Guest guest Posted September 26, 2003 Report Share Posted September 26, 2003 Most Respected Sir, On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote : > Hello Bhuvan, > > It took me a bit long to answer you because I have >been somewhat busy with mundane affairs, especially University. > You're talking about LOVING THE ONE WHO >LOVES...LOVING THE SELF? > Yes that is interesting. That is something I do not >as much as I would like. I often find myself with low motivation >because I have been through so many experiences and yet I know >love can only pour through me if I first of all love myself >passionately. > The problem when I tried to find my Self was: > 1- I thought: is my body the Self? No. My body is not >my Self otherwise it would not be MY body. ***** Yes,sir. > 2- then I thought: are my feelings and thoughts my >Self? No, they cannot be, since they pass before me like a cloud >passes in the sky. ****** Yewss,sir. > 3- then I thought: is my consciousness my Self? And >the answer was, YES, but my consciousness is not my MIND. my Mind >is a product from my Consciousness. So I have found: > Consciousness creates Mind creates Body creates >Consciousness. OOPS,, > Is this a vicious circle? I think yes it is. ***** Not at all ,sir,according to my own humble experience!!! 1.Consciousness has Nature as ITS ENERGY (PRAKRUTHI). 2.When Consciousness reflects in Nature (in its Sattva dominated state),that reflection is called Iswara -BHUVANESWARA ,my name!!!!- 3.Iswara controls nature and stirs it ,as it were , to act . 4.Nature acts and then that act becomes creation.Differentiated as this and that. 5.Iswara then reflects himself - like the sun reflecting in waves - and appears as many.That secondary reflection is called a jiva.It is bound by the differentited piece of nature as a wave is.THe structure of the piece determines the nature of the reflection.Sometimes ,it gets crooked as in a wave,sometimes bright , sometimes dull,etc.That is it enjoys and suffers, loves and hates,etc. 6.when you ask the question and leave the question aside and hold on to the questioner,you are holding on to this blessed secondary reflection ,or secondary awareness, called JIIIVVVAAA : he who lives or experiences his karma phalam. 7. when you hold on to him tightly, as I said,you are not aware of the body you hold.This is what happens when you hold someonevery dear to you in distress.Your and the other body or object or anything simply gets blockedfrom your sensation. 8.When you still intensely be,BE,BE,BE,that awareness,you will retrace the secondary reflection to the source from which it came.That source - I do not know - according to my Master is the SOURCE OF ALL SOURCES the beginning of all shows,boy!!! 9. It is not created by the body nor the mind but It is the source for their creation by Nature.Mind is nature;body is nature;sexual feelings are nature,too;sex is also nature too. 10. The drama changes the scenes and you begin to enjoy another sweetness which as it becomes more and more considers the bodily pleasures as cheap - something like a man discarding a roadside hut to a palace of luxury. 11. your sexual appetite for woman is because you think it is a plesure and so you are caught in the ignorance and then get lost in it until one day you realise that it is a poison _- You will one day realise that drinking is a poison ,only IF YOU CRITICALLY EXAMINE THE SUFFERING.It is called vichara.YU MUST DO IT. ### THere is no other short cut ,BOY!!!### 12. AS you do this vichara,then you realise that it is a waste of time.BUT YOU WILL NOT ABANDON THIS DESIRE FOR drink nor WOMAN. 13. All the characters who talk elonquently about advaita but who have not experienced this bliss - small though - can never succeed in the elimination of desire. 14. As your convition becomes stronger and stronger by rethinking and rethinking about the uselessness of sexual desire.Then another act unfolds. 15. You consciously try to avoid it.It is a struggle that depends on your WILL POWER.Your WILL needs to be constantly reinforced to destroy this enemy that kills you.You get it first by satsangh,then pilgrimage,then scriptural reading,then meditation , and so on. 16. your impressions begin to be erased and reorganised as in a floppy.IF they are not erased permanently,you will continue to behave in the same way ,however much you read,meditate,and do all kinds of sadhana.But even a mountain will become rubble as you go on breaking it.If You have the dynamite of conviction triggered by will ,it will blast the vasana in no time.That is what happened to Sri Ramana. He simply threw away everything and headed towards Arunachala.Please ask Sri Harsha about his. He will be in a better position to tell you. Then at another meditation I found out: > What I call "outside world" does not exist in fact >(law of insubstantiality, anatman), and neither do I. This is all Shastra vasana which many in the advaitin list do!!! If you have realised it as pure knowlegde and not as information,then you will neither drink nor have sex nor become a victim of maya!!! This is what I humbly submit!!! Practice the vichara and abandon the bad company, deliberately,forcefully, and at the same time take care that it will not choke you.Slowly, the impure vasana changes to pure vasana.It is all a game of vasana.Vasana is drudha bhavana 'strong thought ' that impels you to action without an antececedent or a precedent cause. Get back to the source, the questioner,every time you get the desire. change the topic first ,sing the song of the lord,do something in the initial stages. later on you can confront it face to face.If you are weak ,it will devour you.you may land ina hospital for someother tragedy. > The outside world appears as a very complex >projection of the Self. It is a projection which has: > 1- a past aspect, which is more basally experienced >as the body and the background of the phenomena you witness (for >example, a car passes before you on a street. The background >would be the street, the village or town or city, etc.) This >first aspect related to past is related to group consciousness, >racial type consciousness and is the more animal type or layer of >the experience. The past aspect is basically experienced as body >and world -- there were past actions which supposedly generated >your birth at a certain place that already existed when you were >born. > 2- there is a present aspect which is expressed as >the individual perception of the phenomena, i.e., the individual >is aware of his existence and his interactions with the external >world, through his mind. This is basically the mind. > 3- there is a future or simultaneous aspect which is >related to the immediate projections of the Self in this world >and body of the past. This happens through many things such as >syncronicity. For example, last night I went to buy wax for my >surfboard. I went to a small surfshop and I was thinking what >brand I would buy. Since I have not surfed for 3 years, I did not >remember any brand of surfing wax. I thought "I'll buy the most >famous one" as I walked into the shop. When I looked at the place >where the little bricks of wax were placed, the first brand my >eyes fell on was.... "FAMOUS" SURFING WAX. This experience was so >interesting, I began to laugh. I immediately I remembered >Maharshi when he wrote about SIMULTANEOUS CREATION. **** Yugapat srushti and all those theories are beyond the state of a boozer,boy!!! we only have the information but no knowledge of them. Ajata vada is th other aspect. First, let us consolidate your position vis a vis the desire for booze or for woman. Get married ,if you cannot control yourself.so you have already taken the first step of avoiding wandering. next love her,then you have already blocked your dissipation.If you cannot love her,you get into the vicious circle!!! This also remembered me of Jan and Percy here talking about the play of Maya. But to enter into this 3rd layer of experience is somewhat frightening, your normal reasoning mechanisms have to be transcended and this scares me a lot, I'm afraid of going insane although for some reason I know that I have passed the point where I could go insane on that. people talk about insanity and all that jazz music.It is because,they have not cleared of their impure vasanas and then try to do the jump.When I did not know horse-riding and I tried to ride,I fell.bBut later on when I learnt it ,it is inexplicable thrill. Every game has its rules and exercises. Please do not believe in all this crap talk.The fear is the fear of attachment to the body.First purify yourself by mananam,sravanam,nidhidhyasanam, and all that exercising. There is no way except this to hold your mind face to face and blast it to so that it will listen to you and not you to it. > This lead me to the astonishing conclusion that the >world is an illusion, an individual spiritual projection, and >everyone has the ability to access this 3rd layer of experience >and comprove this for him/herself. It's like a hologram, each >little piece contains the whole as well as the whole contains >each little piece. You can experience both sides of this, while >the majority of people only experience the second possibility of >experience, which is that of ignorance (the self is a product of >the whole). Not only this is true, but also that the whole is a >reflection of the self. Then ,why waste time! go ahead and be the SElf. Make the move now ,here,and win the game!!! > May we all achieve Liberation and in our way, may >Love and Peace pour through us all. > > Frederico > > - > bhuvan eswar chilukuri > > Tuesday, September 23, 2003 2:30 PM > Re: Apologies > > > My dear soul of the soul of the soul, > > By the by , i AM A CHARACTER BORN IN INDIA AND BROUGHT UP IN >INDIA > AND WORKED IN NIGERIA!!!! > > Who is this I ??? > > I have not been reading the mail carefully!!! > > did you try my request made in my last letter!!! > > I am interested to know what you find. > > Let us share your experience of this type of love making: > > Loving the one who does the loving thing!!! > > Love always, > > bhuvaneswar > > > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote : > > Hello Harsha, Jan and all, > > > > First, Jan (if this is your name; I am referring >to > >the person who writes with the email ecirada) I'm awfully >sorry > >if I sounded agressive in my exposition of what I consider to >be > >the sacred nature of the male-female love. Yes you can >consider > >this old-fashioned, but in my opinion even being very actual >and > >updated in terms of mentality a person can still have this > >idealistic vision of mating. > > When I quoted Buddha I never did that to compare >you > >or to suggest subtly that you were "a pig". I simply made a > >rational statement that could be better put by me as: "each >one > >sees what he or she wants to see". > > I do not understand how can one person consider >love > >between male and female to be darkness. Or perhaps let us >call it > >PASSION instead of LOVE. Love is a strong word and there is >only > >one love, which is divine, of which this lesser love of >gender is > >but a lower reflection, as I have said. > > By exposing my opinions in this Satsang I am >not > >trying to force my views on anyone. Sometimes I am a little > >beclouded and of course I go a little too far in statements >and I > >am somewhat fierce in exposing my points of view. > > Now seriously, my sincere apologies Jan. > > Since this is a friendly conversation forum, I >would > >like to ask Clownpercy one question. > > Percy, why do you always refer to yourself in >the > >third person (you write "Percy read", "Percy needs time", >etc.) > >Is this because from your vantage point you are not Percy? >If > >this is the case, I would like to know more about your > >experience. Also I would like to know where you are from, >Percy, > >and also Jan, Harsha and Bhuvan. As I have said I am from > >Brazil. > > > > Cheers! > > Frederico > > > > > > _ > Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman. > Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !! > Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1 > > > Sponsor > > > > > > /join > > > > > > "Love itself is the actual form of God." > > Sri Ramana > > In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma > > Terms of >Service. > _ Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman. Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !! Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 26, 2003 Report Share Posted September 26, 2003 I greet you with all joy and humbleness Bhuvan Ishwar, I have had some experiences which only later I would know that ANOTHER PERSON HAD ALREADY HAD A SIMILAR EXPERIENCE. I will be sincere to you since I feel: - you are a very good person - you are very well informed - you have an advanced degree of understanding of the phenomenal universe I have always wondered what I was doing on Earth and what it really was. From early childhood , at about 6 years of age, I manifested a strong feeling for women. I would go and kiss girls of my class, 6 year-old, and be punished and they would be afraid of me. Later this would turn to a more normal appreciation of the beauty of women. The theory I am at present PRACTICING and studying is basically Drishti-Shristi Vada. If you know about this, you know how this theory is a jump, as you put it. This is because at a party, 1 year ago, in the full moon of september 2002, I had one of the most frightening experiences of my life -- and I had many, surfing in the sea, crashing with the car, getting punched in the face etc. I took a little amount of a substance called LSD and two hours later something dawned. I was not in control. I was seeing what I had to see. What I saw shocked me but at the same time made me very happy. I will summarize what I saw. It is a mirror. The dream, the experience of being a subject, is a mirror. I would think "hmm the weather is so like in germany today" and I would look and see a blonde guy with a sweater written "BAVARIA". I would be thinking about something and something which correlated with that would appear. This happened at a rave party. Since then I have had this experience other times, it's also the same experience. It's simultaneous creation. It is gigantic and frightening and yet, there is a joy and a love there I cannot forget. I feel that my way is to achieve this experience permanently but I run away from it, because it would take all meaning and all illusion from me, all my concepts, my subtle projections in the world, would vanish, and I would remain as the "Projector". I am not in the stage of the booze-drinker. I know I have long ago , lives ago, passed this stage. But what am I to do? I simply cannot put all my energy and effort for going AGAINST what my family, my society wants me to do, because I am a product of this. I was born in a family and a society which have no knowledge of Vedas or Advaita and does not know all this is true. I was born in a family which values health, wealth and a good spouse and that's what they want for me. And also, that's what I want for me. Why can't I be a lawyer and a spiritual seeker? Is it impossible for a lawyer to attain self-realization? Love and thank you for your kind frienship, Frederico - bhuvan eswar chilukuri Friday, September 26, 2003 10:48 AM Re: Re: [Let us practice now ] Apologies and Hologram Most Respected Sir,On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote :> Hello Bhuvan,>> It took me a bit long to answer you because I have >been somewhat busy with mundane affairs, especially University.> You're talking about LOVING THE ONE WHO >LOVES...LOVING THE SELF?> Yes that is interesting. That is something I do not >as much as I would like. I often find myself with low motivation >because I have been through so many experiences and yet I know >love can only pour through me if I first of all love myself >passionately.> The problem when I tried to find my Self was:> 1- I thought: is my body the Self? No. My body is not >my Self otherwise it would not be MY body.***** Yes,sir.> 2- then I thought: are my feelings and thoughts my >Self? No, they cannot be, since they pass before me like a cloud >passes in the sky.****** Yewss,sir.> 3- then I thought: is my consciousness my Self? And >the answer was, YES, but my consciousness is not my MIND. my Mind >is a product from my Consciousness. So I have found:> Consciousness creates Mind creates Body creates >Consciousness. OOPS,,> Is this a vicious circle? I think yes it is.***** Not at all ,sir,according to my own humble experience!!! 1.Consciousness has Nature as ITS ENERGY (PRAKRUTHI). 2.When Consciousness reflects in Nature (in its Sattva dominated state),that reflection is called Iswara -BHUVANESWARA ,my name!!!!- 3.Iswara controls nature and stirs it ,as it were , to act . 4.Nature acts and then that act becomes creation.Differentiated as this and that. 5.Iswara then reflects himself - like the sun reflecting in waves - and appears as many.That secondary reflection is called a jiva.It is bound by the differentited piece of nature as a wave is.THe structure of the piece determines the nature of the reflection.Sometimes ,it gets crooked as in a wave,sometimes bright , sometimes dull,etc.That is it enjoys and suffers, loves and hates,etc. 6.when you ask the question and leave the question aside and hold on to the questioner,you are holding on to this blessed secondary reflection ,or secondary awareness, called JIIIVVVAAA : he who lives or experiences his karma phalam. 7. when you hold on to him tightly, as I said,you are not aware of the body you hold.This is what happens when you hold someonevery dear to you in distress.Your and the other body or object or anything simply gets blockedfrom your sensation. 8.When you still intensely be,BE,BE,BE,that awareness,you will retrace the secondary reflection to the source from which it came.That source - I do not know - according to my Master is the SOURCE OF ALL SOURCESthe beginning of all shows,boy!!! 9. It is not created by the body nor the mind but It is the source for their creation by Nature.Mind is nature;body is nature;sexual feelings are nature,too;sex is also nature too.10. The drama changes the scenes and you begin to enjoy another sweetness which as it becomes more and more considers the bodily pleasures as cheap - something like a man discarding a roadside hut to a palace of luxury.11. your sexual appetite for woman is because you think it is a plesure and so you are caught in the ignorance and then get lost in it until one day you realise that it is a poison _- You will one day realise that drinking is a poison ,only IF YOU CRITICALLY EXAMINE THE SUFFERING.It is called vichara.YU MUST DO IT.### THere is no other short cut ,BOY!!!###12. AS you do this vichara,then you realise that it is a waste of time.BUT YOU WILL NOT ABANDON THIS DESIRE FOR drink nor WOMAN.13. All the characters who talk elonquently about advaita but who have not experienced this bliss - small though - can never succeed in the elimination of desire.14. As your convition becomes stronger and stronger by rethinking and rethinking about the uselessness of sexual desire.Then another act unfolds.15. You consciously try to avoid it.It is a struggle that depends on your WILL POWER.Your WILL needs to be constantly reinforced to destroy this enemy that kills you.You get it first by satsangh,then pilgrimage,then scriptural reading,then meditation , and so on.16. your impressions begin to be erased and reorganised as in a floppy.IF they are not erased permanently,you will continue to behave in the same way ,however much you read,meditate,and do all kinds of sadhana.But even a mountain will become rubble as you go on breaking it.If You have the dynamite of conviction triggered by will ,it will blast the vasana in no time.That is what happened to Sri Ramana. He simply threw away everything and headed towards Arunachala.Please ask Sri Harsha about his. He will be in a better position to tell you.Then at another meditation I found out:> What I call "outside world" does not exist in fact >(law of insubstantiality, anatman), and neither do I.This is all Shastra vasana which many in the advaitin list do!!!If you have realised it as pure knowlegde and not as information,thenyou will neither drink nor have sex nor become a victim of maya!!!This is what I humbly submit!!!Practice the vichara and abandon the bad company, deliberately,forcefully, and at the same time take care that it will not choke you.Slowly, the impure vasana changes to purevasana.It is all a game of vasana.Vasana is drudha bhavana 'strong thought ' that impels you to action without an antececedent or a precedent cause.Get back to the source, the questioner,every time you get the desire.change the topic first ,sing the song of the lord,do something in the initial stages. later on you can confront it face to face.If you are weak ,it will devour you.you may land ina hospital for someother tragedy.> The outside world appears as a very complex >projection of the Self. It is a projection which has:> 1- a past aspect, which is more basally experienced >as the body and the background of the phenomena you witness (for >example, a car passes before you on a street. The background >would be the street, the village or town or city, etc.) This >first aspect related to past is related to group consciousness, >racial type consciousness and is the more animal type or layer of >the experience. The past aspect is basically experienced as body >and world -- there were past actions which supposedly generated >your birth at a certain place that already existed when you were >born.> 2- there is a present aspect which is expressed as >the individual perception of the phenomena, i.e., the individual >is aware of his existence and his interactions with the external >world, through his mind. This is basically the mind.> 3- there is a future or simultaneous aspect which is >related to the immediate projections of the Self in this world >and body of the past. This happens through many things such as >syncronicity. For example, last night I went to buy wax for my >surfboard. I went to a small surfshop and I was thinking what >brand I would buy. Since I have not surfed for 3 years, I did not >remember any brand of surfing wax. I thought "I'll buy the most >famous one" as I walked into the shop. When I looked at the place >where the little bricks of wax were placed, the first brand my >eyes fell on was.... "FAMOUS" SURFING WAX. This experience was so >interesting, I began to laugh. I immediately I remembered >Maharshi when he wrote about SIMULTANEOUS CREATION.****Yugapat srushti and all those theories are beyond the state of a boozer,boy!!! we only have the information but no knowledge of them.Ajata vada is th other aspect.First, let us consolidate your position vis a vis the desire for booze or for woman.Get married ,if you cannot control yourself.so you have already taken the first step of avoiding wandering.next love her,then you have already blocked your dissipation.If you cannot love her,you get into the vicious circle!!! This also remembered me of Jan and Percy here talking about the play of Maya. But to enter into this 3rd layer of experience is somewhat frightening, your normal reasoning mechanisms have to be transcended and this scares me a lot, I'm afraid of going insane although for some reason I know that I have passed the point where I could go insane on that.people talk about insanity and all that jazz music.It is because,they have not cleared of their impure vasanas and then try to do the jump.When I did not know horse-riding and I tried to ride,I fell.bBut later on when I learnt it ,it is inexplicable thrill.Every game has its rules and exercises.Please do not believe in all this crap talk.The fear is the fear of attachment to the body.First purify yourself by mananam,sravanam,nidhidhyasanam, and all that exercising.There is no way except this to hold your mind face to face and blast it to so that it will listen to you and not you to it.> This lead me to the astonishing conclusion that the >world is an illusion, an individual spiritual projection, and >everyone has the ability to access this 3rd layer of experience >and comprove this for him/herself. It's like a hologram, each >little piece contains the whole as well as the whole contains >each little piece. You can experience both sides of this, while >the majority of people only experience the second possibility of >experience, which is that of ignorance (the self is a product of >the whole). Not only this is true, but also that the whole is a >reflection of the self.Then ,why waste time! go ahead and be the SElf.Make the move now ,here,and win the game!!!> May we all achieve Liberation and in our way, may >Love and Peace pour through us all.>> Frederico>> ----- Original Message -----> bhuvan eswar chilukuri> To: > Tuesday, September 23, 2003 2:30 PM> Re: Apologies>>> My dear soul of the soul of the soul,>> By the by , i AM A CHARACTER BORN IN INDIA AND BROUGHT UP IN >INDIA> AND WORKED IN NIGERIA!!!!>> Who is this I ???>> I have not been reading the mail carefully!!!>> did you try my request made in my last letter!!!>> I am interested to know what you find.>> Let us share your experience of this type of love making:>> Loving the one who does the loving thing!!!>> Love always,>> bhuvaneswar>>>> On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote :> > Hello Harsha, Jan and all,> >> > First, Jan (if this is your name; I am referring >to> >the person who writes with the email ecirada) I'm awfully >sorry> >if I sounded agressive in my exposition of what I consider to >be> >the sacred nature of the male-female love. Yes you can >consider> >this old-fashioned, but in my opinion even being very actual >and> >updated in terms of mentality a person can still have this> >idealistic vision of mating.> > When I quoted Buddha I never did that to compare >you> >or to suggest subtly that you were "a pig". I simply made a> >rational statement that could be better put by me as: "each >one> >sees what he or she wants to see".> > I do not understand how can one person consider >love> >between male and female to be darkness. Or perhaps let us >call it> >PASSION instead of LOVE. Love is a strong word and there is >only> >one love, which is divine, of which this lesser love of >gender is> >but a lower reflection, as I have said.> > By exposing my opinions in this Satsang I am >not> >trying to force my views on anyone. Sometimes I am a little> >beclouded and of course I go a little too far in statements >and I> >am somewhat fierce in exposing my points of view.> > Now seriously, my sincere apologies Jan.> > Since this is a friendly conversation forum, I >would> >like to ask Clownpercy one question.> > Percy, why do you always refer to yourself in >the> >third person (you write "Percy read", "Percy needs time", >etc.)> >Is this because from your vantage point you are not Percy? >If> >this is the case, I would like to know more about your> >experience. Also I would like to know where you are from, >Percy,> >and also Jan, Harsha and Bhuvan. As I have said I am from> >Brazil.> >> > Cheers!> > Frederico> >> >>> _> Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman.> Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !!> Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1>>> Sponsor> >>>>> /join>> >> >> "Love itself is the actual form of God.">> Sri Ramana>> In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma>> Your use of is subject to the Terms of >Service.>_Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman.Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !!Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1/join "Love itself is the actual form of God."Sri RamanaIn "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma Terms of Service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 Dear Frederico of course you can be whatever you want and "proceed" on the spiritual path. B u t what you have to do - and this is not dependend on your age - is to take decisions! Y ou have to decide in which kind of world you want to live. And here is your "problem". Serving different masters makes you sick! This you know since ages............ So please get a move in do not be a spoiled baby do not think chasing woman being a womanizer makes you a man A man a mensch a human being with value has to give his best his utmost best for whatever he loves and do not forget OUR LORD DOES NOT LIKE THE LUKEWARM PEOPLE only those who give their utmost even for the wrong case by the way let me know your birthday maybe I can tell you "something" about yourself michael_bindel (AT) hotmail (DOT) com >"Frederico S. Gonzales" > > >Re: Re: Re: [Let us practice now ] Apologies and Hologram >Fri, 26 Sep 2003 13:05:41 -0300 > > I greet you with all joy and humbleness Bhuvan Ishwar, > > I have had some experiences which only later I would know that ANOTHER PERSON HAD ALREADY HAD A SIMILAR EXPERIENCE. > I will be sincere to you since I feel: > - you are a very good person > - you are very well informed > - you have an advanced degree of understanding of the phenomenal universe > > I have always wondered what I was doing on Earth and what it really was. > From early childhood , at about 6 years of age, I manifested a strong feeling for women. I would go and kiss girls of my class, 6 year-old, and be punished and they would be afraid of me. Later this would turn to a more normal appreciation of the beauty of women. > The theory I am at present PRACTICING and studying is basically Drishti-Shristi Vada. If you know about this, you know how this theory is a jump, as you put it. This is because at a party, 1 year ago, in the full moon of september 2002, I had one of the most frightening experiences of my life -- and I had many, surfing in the sea, crashing with the car, getting punched in the face etc. > I took a little amount of a substance called LSD and two hours later something dawned. I was not in control. I was seeing what I had to see. > What I saw shocked me but at the same time made me very happy. I will summarize what I saw. > It is a mirror. The dream, the experience of being a subject, is a mirror. I would think "hmm the weather is so like in germany today" and I would look and see a blonde guy with a sweater written "BAVARIA". I would be thinking about something and something which correlated with that would appear. This happened at a rave party. > Since then I have had this experience other times, it's also the same experience. It's simultaneous creation. It is gigantic and frightening and yet, there is a joy and a love there I cannot forget. I feel that my way is to achieve this experience permanently but I run away from it, because it would take all meaning and all illusion from me, all my concepts, my subtle projections in the world, would vanish, and I would remain as the "Projector". > I am not in the stage of the booze-drinker. I know I have long ago , lives ago, passed this stage. But what am I to do? I simply cannot put all my energy and effort for going AGAINST what my family, my society wants me to do, because I am a product of this. I was born in a family and a society which have no knowledge of Vedas or Advaita and does not know all this is true. I was born in a family which values health, wealth and a good spouse and that's what they want for me. And also, that's what I want for me. Why can't I be a lawyer and a spiritual seeker? Is it impossible for a lawyer to attain self-realization? > > Love and thank you for your kind frienship, > > Frederico > > > > > >- > bhuvan eswar chilukuri > > Friday, September 26, 2003 10:48 AM > Re: Re: [Let us practice now ] Apologies and Hologram > > > Most Respected Sir, > > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote : > > Hello Bhuvan, > > > > It took me a bit long to answer you because I have > >been somewhat busy with mundane affairs, especially University. > > You're talking about LOVING THE ONE WHO > >LOVES...LOVING THE SELF? > > Yes that is interesting. That is something I do not > >as much as I would like. I often find myself with low motivation > >because I have been through so many experiences and yet I know > >love can only pour through me if I first of all love myself > >passionately. > > The problem when I tried to find my Self was: > > 1- I thought: is my body the Self? No. My body is not > >my Self otherwise it would not be MY body. > > ***** Yes,sir. > > > 2- then I thought: are my feelings and thoughts my > >Self? No, they cannot be, since they pass before me like a cloud > >passes in the sky. > > ****** Yewss,sir. > > > 3- then I thought: is my consciousness my Self? And > >the answer was, YES, but my consciousness is not my MIND. my Mind > >is a product from my Consciousness. So I have found: > > Consciousness creates Mind creates Body creates > >Consciousness. OOPS,, > > Is this a vicious circle? I think yes it is. > > ***** Not at all ,sir,according to my own humble > experience!!! > > 1.Consciousness has Nature as ITS ENERGY (PRAKRUTHI). > > 2.When Consciousness reflects in Nature (in its Sattva > dominated state),that reflection is called Iswara -BHUVANESWARA > ,my name!!!!- > > 3.Iswara controls nature and stirs it ,as it were , to act . > > 4.Nature acts and then that act becomes creation.Differentiated > as this and that. > > 5.Iswara then reflects himself - like the sun reflecting in > waves - and appears as many.That secondary reflection is called a > jiva.It is bound by the differentited piece of nature as a wave > is.THe structure of the piece determines the nature of the > reflection.Sometimes ,it gets crooked as in a wave,sometimes > bright , sometimes dull,etc.That is it enjoys and suffers, loves > and hates,etc. > > 6.when you ask the question and leave the question aside and > hold on to the questioner,you are holding on to this blessed > secondary reflection ,or secondary awareness, called JIIIVVVAAA : > he who lives or experiences his karma phalam. > > 7. when you hold on to him tightly, as I said,you are not aware > of the body you hold.This is what happens when you hold > someonevery dear to you in distress.Your and the other body or > object or anything simply gets blockedfrom your sensation. > > 8.When you still intensely be,BE,BE,BE,that awareness,you will > retrace the secondary reflection to the source from which it > came.That source - I do not know - according to my Master is the > SOURCE OF ALL SOURCES > the beginning of all shows,boy!!! > > 9. It is not created by the body nor the mind but It is the > source for their creation by Nature.Mind is nature;body is > nature;sexual feelings are nature,too;sex is also nature too. > > 10. The drama changes the scenes and you begin to enjoy another > sweetness which as it becomes more and more considers the bodily > pleasures as cheap - something like a man discarding a roadside > hut to a palace of luxury. > > 11. your sexual appetite for woman is because you think it is a > plesure and so you are caught in the ignorance and then get lost > in it until one day you realise that it is a poison _- You will > one day realise that drinking is a poison ,only IF YOU CRITICALLY > EXAMINE THE SUFFERING.It is called vichara.YU MUST DO IT. > > ### THere is no other short cut ,BOY!!!### > > 12. AS you do this vichara,then you realise that it is a waste of > time.BUT YOU WILL NOT ABANDON THIS DESIRE FOR drink nor WOMAN. > > 13. All the characters who talk elonquently about advaita but who > have not experienced this bliss - small though - can never succeed > in the elimination of desire. > > 14. As your convition becomes stronger and stronger by rethinking > and rethinking about the uselessness of sexual desire.Then another > act unfolds. > > 15. You consciously try to avoid it.It is a struggle that depends > on your WILL POWER.Your WILL needs to be constantly reinforced to > destroy this enemy that kills you.You get it first by > satsangh,then pilgrimage,then scriptural reading,then meditation , > and so on. > > 16. your impressions begin to be erased and reorganised as in a > floppy.IF they are not erased permanently,you will continue to > behave in the same way ,however much you read,meditate,and do all > kinds of sadhana.But even a mountain will become rubble as you go > on breaking it.If You have the dynamite of conviction triggered by > will ,it will blast the vasana in no time.That is what happened to > Sri Ramana. He simply threw away everything and headed towards > Arunachala.Please ask Sri Harsha about his. He will be in a better > position to tell you. > > > Then at another meditation I found out: > > What I call "outside world" does not exist in fact > >(law of insubstantiality, anatman), and neither do I. > > This is all Shastra vasana which many in the advaitin list do!!! > If you have realised it as pure knowlegde and not as > information,then > you will neither drink nor have sex nor become a victim of > maya!!! > > This is what I humbly submit!!! > > Practice the vichara and abandon the bad company, > deliberately,forcefully, and at the same time take care that it > will not choke you.Slowly, the impure vasana changes to pure > vasana.It is all a game of vasana.Vasana is drudha bhavana 'strong > thought ' that impels you to action without an antececedent or a > precedent cause. > > Get back to the source, the questioner,every time you get the > desire. > change the topic first ,sing the song of the lord,do something in > the initial stages. later on you can confront it face to face.If > you are weak ,it will devour you.you may land ina hospital for > someother tragedy. > > > > The outside world appears as a very complex > >projection of the Self. It is a projection which has: > > 1- a past aspect, which is more basally experienced > >as the body and the background of the phenomena you witness (for > >example, a car passes before you on a street. The background > >would be the street, the village or town or city, etc.) This > >first aspect related to past is related to group consciousness, > >racial type consciousness and is the more animal type or layer of > >the experience. The past aspect is basically experienced as body > >and world -- there were past actions which supposedly generated > >your birth at a certain place that already existed when you were > >born. > > 2- there is a present aspect which is expressed as > >the individual perception of the phenomena, i.e., the individual > >is aware of his existence and his interactions with the external > >world, through his mind. This is basically the mind. > > 3- there is a future or simultaneous aspect which is > >related to the immediate projections of the Self in this world > >and body of the past. This happens through many things such as > >syncronicity. For example, last night I went to buy wax for my > >surfboard. I went to a small surfshop and I was thinking what > >brand I would buy. Since I have not surfed for 3 years, I did not > >remember any brand of surfing wax. I thought "I'll buy the most > >famous one" as I walked into the shop. When I looked at the place > >where the little bricks of wax were placed, the first brand my > >eyes fell on was.... "FAMOUS" SURFING WAX. This experience was so > >interesting, I began to laugh. I immediately I remembered > >Maharshi when he wrote about SIMULTANEOUS CREATION. > > **** > > Yugapat srushti and all those theories are beyond the state of a > boozer,boy!!! we only have the information but no knowledge of > them. > > Ajata vada is th other aspect. > > First, let us consolidate your position vis a vis the desire for > booze or for woman. > > Get married ,if you cannot control yourself.so you have already > taken the first step of avoiding wandering. > next love her,then you have already blocked your dissipation.If > you cannot love her,you get into the vicious circle!!! > > > > This also remembered me of Jan and Percy here talking about the > play of Maya. But to enter into this 3rd layer of experience is > somewhat frightening, your normal reasoning mechanisms have to be > transcended and this scares me a lot, I'm afraid of going insane > although for some reason I know that I have passed the point where > I could go insane on that. > > people talk about insanity and all that jazz music.It is > because,they have not cleared of their impure vasanas and then try > to do the jump.When I did not know horse-riding and I tried to > ride,I fell.bBut later on when I learnt it ,it is inexplicable > thrill. > > Every game has its rules and exercises. > > Please do not believe in all this crap talk.The fear is the fear > of attachment to the body.First purify yourself by > mananam,sravanam,nidhidhyasanam, and all that exercising. > > There is no way except this to hold your mind face to face and > blast it to so that it will listen to you and not you to it. > > > > > This lead me to the astonishing conclusion that the > >world is an illusion, an individual spiritual projection, and > >everyone has the ability to access this 3rd layer of experience > >and comprove this for him/herself. It's like a hologram, each > >little piece contains the whole as well as the whole contains > >each little piece. You can experience both sides of this, while > >the majority of people only experience the second possibility of > >experience, which is that of ignorance (the self is a product of > >the whole). Not only this is true, but also that the whole is a > >reflection of the self. > > Then ,why waste time! go ahead and be the SElf. > > Make the move now ,here,and win the game!!! > > May we all achieve Liberation and in our way, may > >Love and Peace pour through us all. > > > > Frederico > > > > - > > bhuvan eswar chilukuri > > > > Tuesday, September 23, 2003 2:30 PM > > Re: Apologies > > > > > > My dear soul of the soul of the soul, > > > > By the by , i AM A CHARACTER BORN IN INDIA AND BROUGHT UP IN > >INDIA > > AND WORKED IN NIGERIA!!!! > > > > Who is this I ??? > > > > I have not been reading the mail carefully!!! > > > > did you try my request made in my last letter!!! > > > > I am interested to know what you find. > > > > Let us share your experience of this type of love making: > > > > Loving the one who does the loving thing!!! > > > > Love always, > > > > bhuvaneswar > > > > > > > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote : > > > Hello Harsha, Jan and all, > > > > > > First, Jan (if this is your name; I am referring > >to > > >the person who writes with the email ecirada) I'm awfully > >sorry > > >if I sounded agressive in my exposition of what I consider to > >be > > >the sacred nature of the male-female love. Yes you can > >consider > > >this old-fashioned, but in my opinion even being very actual > >and > > >updated in terms of mentality a person can still have this > > >idealistic vision of mating. > > > When I quoted Buddha I never did that to compare > >you > > >or to suggest subtly that you were "a pig". I simply made a > > >rational statement that could be better put by me as: "each > >one > > >sees what he or she wants to see". > > > I do not understand how can one person consider > >love > > >between male and female to be darkness. Or perhaps let us > >call it > > >PASSION instead of LOVE. Love is a strong word and there is > >only > > >one love, which is divine, of which this lesser love of > >gender is > > >but a lower reflection, as I have said. > > > By exposing my opinions in this Satsang I am > >not > > >trying to force my views on anyone. Sometimes I am a little > > >beclouded and of course I go a little too far in statements > >and I > > >am somewhat fierce in exposing my points of view. > > > Now seriously, my sincere apologies Jan. > > > Since this is a friendly conversation forum, I > >would > > >like to ask Clownpercy one question. > > > Percy, why do you always refer to yourself in > >the > > >third person (you write "Percy read", "Percy needs time", > >etc.) > > >Is this because from your vantage point you are not Percy? > >If > > >this is the case, I would like to know more about your > > >experience. Also I would like to know where you are from, > >Percy, > > >and also Jan, Harsha and Bhuvan. As I have said I am from > > >Brazil. > > > > > > Cheers! > > > Frederico > > > > > > > > > > _ > > Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman. > > Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !! > > Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1 > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > /join > > > > > > > > > > > > "Love itself is the actual form of God." > > > > Sri Ramana > > > > In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > >Service. > > > > _ > Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman. > Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !! > Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1 > > > Sponsor > > > > > > /join > > > > > > "Love itself is the actual form of God." > > Sri Ramana > > In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma > > Your use of is subject to the > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 Dear Frederico of course you can be whatever you want and "proceed" on the spiritual path. B u t what you have to do - and this is not dependend on your age - is to take decisions! Y ou have to decide in which kind of world you want to live. And here is your "problem". Serving different masters makes you sick! This you know since ages............ So please get a move in do not be a spoiled baby do not think chasing woman being a womanizer makes you a man A man a mensch a human being with value has to give his best his utmost best for whatever he loves and do not forget OUR LORD DOES NOT LIKE THE LUKEWARM PEOPLE only those who give their utmost even for the wrong case by the way let me know your birthday maybe I can tell you "something" about yourself michael_bindel (AT) hotmail (DOT) com >"Frederico S. Gonzales" > > >Re: Re: Re: [Let us practice now ] Apologies and Hologram >Fri, 26 Sep 2003 13:05:41 -0300 > > I greet you with all joy and humbleness Bhuvan Ishwar, > > I have had some experiences which only later I would know that ANOTHER PERSON HAD ALREADY HAD A SIMILAR EXPERIENCE. > I will be sincere to you since I feel: > - you are a very good person > - you are very well informed > - you have an advanced degree of understanding of the phenomenal universe > > I have always wondered what I was doing on Earth and what it really was. > From early childhood , at about 6 years of age, I manifested a strong feeling for women. I would go and kiss girls of my class, 6 year-old, and be punished and they would be afraid of me. Later this would turn to a more normal appreciation of the beauty of women. > The theory I am at present PRACTICING and studying is basically Drishti-Shristi Vada. If you know about this, you know how this theory is a jump, as you put it. This is because at a party, 1 year ago, in the full moon of september 2002, I had one of the most frightening experiences of my life -- and I had many, surfing in the sea, crashing with the car, getting punched in the face etc. > I took a little amount of a substance called LSD and two hours later something dawned. I was not in control. I was seeing what I had to see. > What I saw shocked me but at the same time made me very happy. I will summarize what I saw. > It is a mirror. The dream, the experience of being a subject, is a mirror. I would think "hmm the weather is so like in germany today" and I would look and see a blonde guy with a sweater written "BAVARIA". I would be thinking about something and something which correlated with that would appear. This happened at a rave party. > Since then I have had this experience other times, it's also the same experience. It's simultaneous creation. It is gigantic and frightening and yet, there is a joy and a love there I cannot forget. I feel that my way is to achieve this experience permanently but I run away from it, because it would take all meaning and all illusion from me, all my concepts, my subtle projections in the world, would vanish, and I would remain as the "Projector". > I am not in the stage of the booze-drinker. I know I have long ago , lives ago, passed this stage. But what am I to do? I simply cannot put all my energy and effort for going AGAINST what my family, my society wants me to do, because I am a product of this. I was born in a family and a society which have no knowledge of Vedas or Advaita and does not know all this is true. I was born in a family which values health, wealth and a good spouse and that's what they want for me. And also, that's what I want for me. Why can't I be a lawyer and a spiritual seeker? Is it impossible for a lawyer to attain self-realization? > > Love and thank you for your kind frienship, > > Frederico > > > > > >- > bhuvan eswar chilukuri > > Friday, September 26, 2003 10:48 AM > Re: Re: [Let us practice now ] Apologies and Hologram > > > Most Respected Sir, > > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote : > > Hello Bhuvan, > > > > It took me a bit long to answer you because I have > >been somewhat busy with mundane affairs, especially University. > > You're talking about LOVING THE ONE WHO > >LOVES...LOVING THE SELF? > > Yes that is interesting. That is something I do not > >as much as I would like. I often find myself with low motivation > >because I have been through so many experiences and yet I know > >love can only pour through me if I first of all love myself > >passionately. > > The problem when I tried to find my Self was: > > 1- I thought: is my body the Self? No. My body is not > >my Self otherwise it would not be MY body. > > ***** Yes,sir. > > > 2- then I thought: are my feelings and thoughts my > >Self? No, they cannot be, since they pass before me like a cloud > >passes in the sky. > > ****** Yewss,sir. > > > 3- then I thought: is my consciousness my Self? And > >the answer was, YES, but my consciousness is not my MIND. my Mind > >is a product from my Consciousness. So I have found: > > Consciousness creates Mind creates Body creates > >Consciousness. OOPS,, > > Is this a vicious circle? I think yes it is. > > ***** Not at all ,sir,according to my own humble > experience!!! > > 1.Consciousness has Nature as ITS ENERGY (PRAKRUTHI). > > 2.When Consciousness reflects in Nature (in its Sattva > dominated state),that reflection is called Iswara -BHUVANESWARA > ,my name!!!!- > > 3.Iswara controls nature and stirs it ,as it were , to act . > > 4.Nature acts and then that act becomes creation.Differentiated > as this and that. > > 5.Iswara then reflects himself - like the sun reflecting in > waves - and appears as many.That secondary reflection is called a > jiva.It is bound by the differentited piece of nature as a wave > is.THe structure of the piece determines the nature of the > reflection.Sometimes ,it gets crooked as in a wave,sometimes > bright , sometimes dull,etc.That is it enjoys and suffers, loves > and hates,etc. > > 6.when you ask the question and leave the question aside and > hold on to the questioner,you are holding on to this blessed > secondary reflection ,or secondary awareness, called JIIIVVVAAA : > he who lives or experiences his karma phalam. > > 7. when you hold on to him tightly, as I said,you are not aware > of the body you hold.This is what happens when you hold > someonevery dear to you in distress.Your and the other body or > object or anything simply gets blockedfrom your sensation. > > 8.When you still intensely be,BE,BE,BE,that awareness,you will > retrace the secondary reflection to the source from which it > came.That source - I do not know - according to my Master is the > SOURCE OF ALL SOURCES > the beginning of all shows,boy!!! > > 9. It is not created by the body nor the mind but It is the > source for their creation by Nature.Mind is nature;body is > nature;sexual feelings are nature,too;sex is also nature too. > > 10. The drama changes the scenes and you begin to enjoy another > sweetness which as it becomes more and more considers the bodily > pleasures as cheap - something like a man discarding a roadside > hut to a palace of luxury. > > 11. your sexual appetite for woman is because you think it is a > plesure and so you are caught in the ignorance and then get lost > in it until one day you realise that it is a poison _- You will > one day realise that drinking is a poison ,only IF YOU CRITICALLY > EXAMINE THE SUFFERING.It is called vichara.YU MUST DO IT. > > ### THere is no other short cut ,BOY!!!### > > 12. AS you do this vichara,then you realise that it is a waste of > time.BUT YOU WILL NOT ABANDON THIS DESIRE FOR drink nor WOMAN. > > 13. All the characters who talk elonquently about advaita but who > have not experienced this bliss - small though - can never succeed > in the elimination of desire. > > 14. As your convition becomes stronger and stronger by rethinking > and rethinking about the uselessness of sexual desire.Then another > act unfolds. > > 15. You consciously try to avoid it.It is a struggle that depends > on your WILL POWER.Your WILL needs to be constantly reinforced to > destroy this enemy that kills you.You get it first by > satsangh,then pilgrimage,then scriptural reading,then meditation , > and so on. > > 16. your impressions begin to be erased and reorganised as in a > floppy.IF they are not erased permanently,you will continue to > behave in the same way ,however much you read,meditate,and do all > kinds of sadhana.But even a mountain will become rubble as you go > on breaking it.If You have the dynamite of conviction triggered by > will ,it will blast the vasana in no time.That is what happened to > Sri Ramana. He simply threw away everything and headed towards > Arunachala.Please ask Sri Harsha about his. He will be in a better > position to tell you. > > > Then at another meditation I found out: > > What I call "outside world" does not exist in fact > >(law of insubstantiality, anatman), and neither do I. > > This is all Shastra vasana which many in the advaitin list do!!! > If you have realised it as pure knowlegde and not as > information,then > you will neither drink nor have sex nor become a victim of > maya!!! > > This is what I humbly submit!!! > > Practice the vichara and abandon the bad company, > deliberately,forcefully, and at the same time take care that it > will not choke you.Slowly, the impure vasana changes to pure > vasana.It is all a game of vasana.Vasana is drudha bhavana 'strong > thought ' that impels you to action without an antececedent or a > precedent cause. > > Get back to the source, the questioner,every time you get the > desire. > change the topic first ,sing the song of the lord,do something in > the initial stages. later on you can confront it face to face.If > you are weak ,it will devour you.you may land ina hospital for > someother tragedy. > > > > The outside world appears as a very complex > >projection of the Self. It is a projection which has: > > 1- a past aspect, which is more basally experienced > >as the body and the background of the phenomena you witness (for > >example, a car passes before you on a street. The background > >would be the street, the village or town or city, etc.) This > >first aspect related to past is related to group consciousness, > >racial type consciousness and is the more animal type or layer of > >the experience. The past aspect is basically experienced as body > >and world -- there were past actions which supposedly generated > >your birth at a certain place that already existed when you were > >born. > > 2- there is a present aspect which is expressed as > >the individual perception of the phenomena, i.e., the individual > >is aware of his existence and his interactions with the external > >world, through his mind. This is basically the mind. > > 3- there is a future or simultaneous aspect which is > >related to the immediate projections of the Self in this world > >and body of the past. This happens through many things such as > >syncronicity. For example, last night I went to buy wax for my > >surfboard. I went to a small surfshop and I was thinking what > >brand I would buy. Since I have not surfed for 3 years, I did not > >remember any brand of surfing wax. I thought "I'll buy the most > >famous one" as I walked into the shop. When I looked at the place > >where the little bricks of wax were placed, the first brand my > >eyes fell on was.... "FAMOUS" SURFING WAX. This experience was so > >interesting, I began to laugh. I immediately I remembered > >Maharshi when he wrote about SIMULTANEOUS CREATION. > > **** > > Yugapat srushti and all those theories are beyond the state of a > boozer,boy!!! we only have the information but no knowledge of > them. > > Ajata vada is th other aspect. > > First, let us consolidate your position vis a vis the desire for > booze or for woman. > > Get married ,if you cannot control yourself.so you have already > taken the first step of avoiding wandering. > next love her,then you have already blocked your dissipation.If > you cannot love her,you get into the vicious circle!!! > > > > This also remembered me of Jan and Percy here talking about the > play of Maya. But to enter into this 3rd layer of experience is > somewhat frightening, your normal reasoning mechanisms have to be > transcended and this scares me a lot, I'm afraid of going insane > although for some reason I know that I have passed the point where > I could go insane on that. > > people talk about insanity and all that jazz music.It is > because,they have not cleared of their impure vasanas and then try > to do the jump.When I did not know horse-riding and I tried to > ride,I fell.bBut later on when I learnt it ,it is inexplicable > thrill. > > Every game has its rules and exercises. > > Please do not believe in all this crap talk.The fear is the fear > of attachment to the body.First purify yourself by > mananam,sravanam,nidhidhyasanam, and all that exercising. > > There is no way except this to hold your mind face to face and > blast it to so that it will listen to you and not you to it. > > > > > This lead me to the astonishing conclusion that the > >world is an illusion, an individual spiritual projection, and > >everyone has the ability to access this 3rd layer of experience > >and comprove this for him/herself. It's like a hologram, each > >little piece contains the whole as well as the whole contains > >each little piece. You can experience both sides of this, while > >the majority of people only experience the second possibility of > >experience, which is that of ignorance (the self is a product of > >the whole). Not only this is true, but also that the whole is a > >reflection of the self. > > Then ,why waste time! go ahead and be the SElf. > > Make the move now ,here,and win the game!!! > > May we all achieve Liberation and in our way, may > >Love and Peace pour through us all. > > > > Frederico > > > > - > > bhuvan eswar chilukuri > > > > Tuesday, September 23, 2003 2:30 PM > > Re: Apologies > > > > > > My dear soul of the soul of the soul, > > > > By the by , i AM A CHARACTER BORN IN INDIA AND BROUGHT UP IN > >INDIA > > AND WORKED IN NIGERIA!!!! > > > > Who is this I ??? > > > > I have not been reading the mail carefully!!! > > > > did you try my request made in my last letter!!! > > > > I am interested to know what you find. > > > > Let us share your experience of this type of love making: > > > > Loving the one who does the loving thing!!! > > > > Love always, > > > > bhuvaneswar > > > > > > > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 Frederico S. Gonzales wrote : > > > Hello Harsha, Jan and all, > > > > > > First, Jan (if this is your name; I am referring > >to > > >the person who writes with the email ecirada) I'm awfully > >sorry > > >if I sounded agressive in my exposition of what I consider to > >be > > >the sacred nature of the male-female love. Yes you can > >consider > > >this old-fashioned, but in my opinion even being very actual > >and > > >updated in terms of mentality a person can still have this > > >idealistic vision of mating. > > > When I quoted Buddha I never did that to compare > >you > > >or to suggest subtly that you were "a pig". I simply made a > > >rational statement that could be better put by me as: "each > >one > > >sees what he or she wants to see". > > > I do not understand how can one person consider > >love > > >between male and female to be darkness. Or perhaps let us > >call it > > >PASSION instead of LOVE. Love is a strong word and there is > >only > > >one love, which is divine, of which this lesser love of > >gender is > > >but a lower reflection, as I have said. > > > By exposing my opinions in this Satsang I am > >not > > >trying to force my views on anyone. Sometimes I am a little > > >beclouded and of course I go a little too far in statements > >and I > > >am somewhat fierce in exposing my points of view. > > > Now seriously, my sincere apologies Jan. > > > Since this is a friendly conversation forum, I > >would > > >like to ask Clownpercy one question. > > > Percy, why do you always refer to yourself in > >the > > >third person (you write "Percy read", "Percy needs time", > >etc.) > > >Is this because from your vantage point you are not Percy? > >If > > >this is the case, I would like to know more about your > > >experience. Also I would like to know where you are from, > >Percy, > > >and also Jan, Harsha and Bhuvan. As I have said I am from > > >Brazil. > > > > > > Cheers! > > > Frederico > > > > > > > > > > _ > > Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman. > > Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !! > > Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1 > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > /join > > > > > > > > > > > > "Love itself is the actual form of God." > > > > Sri Ramana > > > > In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > >Service. > > > > _ > Art meets Anesthesia; Shefali Weds Dr. Raman. > Rediff Matchmaker strikes another interesting match !! > Visit http://matchmaker.rediff.com?1 > > > Sponsor > > > > > > /join > > > > > > "Love itself is the actual form of God." > > Sri Ramana > > In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma > > Your use of is subject to the > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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