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Is Vichara thinking about the Truth?---No.!!

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Effort is needed to get to the effortless state.

 

JJM

 

 

, "Al Larus" <erilarend>

wrote:

>

> Excuse me too, I have written these words before

> maybe I won't delete them this time

> This is not an argument,

> but inspired from the message.

>

> If even the core is kept

> it is a catch 22, a concept too.

>

> Safety is found in a perfect description.

> Although true, please tell me what does it turn into?

>

> After arriving once

> the way need not be described.

>

> Still in a busy world

> let me just say I am happy to admit needing to recognise .

>

> Awareness, if it is not 'there' : ),

> be aware.

>

>

>

> Alan

>

>

>

> Jason James Morgan [jasonjamesmorgan@d...]

> 18. desember 2004 20:39

>

> Re: Is Vichara thinking

about the

> Truth?---No.!!

>

>

>

> Hello,

>

> Excuse my two cents,

>

> Vichara is realizing the Truth, 24/7. You are the truth. The

Self

> is Truth, Satchidananda, pure awareness(Shiva). Therefore only

> thoughts need be destroyed by the constant question "Who am I?" or

> whatever phrase you need. Being the self involves nothing more

than

> stopping thoughts. Samadhi means absence of thoughts. Samadhi is

> the truth, the Self, Satchidananda. A jivanmukta abides is

unforced

> Samadhi, 24/7.

>

> Effort is needed to get to the effortless state. Vasanas(mental

> predispositions)are to be put down. Non-dualsim is beyond

concepts,

> therefore it is a matter of experence. Once experenced, effort is

> easy to re-experience by a little or no effort. Effort is kevala.

> Sahaja is non-effort. Just abiding as Shiva all the time is

Moksha.

>

> Namaste

>

> JJM

>

> , "saktidasa"

<saktidasa>

> wrote:

> >

> > This is a delicate issue, quite paradoxical to outward

intellect.

> And

> > it is depends essentially on the relationship between teacher

and

> > disciple. The following is from Nitya Tripta's book ('Notes on

> > Spiritual Discourses of Shri Atmananda', 8th March 1958, note

29):

> >

> >

> >

> > " Is 'vicara' thinking about the Truth? No. It is entirely

> different.

> > 'Vicara' is a relentless enquiry into the truth of the Self and

the

> > world, utilizing only higher reason and right discrimination.

It is

> > not thinking at all. You come to 'know' the meaning and the

goal of

> > vicara only on listening to the words of the Guru. But

subsequently,

> > you take to that very same knowing, over and over again. That

is no

> > thinking at all. This additional effort is necessary in order to

> > destroy samskaras. When the possessive identification with

samskaras

> > no longer occurs, you may be said to have transcended them. You

> cannot

> > think about anything you do not know. Therefore thinking about

the

> > Truth is not possible till you visualize it for the first time.

Then

> > you understand that Truth can never be made the object of

thought,

> > since it is in a different plane. Thus thinking about the Truth

is

> > never possible. The expression only means knowing, over and over

> > again, the Truth already known."

> >

> >

> >

> > There is knowing in deep sleep, but it is not a knowing of any

> object

> > that is separate from self. The experience of deep sleep is pure

> > knowing or pure light, unmixed with any object. The objects that

> > appeared in waking and in dreams are thus absorbed by deep sleep

> into

> > pure light, utterly unmixed with any darkness or obscurity. It's

> only

> > in the waking and dream states that darkness or obscurity gets

mixed

> > up with light, through the seeming presence of objects.

>

>

>

>

>

> /join

>

>

>

>

>

> "Love itself is the actual form of God."

>

> Sri Ramana

>

> In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma

>

>

> Sponsor

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