The Nature of Self-Realization-Semantics?

[Guest guest]

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Tony OClery

Sunday, September 05, 2004 5:25 PM

Re: The Nature of

Self-Realization-Semantics?

 

 

, "John Logan"

<johnrloganis> wrote:

> Grace is not karma.

> It is more like "when the conditions are right".

> There is no more destiny in this than there is in the seed

sprouting

> when the earth, the sun, the rain, the temperature and the

nutrients

> are in the right balance. Nothing the seed has done in its "past

> lives" contributes to its sprouting.

>

> Thank you.

>

Namaste,

 

We may be hung up on semantics and interpretation here.

 

First of all I don't believe that ultimately 'Grace' in any form

exists at all. For Grace is Sakti and therefore Saguna. There being

only Nirguna Brahman, even that/Saguana is illusion.

 

However having said that, the world is real whilst one is in it

according to Sankara. So let us posit the existence of Saguna and

the validity of Grace and Karma.

 

I believe it is a given that a certain amount of work or Sadhana is

necessary to purify the sheaths of their samskaras, and tendencies

etc. This is an act of effort and therefore is action and therefore

is karma, which means action in sankrit. Before one can even

practise Who am I? and Self Enquiry one has to have a certain amount

of mental maturity and purification.

 

If one had only to give up the idea of being a person by saying so,

the world would not be in illusion........It takes Sadhana not

intellectualisation.

 

Therefore again as there is not time and the dream actually all

happens at once there can only be predetermination and no freewill

in the life being lived. Therefore Moksha is predetermined also, as

is the Sadhana required to arrive at that state of no mind.

 

Of course we will awake to find nothing has happened at all, but in

the meantime of relativity, there is work/sadhana/karma and a

result/karma--------purified Buddhi and Moksha and not before. Grace

is the Ground of Saguna, and is always there constant but our impure

sheaths prevent its manifestation in this illusion.

 

The only action or interference of Sakti, besides Avatars, and that

is another debate, is that when the Buddhi is purified and all that

is left is the 'I' feeling the Saguna subsumes its own creation

the 'I' and Moksha is there as it always was.....So this is why I

say Grace and Karma are the same for they are both as

illusionary....................ONS...Tony.

 

If Gd ever needs a lawyer I'm sure he'll call on you Tony..you have such a

legal mind.. Sam

 

 

/join

 

 

 

"Love itself is the actual form of God."

 

Sri Ramana

 

In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma

 

 

/

 

b..

 

c..