Mixed Messages

[Guest guest]

I, too am a new member; and my response could well be taken as one

which underlines what Maggie had to say in her post. I'm disposed to

lurk, rather than plunge in at the deep end; but I have to say that

it's disappointing to perceive disharmony at this early stage. I

hope that any misunderstanding may be rapidly cleared up.

I enjoy looking at 'the art-work' ! Please consider that term as a

portmanteau word encompassing all the beautiful pictures, paintings,

etc.

 

Sincerely.

 

John........Silent Companion....

 

----

 

I am a new member and shy about posting. But I wanted to make a

couple of observations about the Paliko controversy.To me, it seems

there have been some mixed messages.1. The original piece was

confusing because of the line "Associated Press" and the fact that

the authorship was unclear.2. Zenbob's initial post about "Bombing a

Wedding Party" was unclear because he mixed criticism with sincere

humanitarian sentiments.3. I think there may also have been some

lack of clarity involved with the fascinating and touching "Pagan

Babies" excerpts from Bob's book -- i. e., where did the excerpt end

and the comments at the end of the post begin?I recently joined this

list after getting to know Bob and Mazie on the NDE list. While Bob

was there, he wrote some things that touched me very deeply and

assisted me with the beginnings of various understandings.I'm nuts

about Bob and Mazie.But also I think Zenbob is quite sincere in

wanting to help people, and it would have comforted me to see that

sincerity respected and honored more in the posts I've read.Hope I'm

not out of line. This list has so many beautiful souls and fine

minds that I'm basically just in

awe.Love,Maggie/join

All paths go

somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions,

and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back

into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It

is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self.

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[Guest guest]

Hi, Wim !

An amusing and instructive response which goes a long way to

explaining what seemed to a recently-arrived member - *two* members,

if I may include Maggie - to be the harbinger of some dissent and

negativity.

Shlama !

John.......Silent Companion.....

----

Hi Maggie,You are not out of line..., not at all.I'm not one who is

afraid of conflicts, as most ppl. here know. By gollywe've seen

enough of them here.This issue here though I don't fully

understand... and I agree with yourassessment, Maggie.Why we have

this conflict, I don't know... or... could it just be... proofof

enlightenment?"Before enlightenment conflict, after enlightenment

conflict." ;-)))It surely does not matter to me... I esteem the

players in this conflicthighly, and in no way does this make me lower

my appreciation of any ofthem. In fact it increases; showing one's

imperfection is a wonderful gift,that IS humility. And by the way

"perfection" has nothing to do with havingno flaws..., perfection is

a process, the art of transformation... the lotusgrowing from the

mud, the pumpkin growing from the compost pile. And...let's not

forget... lotus flowers as well as pumpkin plants make plenty

ofmanure on their own account...Actually, as I have been involved in

enough similar situations myself here,it always strikes me that each

conflict starts with mutual care about theother's understanding,

which is then subsequently received as criticism andthen it bounces

back and forth for a while. May we all come out smellinglike

roses...or that warm sweet smell of cow barn

manure...Wimchezahmed (AT) aol (DOT) com

[chezahmed (AT) aol (DOT) com]Thursday, July 04, 2002 7:01 PMTo:

Subject: Mixed

MessagesI am a new member and shy about posting. But I wanted to make

a couple ofobservations about the Paliko controversy.To me, it seems

there have been some mixed messages.1. The original piece was

confusing because of the line "Associated Press"and the fact that the

authorship was unclear.2. Zenbob's initial post about "Bombing a

Wedding Party" was unclearbecausehe mixed criticism with sincere

humanitarian sentiments.3. I think there may also have been some lack

of clarity involved with thefascinating and touching "Pagan Babies"

excerpts from Bob's book -- i. e.,where did the excerpt end and the

comments at the end of the post begin?I recently joined this list

after getting to know Bob and Mazie on the NDElist. While Bob was

there, he wrote some things that touched me very deeplyand assisted

me with the beginnings of various understandings.I'm nuts about Bob

and Mazie.But also I think Zenbob is quite sincere in wanting to help

people, and itwould have comforted me to see that sincerity respected

and honored more inthe posts I've read.Hope I'm not out of line. This

list has so many beautiful souls and fineminds that I'm basically just

in

awe.Love,Maggie/join

All paths go

somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,perceptions,

and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subsideback

into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different

thanthe ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness.Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is

Home. Home iswhere the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

Finality of EternalBeing. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneouslyarising from within into It Self.

Welcome all to a.Your use of is subject

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All paths go

somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions,

and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back

into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It

is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self.

Welcome all to a.Your use of is subject

to .

__ IncrediMail -

Email has finally evolved - Click Here

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[Guest guest]

I am a new member and shy about posting. But I wanted to make a couple of

observations about the Paliko controversy.

 

To me, it seems there have been some mixed messages.

 

1. The original piece was confusing because of the line "Associated Press"

and the fact that the authorship was unclear.

 

2. Zenbob's initial post about "Bombing a Wedding Party" was unclear because

he mixed criticism with sincere humanitarian sentiments.

 

3. I think there may also have been some lack of clarity involved with the

fascinating and touching "Pagan Babies" excerpts from Bob's book -- i. e.,

where did the excerpt end and the comments at the end of the post begin?

 

I recently joined this list after getting to know Bob and Mazie on the NDE

list. While Bob was there, he wrote some things that touched me very deeply

and assisted me with the beginnings of various understandings.

 

I'm nuts about Bob and Mazie.

 

But also I think Zenbob is quite sincere in wanting to help people, and it

would have comforted me to see that sincerity respected and honored more in

the posts I've read.

 

Hope I'm not out of line. This list has so many beautiful souls and fine

minds that I'm basically just in awe.

 

Love,

Maggie

[Guest guest]

Hi Maggie,

 

You are not out of line..., not at all.

 

I'm not one who is afraid of conflicts, as most ppl. here know. By golly

we've seen enough of them here.

This issue here though I don't fully understand... and I agree with your

assessment, Maggie.

Why we have this conflict, I don't know... or... could it just be... proof

of enlightenment?

 

"Before enlightenment conflict, after enlightenment conflict." ;-)))

 

It surely does not matter to me... I esteem the players in this conflict

highly, and in no way does this make me lower my appreciation of any of

them. In fact it increases; showing one's imperfection is a wonderful gift,

that IS humility. And by the way "perfection" has nothing to do with having

no flaws..., perfection is a process, the art of transformation... the lotus

growing from the mud, the pumpkin growing from the compost pile. And...

let's not forget... lotus flowers as well as pumpkin plants make plenty of

manure on their own account...

 

Actually, as I have been involved in enough similar situations myself here,

it always strikes me that each conflict starts with mutual care about the

other's understanding, which is then subsequently received as criticism and

then it bounces back and forth for a while. May we all come out smelling

like roses...or that warm sweet smell of cow barn manure...

 

Wim

 

 

 

chezahmed [chezahmed]

Thursday, July 04, 2002 7:01 PM

Mixed Messages

 

 

I am a new member and shy about posting. But I wanted to make a couple of

observations about the Paliko controversy.

 

To me, it seems there have been some mixed messages.

 

1. The original piece was confusing because of the line "Associated Press"

and the fact that the authorship was unclear.

 

2. Zenbob's initial post about "Bombing a Wedding Party" was unclear

because

he mixed criticism with sincere humanitarian sentiments.

 

3. I think there may also have been some lack of clarity involved with the

fascinating and touching "Pagan Babies" excerpts from Bob's book -- i. e.,

where did the excerpt end and the comments at the end of the post begin?

 

I recently joined this list after getting to know Bob and Mazie on the NDE

list. While Bob was there, he wrote some things that touched me very deeply

and assisted me with the beginnings of various understandings.

 

I'm nuts about Bob and Mazie.

 

But also I think Zenbob is quite sincere in wanting to help people, and it

would have comforted me to see that sincerity respected and honored more in

the posts I've read.

 

Hope I'm not out of line. This list has so many beautiful souls and fine

minds that I'm basically just in awe.

 

Love,

Maggie

 

 

 

/join

 

 

 

 

All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside

back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness.

Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is

where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal

Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously

arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a.

 

 

 

Your use of is subject to

 

 

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[Guest guest]

May we all come out smelling

like roses...or that warm sweet smell of cow barn manure...

Wim

Hey, we're still planting our garden here at the happy Leopard

Farm...so the air is rich with that sort of fragrence...and you might

be exactly right. Time will tell.

Love,

Zenbob

[Guest guest]

but I have to say that it's disappointing to perceive disharmony at

this early stage. I hope that any misunderstanding may be rapidly

cleared up.

I enjoy looking at 'the art-work' ! Please consider that term as a

portmanteau word encompassing all the beautiful pictures, paintings,

etc.

 

Hi John:

Please look beyond the surface of these words, ideas and chiding

references. They do not represent dissent or personal criticism, but

are the actual outward manifestation of the struggle all humans endure

when living in the world.

While Bob, Mazie and I may seem to differ on a very narrow issue of

one posting and whether or not it was properly attributed or not,

that should not take anything away from our much deeper commitment

and respect that we each have for one another on many, many, far

broader and more substantive issues. This is a tempest about a

teapot or teacup, and should not be confused as representing any

major dogmatic schism.

We are all too evolved and pacifistic to ever come to blows, so you

should not fear seeing any blood spilt within this group. If in

doubt, Harsha will certainly mend the fence and make all well.

Your comments are deeply appreciated, as they certainly reveal what

must be a shared feeling by others who are new, or who have recently

just read these postings and think that an uncivil war is brewing.

You are both welcome to participate, listen, speak, or lurk as your

spirit moves you.

In one paramount issue, Mazie, Bob and I must at the core be in

absolute agreement, that is that the universe and all therein are

essentially of one unified existence in one great unified instant of

non-time, non-duality. Our divergence comes down to day to day

interpretation of how one manifests this best. I take the "Middle

Path" based on Mahayana Buddhism, which does exhort one to do good in

the world, as is possible, and where it harms no one, and is chosen as

wisely as possible. Mazie and Bob take the view that "All is as it

should be" actions are all futile, point of view. Or perhaps, I

should allow them to explain this in more detail, rather to poorly

paraphrase and risk any distortion. In any event, our discussions

are intended to sincerely share two different views, to allow others

to view this exchange, but in no way to suggest that either is "bad"

or "wrong," just that there is this divergence on the issue.

I hope this is both reassuring and will also increase interest in all

of the many lively dialogues that this wonderful group hosts within

its very big heart.

Blessings,

Love,

Zenbob