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b. & Friends,

>>> ))) If the Formless has nothing more to learn,

why does it perpetually manifest as

form?

 

Why indeed? Why assume that it has anything to do with learning? There have

been many theories put forth as to the impetus behind genesis, My own is a

lengthy matter that I think I'll leave til later. What's a spiritual story if

it doesn't include a teaching?

 

>>> "Even Shakyamuni was only half-way to the goal."

~ Dogen Zenji

 

I think I'll leave that one to Dogen and Shakyamuni.

>>> "There is no enlightened person,

there is only enlightened activity."

~ Moo Shoo

 

Well, b., as far as I can see, Moo Shoo brings us back to my original point.

I guess, at least in this case, what goes around comes around.

 

yours in the bonds,

eric

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, EBlackstead@c... wrote:

 

 

 

b: If the Formless has nothing more to learn,

why does it perpetually manifest as

form?

 

eric: Why indeed? Why assume that it has anything to do with learning?

 

 

)))) It'd dawn, Eric. You are still in the bonds, learning. Why

assume that you are any different from the Formless?

 

 

 

eric: There have been many theories put forth as to the impetus

behind genesis, My own is a lengthy matter that I think I'll leave

til later. What's a spiritual story if it doesn't include a teaching?

 

 

 

)))) i have my own theory, but i think i've already upset enough

people. :-))

 

 

 

 

b: "Even Shakyamuni was only half-way to the goal."

~ Dogen Zenji

 

eric; I think I'll leave that one to Dogen and Shakyamuni.

 

 

)))) Yes, those inscrutable Asians!

 

 

 

b: "There is no enlightened person,

there is only enlightened activity."

~ Moo Shoo

 

eric: Well, b., as far as I can see, Moo Shoo brings us back to my

original point. I guess, at least in this case, what goes around

comes around.

 

 

))) "The faster you go, the rounder you get!"

~ Moo Shoo

 

 

:-))

 

 

LoveAlways,

 

b

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Hi Eric,

 

When

~ Moo Shoo said:

"There is no enlightened person, there is only enlightened activity."

~ Oh No responded with:

"I beg to differ" :-)

 

You quoted:

"Even Shakyamuni was only half-way to the goal."

~ Dogen Zenji

 

You said:

>>>I think I'll leave that one to Dogen and Shakyamuni.<<<

 

I bet you, those two had no issue with each other...

 

Wim

 

PS

Someone asked Robert why he signs with a small b, can I ask you why you sign

off with "yours in bonds"?

 

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Dear Robert, You wrote to Eric: >>> i have my own theory, but i think

i've already upset enough people. :-)) <<<

 

You wrote to Eric: >>>I have stood here, my chest torn open for the

months since I have been in this playground, completely aware that

not one thing I have ever said has been heard... <<<

 

I don't believe that you have upset many people and also that you have been heard...

 

 

Anyway if you need any sympathy, empathy or anything else you may find

yourself short of, you can always come to me as I have any of those

resources aplenty.

 

Wim

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b. & Friends,

 

b. says:

)))) It'd dawn, Eric. You are still in the bonds, learning. Why

assume that you are any different from the Formless?

 

eric says: Well, b., if it's any comfort to you, I wish I'd never

started that "bonds" riff. I assumed a level of sophistication in our

readers that has proved out more in the breach than in the observance.

Still, let me be clear: we are all in the bonds of learning, that is

to say, of Karma, or if you prefer, Maya.

 

As to your second question: Why assume that you are any different

from the formless?, I can only suggest to you that the term Maya

means to designate a confusion as to our reality. I assume you've

noticed that?

 

I have, too.

 

If that fact is irrelevant to you, you have my congratulations. If

you are simply ignoring it, you don't have my congratulations. I

trust that you will decide for yourself which is which.

 

Good luck, in any case,

eric

 

 

 

, "hrtbeat7" <hrtbeat7> wrote:

> , EBlackstead@c... wrote:

>

>

>

> b: If the Formless has nothing more to learn,

> why does it perpetually manifest as

> form?

>

> eric: Why indeed? Why assume that it has anything to do with

learning?

>

>

> )))) It'd dawn, Eric. You are still in the bonds, learning. Why

> assume that you are any different from the Formless?

>

>

>

> eric: There have been many theories put forth as to the impetus

> behind genesis, My own is a lengthy matter that I think I'll leave

> til later. What's a spiritual story if it doesn't include a

teaching?

>

>

>

> )))) i have my own theory, but i think i've already upset enough

> people. :-))

>

>

>

>

> b: "Even Shakyamuni was only half-way to the goal."

> ~ Dogen Zenji

>

> eric; I think I'll leave that one to Dogen and Shakyamuni.

>

>

> )))) Yes, those inscrutable Asians!

>

>

>

> b: "There is no enlightened person,

> there is only enlightened activity."

> ~ Moo Shoo

>

> eric: Well, b., as far as I can see, Moo Shoo brings us back to my

> original point. I guess, at least in this case, what goes around

> comes around.

>

>

> ))) "The faster you go, the rounder you get!"

> ~ Moo Shoo

>

>

> :-))

>

>

> LoveAlways,

>

> b

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Hi Eric,

 

At this point I should get into the meaning of the word "bonds"... Don't get

me going now... Of course the words yoga as well as religion mean binding

together, joining. Yoga actually comes from "jointing", a carpenter's skill

and technique.

I should go on... but I have some carpentry work of my own to do... so that

was enough email for the day...

 

Wim

(still bonding)

 

 

eblack101 [EBlackstead]

Saturday, September 14, 2002 2:27 PM

Re: The Teacher & the Taught

 

 

b. & Friends,

 

b. says:

)))) It'd dawn, Eric. You are still in the bonds, learning. Why

assume that you are any different from the Formless?

 

eric says: Well, b., if it's any comfort to you, I wish I'd never

started that "bonds" riff. I assumed a level of sophistication in our

readers that has proved out more in the breach than in the observance.

Still, let me be clear: we are all in the bonds of learning, that is

to say, of Karma, or if you prefer, Maya.

 

As to your second question: Why assume that you are any different

from the formless?, I can only suggest to you that the term Maya

means to designate a confusion as to our reality. I assume you've

noticed that?

 

I have, too.

 

If that fact is irrelevant to you, you have my congratulations. If

you are simply ignoring it, you don't have my congratulations. I

trust that you will decide for yourself which is which.

 

Good luck, in any case,

eric

 

 

 

, "hrtbeat7" <hrtbeat7> wrote:

> , EBlackstead@c... wrote:

>

>

>

> b: If the Formless has nothing more to learn,

> why does it perpetually manifest as

> form?

>

> eric: Why indeed? Why assume that it has anything to do with

learning?

>

>

> )))) It'd dawn, Eric. You are still in the bonds, learning. Why

> assume that you are any different from the Formless?

>

>

>

> eric: There have been many theories put forth as to the impetus

> behind genesis, My own is a lengthy matter that I think I'll leave

> til later. What's a spiritual story if it doesn't include a

teaching?

>

>

>

> )))) i have my own theory, but i think i've already upset enough

> people. :-))

>

>

>

>

> b: "Even Shakyamuni was only half-way to the goal."

> ~ Dogen Zenji

>

> eric; I think I'll leave that one to Dogen and Shakyamuni.

>

>

> )))) Yes, those inscrutable Asians!

>

>

>

> b: "There is no enlightened person,

> there is only enlightened activity."

> ~ Moo Shoo

>

> eric: Well, b., as far as I can see, Moo Shoo brings us back to my

> original point. I guess, at least in this case, what goes around

> comes around.

>

>

> ))) "The faster you go, the rounder you get!"

> ~ Moo Shoo

>

>

> :-))

>

>

> LoveAlways,

>

> b

 

 

 

/join

 

 

 

 

All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights,

perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside

back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than

the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness.

Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is

where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal

Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously

arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a.

 

 

 

Your use of is subject to

 

 

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, Wim Borsboom <wim@a...> wrote:

 

>I don't believe that you have upset many people and also that you

have been heard...

 

 

)))) Wim, Dear Friend, then

i retract everything i said!

 

:-)

 

if people have not been upset, it is

due to my own failings at communication, and

if any believe that they are something that

hears something, i should be the one upset

for heaping more foulness on foulness still!

 

 

 

>Anyway if you need any sympathy, empathy or anything else you may

find yourself short of, you can always come to me as I have any of

those resources aplenty.

 

 

))) You are most generous, especially

since we have never been separated.

I stopped wanting what i don't have when

i began wanting what i already have --

it is a simple shift, but transformative.

 

What i find myself short of these days is

much of any interest in indulging

conceptual disputes, debates, and theories

regarding what is right before my eyes, and

what is burning there.

 

 

LoveAlways,

 

b

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, "eblack101" <EBlackstead@c...> wrote:

>Still, let me be clear: we are all in the bonds of learning, that is

to say, of Karma, or if you prefer, Maya.

 

))) Isn't this something you have learned?

Without this belief, what remains?

 

i appreciate your intent to be clear.

 

>As to your second question: Why assume that you are any different

from the formless?, I can only suggest to you that the term Maya

means to designate a confusion as to our reality. I assume you've

noticed that?

 

))) I have noticed that many terms are tossed around

attempting to describe a phenomena that cannot be described

by mind, since mind itself arises and vanishes within it,

as a non-binding modification of it, and it's just as well,

since enough people already think that the words and

what's pointed to with words are the same.

>I have, too.

 

))) Well then what's the beef?

It's Saturday afternoon,

have a beer!

 

 

>If that fact is irrelevant to you, you have my congratulations. If

you are simply ignoring it, you don't have my congratulations. I

trust that you will decide for yourself which is which.

 

 

))) I am neither encouraged by congratualtions

or discouraged by their lack, since i am clearly

unable to possess either.

 

Rather than trusting as to which way the wind of Her Breath

will blow me, why not trust in your own deepest yearning

and let each rest in the implications

inherent in their own.

 

 

LoveAlways,

 

b

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My dear Robert,

 

You wrote:

>>>What i find myself short of these days is much of any interest in

indulging conceptual disputes, debates, and theories *regarding* what is

right before my eyes, and what is *burning* there.<<<

 

Indeed, indulging in conceptual disputes would be short-changing the

conceptual self in the conceptual eye of its conceptual beholder of

conceptual time...

 

Ill conceived conceptions...

 

"Regarding", hmm, what a beautiful word... loving perception!

"What is burning there."

When energy turns into matter, love burns without being consumed.

 

Warm Regards,

Wim

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