Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 Concsiousness........unaware of itself......... Consciousness becomes aware of itself.... Self-consciousness or I-amness appears.... The self becomes an image....an overlay constructed of concepts. The self-image becomes a false identity based on accumulated concepts. The self-identity appears to itself to be separate from other selves. Fear is logical if separation is believed. The world is filtered through the image of self. The world becomes a mirror to the self. The world becomes the self. (I know that these are only concepts.........but I need some input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these ideas......) Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 , "lastrainhome" <lastrain@w...> wrote: > Concsiousness........unaware of itself......... > > > > Consciousness becomes aware of itself.... > > > > Self-consciousness or I-amness appears.... > > > > The self becomes an image....an overlay constructed of concepts. > > > The self-image becomes a false identity based on accumulated concepts. > > The self-identity appears to itself to be separate from other selves. > > Fear is logical if separation is believed. > > The world is filtered through the image of self. > > The world becomes a mirror to the self. > > The world becomes the self. > > > (I know that these are only concepts.........but I need some input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these ideas......) > > > > Emily Dickinson's "beyond the dip of bell" is where you are....I "think". It's either there or on a sitcom like Perfect Strangers. Larry's on the ledge and Balkie is trying to talk him back in the window. Nah.....best to just stay lost. > Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 , "lastrainhome" <lastrain@w...> wrote: >....I need some input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these ideas......) Some wonder whether life matters or not -- it matters in the same way nothing matters to the lover, resting in the arms of the Beloved, spent from a night of passion, sleepily stunned by dawn, or in the way nothing matters to the single sparrow, bolting through the golden noon, aiming at the sun, or in the way nothing matters to the mountain stream, steeped in memories of snow, melting into river. LoveAlways, Mazie & b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 , "skiplaurel" <vicki@b...> wrote: > .....best to just stay lost. All I'll ever need to know of truth floats serenely high above me, wrapped in the silence of a small white cloud, vanishing into the endlessness of blue. LoveAlways, Mazie & b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 , "mazie_l" <sraddha54@h...> wrote: > , "skiplaurel" <vicki@b...> wrote: > > > .....best to just stay lost. > > > All I'll ever need > to know of truth > floats serenely high > above me, wrapped in > the silence of a small white > cloud, vanishing into > the endlessness of blue. > > > > > LoveAlways, > > Mazie & b The Cloud of Unknowing, eh? How to let go when "we" are a holding on? We can't even know that Vicki, http://www.bobwoodyard.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 Hi Michael, You wrote: >>> (I know that these are *only* concepts.........but I need some input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these ideas......) <<< About "concepts" in itself... Concepts have received quite a bit of bad press over the last 4 to 5 decades in the "new agey" world of self realization. So, just so that you know, Michael, there is nothing wrong with concepts per se, as they are, so to say, wonderful but temporary mind gadgets that we may construct or borrow and use to understand-and-accept as-yet-overwhelming or as-yet-ill-understood realities. These realities are not alien from us, they are innate to existence (sat): natural, divine and human as they pertain to humankind. It is just that we were at some pint alienated from them, we got de-natured so to speak, and these realities have been in hiding. A process that happened to us over time from our moment of birth... How that happened...? That is not so important right now, but I can get into that... These temporary concepts, once we have re-immersed into these realities, will fly out the door; when our reintegration occurs they will dissolve... They are like catalysts: concepts do their work and then fly on to other people for whom they may still be useful... When we say that concepts are *only* concepts, they tend to stick to us, hampering their own dissolution. When we see them for what they are, how they were invented and constructed, how and when and by whom they were used for instruction and for what purpose... then they come and go... until we have arrived again... at our original point of departure... which is right here, right now... and really no reason for any departure at all ! Wim lastrainhome [lastrain] Wednesday, October 09, 2002 7:41 AM After Eden Concsiousness........unaware of itself......... Consciousness becomes aware of itself.... Self-consciousness or I-amness appears.... The self becomes an image....an overlay constructed of concepts. The self-image becomes a false identity based on accumulated concepts. The self-identity appears to itself to be separate from other selves. Fear is logical if separation is believed. The world is filtered through the image of self. The world becomes a mirror to the self. The world becomes the self. (I know that these are only concepts.........but I need some input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these ideas......) Michael /join All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. Your use of is subject to --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.386 / Virus Database: 218 - Release 9/9/2002 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.386 / Virus Database: 218 - Release 9/9/2002 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2002 Report Share Posted October 9, 2002 Chiming in with Wim here. There can't be *only* concepts! That's just a sublational teaching to help loosen up attachment to believing that there are things that exist in themselves. That's another way to say what Wim said by saying that they are temporary mind-gadgets. To see that supposed things-in-themselves can't exist apart from a conceptual component helps dissolve the attachment to things existing as independent things. But it certainly doesn't mean that things really *are* concepts! That's just another attachment. And besides, it sounds like Michael is sort of just accepting that "only concept" view on faith, like he still might be suspicious that there really might be *things* out there! Love, --Greg At 01:30 PM 10/9/2002 -0700, Wim Borsboom wrote: >Hi Michael, > >You wrote: >>>> (I know that these are *only* concepts.........but I need some >input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these >ideas......) <<< > >About "concepts" in itself... > >Concepts have received quite a bit of bad press over the last 4 to 5 decades >in the "new agey" world of self realization. > >So, just so that you know, Michael, there is nothing wrong with concepts per >se, as they are, so to say, wonderful but temporary mind gadgets that we may >construct or borrow and use to understand-and-accept as-yet-overwhelming or >as-yet-ill-understood realities. These realities are not alien from us, they >are innate to existence (sat): natural, divine and human as they pertain to >humankind. It is just that we were at some pint alienated from them, we got >de-natured so to speak, and these realities have been in hiding. A process >that happened to us over time from our moment of birth... How that >happened...? That is not so important right now, but I can get into that... >These temporary concepts, once we have re-immersed into these realities, >will fly out the door; when our reintegration occurs they will dissolve... >They are like catalysts: concepts do their work and then fly on to other >people for whom they may still be useful... >When we say that concepts are *only* concepts, they tend to stick to us, >hampering their own dissolution. When we see them for what they are, how >they were invented and constructed, how and when and by whom they were used >for instruction and for what purpose... then they come and go... until we >have arrived again... at our original point of departure... which is right >here, right now... and really no reason for any departure at all ! > >Wim > > > > >lastrainhome [lastrain] >Wednesday, October 09, 2002 7:41 AM > > After Eden > > >Concsiousness........unaware of itself......... > > > >Consciousness becomes aware of itself.... > > > >Self-consciousness or I-amness appears.... > > > >The self becomes an image....an overlay constructed of concepts. > > >The self-image becomes a false identity based on accumulated concepts. > >The self-identity appears to itself to be separate from other selves. > >Fear is logical if separation is believed. > >The world is filtered through the image of self. > >The world becomes a mirror to the self. > >The world becomes the self. > > >(I know that these are only concepts.........but I need some >input...................I'm lost out here on the edge....of these >ideas......) > > > > >Michael > > > > > > > > >/join > > > > > >All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, >perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside >back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than >the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. >Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is >where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal >Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously >arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. > > > >Your use of is subject to > > >--- >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.386 / Virus Database: 218 - Release 9/9/2002 > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.386 / Virus Database: 218 - Release 9/9/2002 > > > >/join > > > > > >All paths go somewhere. No path goes nowhere. Paths, places, sights, perceptions, and indeed all experiences arise from and exist in and subside back into the Space of Awareness. Like waves rising are not different than the ocean, all things arising from Awareness are of the nature of Awareness. Awareness does not come and go but is always Present. It is Home. Home is where the Heart Is. Jnanis know the Heart to be the Finality of Eternal Being. A true devotee relishes in the Truth of Self-Knowledge, spontaneously arising from within into It Self. Welcome all to a. > > > >Your use of is subject to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2002 Report Share Posted October 10, 2002 Sincere thanks to all who responded to my post "After Eden". The questions remain but the questioner is wounded. :-) When I read your posts, moments of clarity broke loose like a covey of quail.......full if excitement......the mind runs behind hoping to capture and hold one. ........but catches nothing but air currents.........and.....one small feather. The feather is lovely........and I offer it to you.......silently........think of quail....and smile. Love Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2002 Report Share Posted October 10, 2002 There can't be only can'ts. There must be some cans --somewhere. Wim, can (can't) you offer a linguistic basis for a "can of worms" :-). --- Gregory Goode <goode wrote: > Chiming in with Wim here. > > There can't be *only* concepts! ===== /join Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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