We are here to die? What? [was Zenbob/ Pagan Babies]

[Guest guest]

Thanks b

 

I quote from the essay in your post:

"The mind asks, "if I am not here for some benefit then why am I here?" And

the answer to that is - we are here to die."

 

I agree with much in that essay, of course... but it is at that sentence

above where my buck stops...

 

I have faced what people usually call "death" a few times (several NDEs),

but never in my subjective experience did I find it to be the way "death"

was so "objectively" characterized.

 

(1)

What people usually call "death" is an objective non-participatory

experience. People see something happen to someone else and have no insight

into what goes on in that "someone else". Obviously these bystanders observe

that "life as it was for that other person" has halted somehow but then they

pick from a number of concepts around that "moment of transition" just that

concept that seems to fit their objectives.

 

An NDE is at least a subjective experience, and what one gleans from it

differs totally from the usual objective "concepts about death" by onlookers

or bystanders.

Undergoing NDE one at least perceives something, perception goes on. (I have

written elsewhere about that) How that happens, why and what for, all that

is in the realm of concepts again.

 

If we need to say anything meaningful about life, the what and wherefore, we

should at least hear those out... those who experienced something called

"near death"... and not come up with simplistic clichés such as "we live to

die".

 

The most common experience after NDE is that life is not fear-driven

anymore..., that love and life are unquestioned and fully self evident...

and that there is no sense of "terminality". Reality is seen to be floating

in "amrita", immortality and universality.

 

Do we live to die or die to live or is there something else going on...?

 

The problem is our misunderstanding of causality, but I have written about

that enough.

(Action / reaction vs. action / counteraction, cause / effect vs. cause /

countereffect.)

 

(2)

That quote, ("The mind asks, "if I am not here for some benefit then why am

I here?" And the answer to that is - we are here to die.") that quote

typically comes from someone whose individual existence was questioned

around the moment of birth.

Someone else may have had trouble with that "just born being" that came into

existence, and that "someone else" may have had that trouble often enough

with that "being", for it to become a permanent condition around that

"being"'s existence. That "being" then may get bonded to that condition and

the search for "who this is" and what is the "reason for being" becomes

serious. The being then hides its innate essence under a pseudo personality.

 

This unfortunate combination of (1) the objective concept of death by others

about one's "end of life cycle" and (2) objective questioning by others

about one's own individual existence, positions the question about "why we

live and why we die" firmly in the personality of the individual.

 

When this persistent social questioning about the onset and offset of one's

individual existence has not taken place, there is just simple evidence of

being...

 

One needs no "raison d'etre"

We are not here to die... we simply are...

We are not here to live either... we simply are...

 

Wim

 

PS

It is not for nothing that Ramana calls "Who am I" a subjective inquiry that

eventually leads to the dissolution of the question "Who am I" into the

fullness of self evident being.

 

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