Spiritual Attitude On WW3

[Guest guest]

We're really close to a war on Iraq - and I am

in no way, shape or form in agreement in it but powerless to stop it. And

I suspect this is the position of many people. I cannot believe we all

are so powerless that we have to sit back on our prayers and our chants

and hope for the best. Is that all we can do is be hopeful? Are we not

Shamen or Wizards in many ways in which we can focus our prayers and have

our ways with GOD/ESSS and focus on peace? Is there nothing we can do as

these other people conglomerate and make plans for destruction and we just

sit aside and do nothing?

They call it a "holy War" because of the Islam

and Christian aspectsof it. But total destruction of innocent people is

in no way a "holy war".

How do we as spiritual and peaceable people

deal with the distinct possibility of nuclear war with Islams - moreso

- how do we stop it?

What are people's attitudes and opinions towards it?

I ask these questions because here where

I live in SE ALaska people are scared because there is a military presence

and they are sending people over there and everyone is all worked up.

openly,

valerie

[Guest guest]

When one seeks the illusion of power,

one is blinded by this desire

to the reality of true power.

Accepting that all is perfect,

one conquers the enemy within

and sees clearly the childlike games

of man.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

..

[Guest guest]

Alaska must be like a great waking dream. Each day would be a razor

cutting into the relaity of landscape, survival and being aware of

how small one can be, yet how interdependent all life is...and how

incredible the world is.

I think all spiritual people feel the disharmony and dischord of wrong

headed war talk in ways that the general public does not. When we get

that chill and unsettled twist in our stomachs, it is not merely from

fear and disgust. It is because something fundamentally wrong is

being stated, and that great power is being wasted on warping the

minds and will of the people toward a goal that we understand will

bring great calamitous karmic consequences to our nation.

We fight fiercely when innocently attacked, and that is a natural

right. We have no business seeking out quarrels with nations that

truly have no great issue with us, our the people of the US. Iraqi

citizens are openly friendly to US visitors despite the harm done by

US sanctions and politics. They hope for better relations, not worse

ones and are really at a loss to understand the degree of US vitriol

aimed at their country. To them Saddam Hussein may be imperfect, but

he has transformed Iraq from a backward third world country into an

educated, western, modern nation with prosperous people and great

vitality.

We should attempt to understand this, and realize that all political

strongmen are imperfect and should be encouraged to democratize their

nations. We should also be wary of blind support for Israel, which

has openly proposed this first strike policy toward Iraq. Their

fears need not be our fears. We should also be mindful that despite

our long time support for Israel and the convenient phrasing that

Israel is a "democracy" that it in fact is only a democracy if you

are Jewish--as non-Jewish persons (whether born there or not) cannot

vote.

Very conservative religious sects in Israel have even suggested that

Reform and Liberal Jewish members of Israel should be stripped of

voting rights...and that only Conservative and Orthodox Jews should

retain voting rights. If taken a step further, and eventually the

Orthodox sects win out, then even Conservative Jews would be stripped

of voting rights...and that would in fact mean that no women could

vote in such an Israel.

In Iraq, all citizens at least retain the right to vote, be they

Muslim, Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, Hindu, or of whatever religious

or of no religious affiliation. Although Presidential elections are

pretty much a one way ticket to Saddamocracy, the national assembly

and local governments are relatively dmeocratic, and citizens there

enjoy many of the same benefits of local choice that Americans are

used to. Nothing is perfect, of course. A broader, more democratic

constitution could give better freedoms to speech and press, and

eventually insure real choice in Iraqi elections.

however, the U.S. does not seem eager to attack and overthrow King

Hussein (yes, a cousin!) in Jordan, even though he is never elected,

and the Jordanian people can never vote for a leader.

Where is the sense of our diplomacy and foreign policy actually

mirroring our own American values that our citizens fought and died

for from the Revolution until today?

If we must fight, let us fight for our real American ideals of freedom

and deomcracy...not for big business, big oil, big politics or even

big revenge.

Blessings,

Zenbob

[Guest guest]

Are we truly powerless?

 

Only if we invest in hope

rather than Intent.

 

We are indeed Shamen and Wizards.

 

But we are wasting our Intent

on hope.

 

We can Intend peace

but to hope for it

is to create war.

 

I have to keep pinching myself,

"Is this a dream? Is this a dream?"

 

When it is seen

that this is indeed

a dream

we are very very close

to our Intent...

 

Blessings...

 

 

, v <amused@p...> wrote:

> > I cannot believe we all are so

> > powerless that we have to sit back on our prayers and our chants

and

> > hope for the best. Is that all we can do is be hopeful? Are we not

> > Shamen or Wizards in many ways in which we can focus our prayers

and

> > have our ways with GOD/ESSS and focus on peace? Is there nothing

we

> > can do as these other people conglomerate and make plans for

> > destruction and we just sit aside and do nothing?

[Guest guest]

the war is over,

nobody survived.

 

we didn't have time to mourn

the dead, the sunrise

was too captivating:

 

long trails of

missile exhaust streaked

across the dawn's early sky

dissipated over Arunachala,

as if the dream of night

itself exploded, as if

from now on there would

only be the morning.

 

we wake and rise and go

out into this morning, this

sky meadow filled with

signs and wonders, wandering

deeper into the bewildering

presence of

everything's the same but

no one's there.

 

nobody survives, so

fight on Arjuna!

 

do your best!

 

we'll be down in the kitchen,

fixing everybody lunch.

 

today's meal plan

will be announced in a

calligraphy of rockets'

red glare, flags torn

from their flagpoles, heads

flying through air.

 

each head will reincarnate as

a kind of moon, orbiting

its own promised world,

drifting in a space

we all once hoped

would be the case

when peace ruled every planet,

and love outshone the stars.

 

 

LoveAlways,

 

b

[Guest guest]

Robert,

Sometimes you, as good as you always are, truly out-shine yourself.

This is one of those shining moments... like watching those fireworks,

hearing the crowd spontaneously inhale at once for the ohhhh's and ahhhh's.

Love,

Gloria

-

hrtbeat7

Friday, August 23, 2002 11:19 AM

Re: Spiritual Attitude On WW3

the war is over,nobody survived.we didn't have time to mournthe dead,

the sunrise was too captivating:long trails ofmissile exhaust

streaked across the dawn's early skydissipated over Arunachala,as if

the dream of nightitself exploded, as iffrom now on there would only

be the morning.we wake and rise and goout into this morning, thissky

meadow filled with signs and wonders, wanderingdeeper into the

bewilderingpresence of everything's the same butno one's there.nobody

survives, sofight on Arjuna!do your best!we'll be down in the

kitchen,fixing everybody lunch.today's meal plan will be announced in

a calligraphy of rockets'red glare, flags tornfrom their flagpoles,

headsflying through air.each head will reincarnate as a kind of moon,

orbitingits own promised world,drifting in a spacewe all once

hopedwould be the casewhen peace ruled every planet,and love outshone

the stars.LoveAlways,b

/join

All paths go

somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions,

and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back

into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of

Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It

is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the

Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of

Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self.

Welcome all to a.Your use of is subject

to the

[Guest guest]

Mace Mealer wrote:

When one seeks the illusion

of power,

one is blinded by this

desire

to the reality of true

power.

Accepting that all is

perfect,

one conquers the enemy

within

and sees clearly the

childlike games

of man.

But what about the real time affect of gunpowder and lasers and nukes

and hurting the planet?

..

/join

 

All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside

back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness.

Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home

is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal

Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously

arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a.

 

Terms of Service.

Attachment: (image/gif) /SofiaMoon/Temporary%20Items/nsmail14-3.gif [not stored]

[Guest guest]

yes i believe we can visualize whirled peas in such a way that we make

reality the way we see it.

I believe that we are way stronger than the politicos and people working

on the material plane and we just need to be it.

so, what is fear for, if not to warn us to come together in the right

mind, and how do we do that?

david bozzi wrote:

Are we truly powerless?

Only if we invest in hope

rather than Intent.

We are indeed Shamen and Wizards.

But we are wasting our Intent

on hope.

We can Intend peace

but to hope for it

is to create war.

I have to keep pinching myself,

"Is this a dream? Is this a dream?"

When it is seen

that this is indeed

a dream

we are very very close

to our Intent...

Blessings...

, v <amused@p...> wrote:

> > I cannot believe we all are so

> > powerless that we have to sit back on our prayers and our chants

and

> > hope for the best. Is that all we can do is be hopeful? Are

we not

> > Shamen or Wizards in many ways in which we can focus our prayers

and

> > have our ways with GOD/ESSS and focus on peace? Is there nothing

we

> > can do as these other people conglomerate and make plans for

> > destruction and we just sit aside and do nothing?

/join

 

All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside

back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness.

Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home

is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal

Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously

arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a.

 

Terms of Service.

[Guest guest]

, v <amused@p...> wrote:

> yes i believe we can visualize whirled peas in such a way that we

> make reality the way we see it.

> I believe that we are way stronger than the politicos and people

> working

> on the material plane and we just need to be it.

> so, what is fear for, if not to warn us to come together in the

> right mind,

 

That seems a constructive view for the purpose of fear.

> and how do we do that?

 

Hmmmm...

You had to ask.

(good)

 

How did this mess start?

It started with insane beliefs about ourself.

 

It's seems it's an issue of unlearning, unbrainwashing,

deconditioning all the false perspectives we perpetuate.

 

There's a lively, unnameable 'something'

that offers infinite possibilities

each and every moment.

 

It's in our awareness.

 

You can catch it in glimspes

but then the sleep of the brainwashing

pulls like opium.

 

It's like forcing yourself to get up

hours before you normally wake-up.

 

But ultimately,

you can get into the rhythm

of the day and stay awake?

 

I don't know.

 

What do you think?

 

David

(applying a little bit of effort to stay up)

 

 

>

> david bozzi wrote:

>

> > Are we truly powerless?

> >

> > Only if we invest in hope

> > rather than Intent.

> >

> > We are indeed Shamen and Wizards.

> >

> > But we are wasting our Intent

> > on hope.

> >

> > We can Intend peace

> > but to hope for it

> > is to create war.

> >

> > I have to keep pinching myself,

> > "Is this a dream? Is this a dream?"

> >

> > When it is seen

> > that this is indeed

> > a dream

> > we are very very close

> > to our Intent...

> >

> > Blessings...

> >

> >

> > , v <amused@p...> wrote:

> > > > I cannot believe we all are so

> > > > powerless that we have to sit back on our prayers and our

chants

> > and

> > > > hope for the best. Is that all we can do is be hopeful? Are we

not

> >

> > > > Shamen or Wizards in many ways in which we can focus our

prayers

> > and

> > > > have our ways with GOD/ESSS and focus on peace? Is there

nothing

> > we

> > > > can do as these other people conglomerate and make plans for

> > > > destruction and we just sit aside and do nothing?

> >

> >

> > /join

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places,

sights,

> > perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in

and

> > subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are

not

> > different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of

the

> > nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always

> > Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the

Heart

> > to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in

the

> > Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It

> > Self. Welcome all to a.

> >

> >

> >

> > Terms of

Service.

[Guest guest]

, "david bozzi" <david.bozzi@i...> wrote:

> , v <amused@p...> wrote:

>

> > yes i believe we can visualize whirled peas in such a way that we

> > make reality the way we see it.

> > I believe that we are way stronger than the politicos and people

> > working

> > on the material plane and we just need to be it.

> > so, what is fear for, if not to warn us to come together in the

> > right mind,

>

> That seems a constructive view for the purpose of fear.

>

> > and how do we do that?

>

> Hmmmm...

> You had to ask.

> (good)

>

> How did this mess start?

> It started with insane beliefs about ourself.

 

yes..

as the mighty wittgenstein said..

 

A tragedy might really always start with the words: "Nothing at all

would have happened, had it not been that.....

 

 

>

> It's seems it's an issue of unlearning, unbrainwashing,

> deconditioning all the false perspectives we perpetuate.

>

> There's a lively, unnameable 'something'

> that offers infinite possibilities

> each and every moment.

>

> It's in our awareness.

>

> You can catch it in glimspes

> but then the sleep of the brainwashing

> pulls like opium.

>

> It's like forcing yourself to get up

> hours before you normally wake-up.

>

> But ultimately,

> you can get into the rhythm

> of the day and stay awake?

>

> I don't know.

>

> What do you think?

>

> David

> (applying a little bit of effort to stay up)

>

>

>

> >

> > david bozzi wrote:

> >

> > > Are we truly powerless?

> > >

> > > Only if we invest in hope

> > > rather than Intent.

> > >

> > > We are indeed Shamen and Wizards.

> > >

> > > But we are wasting our Intent

> > > on hope.

> > >

> > > We can Intend peace

> > > but to hope for it

> > > is to create war.

>

> > >

> > > I have to keep pinching myself,

> > > "Is this a dream? Is this a dream?"

> > >

> > > When it is seen

> > > that this is indeed

> > > a dream

> > > we are very very close

> > > to our Intent...

> > >

> > > Blessings...

> > >

> > >

> > > , v <amused@p...> wrote:

> > > > > I cannot believe we all are so

> > > > > powerless that we have to sit back on our prayers and our

> chants

> > > and

> > > > > hope for the best. Is that all we can do is be hopeful? Are

we

> not

> > >

> > > > > Shamen or Wizards in many ways in which we can focus our

> prayers

> > > and

> > > > > have our ways with GOD/ESSS and focus on peace? Is there

> nothing

> > > we

> > > > > can do as these other people conglomerate and make plans for

> > > > > destruction and we just sit aside and do nothing?

> > >

> > >

> > > /join

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places,

> sights,

> > > perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in

> and

> > > subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are

> not

> > > different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are

of

> the

> > > nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is

always

> > > Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know

the

> Heart

> > > to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in

> the

> > > Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into

It

> > > Self. Welcome all to a.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Terms of

> Service.

[Guest guest]

v wrote:

Mace Mealer wrote:

 

 

When one seeks the illusion

of power,

one is blinded by this

desire

to the reality of true

power.

Accepting that all is

perfect,

one conquers the enemy

within

and sees clearly the

childlike games

of man.

 

But what about the real time affect of gunpowder and lasers and nukes

Will you join the battle against desire

for power with desire for power?

And become your own enemy?

Peace is born of peace, love of

love, care of care.

Truly know this and you are both

free, and invulnerable.

 

and hurting the planet?

This planet is like your body,

undergoing constant transformation, impermanent,

can you truly save it, any more than your body?

Save that which is, first, then see if that which is not

requires saving.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

..

[Guest guest]

Mace Mealer wrote:

 

v wrote:

Mace Mealer wrote:

 

 

When one seeks the illusion

of power,

one is blinded by this

desire

to the reality of true

power.

Accepting that all is

perfect,

one conquers the enemy

within

and sees clearly the

childlike games

of man.

 

But what about the real time affect of gunpowder and lasers and nukes

Will you join the battle against desire

for power with desire for power?

And become your own enemy?

Peace is born of peace, love of

love, care of care.

Truly know this and you are both

free, and invulnerable.

 

and hurting the planet?

This planet is like your body,

undergoing constant transformation, impermanent,

can you truly save it, any more than your body?

Save that which is, first, then see if that which is not

requires saving.

 

 

 

how do they say "nuke the gay baby whales!"

(insert winking smiley)

[Guest guest]

---

<< i don't know how to console you, i have the same anxieties to a

degree. The earth we are on, has a 'program' through which it must

pass. Governments being out of control and seeking all control, is

but a very small item on the earths cosmic agenda. Many have heard

the "earth baptised by water and then fire" concepts, however,

floods on a global scale as with conflagrations on a global scale are

a repetitive event... and all our prayers and chants will not effect

the outcomes. We are given the tools of power over ourselves to

decide if we, love the spaceship we are on and enjoy the scenery in

all its wonderous variety, or, allow the scenery to disturb us and

create a niche in our minds to the point it then controls

our "mushin" no mind. We are not here to determine the ride we are

on- or its outcome, but we are here to learn how to appreciate it

and learn from it all.

 

Govenment, the most sensless of all entities, will wage war upon

each other, and will do so with as much regard for our 'prayers and

chants' as the worlds which collide continuosly throughout the

multiverse. But still, none of this will have the power to control

our peace or minds- unless we allow it.

 

Sorry i have no comfort for you. But i assure you, the ride and the

scenery are here for you to enjoy, learn, and take with you to the

next stage of exsistance. Use the 'trauma' of all these events to

strengthen your resolve to highten and perfect your practice of Metta

to all your fellow sentiants... the peace and clear vision will come

and go as you pass through one veil after another. Blessings from an

ignorant. james

 

 

 

 

In , v <amused@p...> wrote:

> > We're really close to a war on Iraq - and I am in no way, shape or

> > form in agreement in it but powerless to stop it. And I suspect

this

> > is the position of many people. I cannot believe we all are so

> > powerless that we have to sit back on our prayers and our chants

and

> > hope for the best. Is that all we can do is be hopeful? Are we not

> > Shamen or Wizards in many ways in which we can focus our prayers

and

> > have our ways with GOD/ESSS and focus on peace? Is there nothing

we

> > can do as these other people conglomerate and make plans for

> > destruction and we just sit aside and do nothing?

>

> They call it a "holy War" because of the Islam and Christian

> aspectsof it. But total destruction of innocent people is in no way

a

> "holy war".

> How do we as spiritual and peaceable people deal with the

distinct

> possibility of nuclear war with Islams - moreso - how do we stop it?

> What are people's attitudes and opinions towards it?

> I ask these questions because here where I live in SE ALaska

people

> are scared because there is a military presence and they are sending

> people over there and everyone is all worked up.

>

> openly,

> valerie

[Guest guest]

, "jamesstaples6th" <jamesstaples6th>

wrote:

 

>Govenment, the most sensless of all entities, will wage war upon

each other....

 

 

)))) Governments: bundles of arbitrary thoughts and random

conditioning, orbiting around an imaginary center, mistaking

themselves for independent entities.

 

Sound familiar?

 

 

:-)

 

b