness, all states are gathered in one vast embrace of Love, and are seen to exist simultaneously, non-exclusively. When this is truly and deeply Seen, and all fixation has been undermined by the Embrace, then one comes to realize that this wakefulness, which one IS, is in Love with all states of consciousness. It does not need to hide in egoic consciousness, in formless consciousness, in unity consciousness, in peace or bliss - it loves them all. It functions through them all. Then they all begin to dance! > This dancing of all states of consciousness together is really the end, and the beginning, of incarnation, or conscious embodiment. To take in the whole of experience in one embrace - to swallow the Ocean in one gulp -- This is the Mystery! This Is what Love wants to do as It swims into this sea of form and wonder of Itself! This is the Yearning and the Satisfaction of all Yearning! This IS Beloved, and Beloved Is Infinite Revelation. > Yes, my Darling, and so what becomes realized is this simple awakeness that every human being has, at every moment of their lives. One may have many mystical, transcendental experiences, and perhaps, through Grace, come eventually to the Mystical experience of being human. Stabilizing in such "experience", one may eventually become ordinary. > Could this actually be the "ultimate ground", the full flowering of the transcendent Mystery - that the most liberating turns out to be the most ordinary? And yet, how could it be otherwise? > > > Loving You, > Mazie and RobertGet more from the Web. 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Guest guest Posted May 30, 2002 Report Share Posted May 30, 2002 Dear Shawn: Welcome to the Sangha. Thanks for your enthusiasm. You will be delighted to know that we have several excellent artists and painters in the group. Two of the great ones that come to mind are the world famous Bobby Graham (Big Bob) and the internationally renowned artist Jill Eggers. You can find Bobby's stunning paintings in the Spring 2002 issues of HS Magazine. We will have Jill's stuff up in the next issue of the HS Magazine. I am so totally proud of them! Did you read the list description Shawn? We are open to sharing and talking about things in a variety of ways as related to Sri Ramana and other teachers, Self-Inquiry, Yoga, Meditation, Kundalini, psychic and spiritual experiences, and other things having to do with the spirit, mind, or body in some way. In the past we have also spoken about the raw food diet (that's big in Hawaii), pranayama, the benefits of whey protein, and strength training. Feel free to write and share as you feel inclined. Love to all Harsha shawnhair2002 [shawn] Thursday, May 30, 2002 4:11 PM Re: What is it? Perhaps... Hello everyone or Onlyone!? My name is Shawn and I just joined this group. It looks like I finally found a group that actually saying all the stuff I've been wanting to talk about... My first Sangha and it's an e-sangha... This was the first message I read...Perfect! Wonderful, I can feel the shakti.... MMMMMgood e-company. Mazie is amazing and I really enjoy your poetic Love-confessions. Thank you Harsha for this group.I have barely dipped my toe in the water and already it's warm friendly and even some small waves. I am a painter living in hawaii and have been a seeker off and on for a long time. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 30, 2002 Report Share Posted May 30, 2002 I am a painter living in hawaii and have been a seeker off and on for a long time. Shawn Dear Shawn, May I take a moment here to speak with you and welcome you in my own idiosnycratic way? I am not speaking here to ego/mind, or soul, or self, or Self, for no such distinctions exist in Truth. I am speaking to That Which Is. There is only What Is. Nor is there such a `thing' as the search, nor any `end of the search'. Again, these distinctions do not exist in Truth. They are not Real. There is no one waiting for you as Peace on `the other side'. There are no sides to Truth. There is only What Is. Within the `dream', there appear to be such distinctions. There appears to be seeking, and ends of seeeking, and teachers, and students, and the whole panorama of experience and knowing. This is the nature of dreaming. It is why the dream is so seductive, why it has such a long `shelf life'. Even to speak about the dream as if it were a `thing' is not accurate, but for the purposes of this inquiry, that terminology will be used here. Indeed, there is nothing that can be truly said about This, and yet, mysteriously, there is a mysterious call to sing here, and so I shall. There are those who believe that they have, or are somehow now, arriving at `the end of the search', and thereby convince themselves that `the search' is real through this objectification, and then there are those who are only too happy to support such fantasies, because by doing so they reinforce their own sense of being a doer. Inquiring into Awareness Itself: as attention is drawn irresistibly deeper in the revelation of what is prior to any sense of self or Self, what is unlimited, What Is, it is seen that there are fewer and fewer willing to allow and welcome the totality of that which is illuminated in the unfolding of Heart to Itself, of Truth to Itself. The chronic tendency is to fixate identity in some position or belief, and thereby stop short of true Freedom. This in turn manifests as all sorts of assumptions about the nature of What Is, rather than the actual recognition of the simplicity of That in Which all inheres, That in Which all arises and dissolves. As it has been said, it begins, and is perpetuated, by an innocent misunderstanding. It is the mistaken notion that there exists some kind of separation in Consciousness Itself. This is the forgetting, the dream and lie of the subject/object dichotomy, and paradoxically, it is also the Play of Consciousness Itself, immersing Itself so completely in Its Love affair with the realms of space/time that Its own True Nature is forgotten, thus magnifying the simultaneous Bliss of Remembrance. In this Play, the imaginary sense that `something is lacking' arises, and this sense that there is something missing is what initiates and then prolongs the imagined `search'. However, Consciousness Itself, just as It is, Is whole and complete. This is not what is told to us from the beginning, however, so we have developed a belief that there is something we need to do in order to be free. To complicate matters, there are plenty of would-be `teachers' in the world who will try to tell us that `they' have somehow come to the end of this imaginary search, that they are now `shepherds' and we are lambs in their green pastures, and if we would only enter into some kind of master/disciple association with them, and wear their tinkling bells around our necks, well - we can be free too! Thus ensues another variation on the cult of knowing and separation, and the insidious part of it is that these folks often sprinkle in little crumbs of `truth' along the way, and these crumbs are laced with the hypnosis ingredient, until we become convinced that we now need to `end the search', and, by hanging with this or that guy, somehow we just might finally `get it'. Consequently, new religions that claim to be the antidote to previous religions are constantly appearing, preaching the separation of God & you, of Love & you, of Truth & you, of Freedom & you. This lie is perpetuated throughout this world, and leaves us, finally, completely frustrated, since `you' can never `get there'. At the point of real frustration, perhaps, through Grace, or luck, we may begin to suspect this lie, and when we do, the seed is sown for the recognition that we have never been bound. WE HAVE NEVER BEEN BOUND!!!! The dream of Narcissus -- such a stubborn little critter, neh? There is nothing that has even ever begun, and so how is there anything that will or can ever end? It is all a figment of imagination, a play, and yet we take our roles so seriously, don't we? Nobody knows what any of this Is – What It Is! The only difference is that I am not willing to pretend that `I' am in some kind of position to make believe `I' do. How about you? Are you willing to welcome your always and already perfect Freedom, your birthright – what you came here to re-cognize? I am not here to tell you what love looks like, or save you, or guide you, or warn you, or seduce you, or indulge you in some pretense of separation from What Is. What Is, IS! No -- that is not why I came here, and it is not why you came here. I came here to share & celebrate in the Wonder of Mystery with those who were opening eyes to their own True Nature, that we might explore together how Love manifests in our humanity, after we have set aside the hungry fictions of seeking for That Which we already Are, and allow Who We Are to outshine the habit and motive of contraction. What I am interested in, and what I have been interested in from the beginning, is not about teachers and teachings, but about a mature inquiry, in familial mutuality, into the chronic ways in which we maintain the limiting self-hypnosis, even when Unlimited Freedom is our own True Nature, and also how Consciousness Itself can be embodied in and as our very humanity in the unique expressions of Love that we represent. WHO Am I? What Is This? By consistently returning to that inquiry, all the rest may become obvious, and in its very obviousness, outShine the little stories of belief and assumption, and reveal the perfection of our own True Nature, That Which Lives us, even Now! LoveAlways, b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2002 Report Share Posted May 31, 2002 on 5/30/02 3:31 PM, hrtbeat7 at hrtbeat7 wrote: To complicate matters, there are plenty of would-be `teachers' in the world who will try to tell us that `they' have somehow come to the end of this imaginary search, that they are now `shepherds' and we are lambs in their green pastures, and if we would only enter into some kind of master/disciple association with them, and wear their tinkling bells around our necks, well - we can be free too! =================================== Shawn: Hi b, Are you saying there is no Help? That there is no-one who needs help? That may be some sort of ultimate truth but it also denies the very real suffering that is experienced by those not yet awakened to their true Position! Are you saying that all teachers are not really authentic, that they all are charletons? What of Maharshi? ==================================== b. Thus ensues another variation on the cult of knowing and separation, and the insidious part of it is that these folks often sprinkle in little crumbs of `truth' along the way, and these crumbs are laced with the hypnosis ingredient, until we become convinced that we now need to `end the search', and, by hanging with this or that guy, somehow we just might finally `get it'. ======================== I understand and "sense" the Truth from the not truth. And though I know you mean well, I feel there is much to gain from those who seem to have a special gift of teaching. Truely the "guru" is a function and not the automatic outcome of enlightenment. The truth has shakti and feeds my "soul." Let's not forget that those who hear the truth that Samsara and Nirvana are the same are not at all the same as those who SEE this. The un-enlightened quickly turn ultimate truths such as "there is nothing to attain," into ridiculous notions that since that is true then what is the point of following, doing, contemplating anything! Take the case of Alan Watts. People are still following him and treat him as an enlightened Zen master when it is clear from his own mouth, he only understood it mentally and was himself bereft of any first-hand groking. Remember that word? Who know where that word came from (not in the ultimate sense.?) grounded firmly in the world of opposites, Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2002 Report Share Posted May 31, 2002 , shawn <shawn@w...> wrote: Shawn: Hi b, Are you saying there is no Help? That there is no-one who needs help? That may be some sort of ultimate truth but it also denies the very real suffering that is experienced by those not yet awakened to their true Position! Are you saying that all teachers are not really authentic, that they all are charletons? What of Maharshi? I understand and "sense" the Truth from the not truth. And though I know you mean well, I feel there is much to gain from those who seem to have a special gift of teaching. Truely the "guru" is a function and not the automatic outcome of enlightenment. The truth has shakti and feeds my "soul." Let's not forget that those who hear the truth that Samsara and Nirvana are the same are not at all the same as those who SEE this. The un-enlightened quickly turn ultimate truths such as "there is nothing to attain," into ridiculous notions that since that is true then what is the point of following, doing, contemplating anything! Take the case of Alan Watts. People are still following him and treat him as an enlightened Zen master when it is clear from his own mouth, he only understood it mentally and was himself bereft of any first- hand groking. Remember that word? grounded firmly in the world of opposites, Shawn ))))) Hi Shawn, Thank you for your thoughtful responses. At first I started to answer you with mind, but that is not what we really want to be doing here – playing with intellect and concepts, is it? There is enormous "help", of course, and yet isn't it funny how we frequently assume that Truth is divided – that there is "Absolute Truth", and then there are all of us poor slobs somewhere, divided from that Truth, who are needing some help to get to that Truth? Few stop to consider that, for Truth to be True, then It must be True always and everywhere. Still, let's let this drop into that place you seem to feel I am denying – the place of "the very real suffering that is experienced by those not yet awakened to their true Position!" Let's for a moment put aside all of our notions about enlightenment, Truth, positions, Ramana, gurus, shakti, and such, and "feel into" our present condition, may we? Can we take this moment to just explore who is the one looking out of our eyes? The initial tendency is to go to mind, but we've played that game enough to recognize that mind cannot exceed itself. We may then look to our emotions, but only with similar results, eh? When mind and emotion are examined and released from the demand to know, then what is left? Usually, we answer something like: "Me". Now, the interesting thing is, when we have excused mind and emotions to go out and play for the time being while this inquiry is pursued, we find that we really are unable to nail down this "me". For most, it remains some kind of vague amorphous something that resists the light of such an inquiry. However, if we persist, not trying to know or understand, but just persisting in the momentum of this inquiry, we may begin to intuit a kind of story that we have been telling ourselves, a kind of narrative that actually comprises the content of our ordinary waking or even sleeping consciousness. In fact, it seems to be the driver for all of our sense of self. If we are willing to be courageous, we might go a bit further and question: "Is it true? Is this story true, or more a collection of beliefs and assumptions gathered from random conditioning factors, and all hung along the clothesline of a central concept – "I"? We can ask this question without expecting a yes or know, but just letting it penetrate, penetrate, and then, if we can be fearless in the face of what reveals itself, we can allow a kind of falling off the cliff of our certainties, and into the vastness of the unknown, which we may be surprised to realize is the Home we have always been seeking. LoveAlways, b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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