At Christmas Time, Part 1

[Guest guest]

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"OMShanti" <omshanti@q...> wrote:

 

>Namaste Bob,

 

 

))) Namaste, Mike!

 

>I've been meaning to tell you that I love the Avadhuta Gita. Thanks

for your wonderful transliteration. It and the Ashtavakra Samhita

are two of my all time favorites.

 

))) Glad to hear you enjoyed the work, and yes, the Astavakra is a

long-time favorite of mine too!

 

 

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"OMShanti" <omshanti@q...> wrote:

>I would trade lifetime after lifetime of "pure consciousness" if

instead I could be immersed in Brahman for even one second.

I wrote this; but fortunately, I don't have to choose between the

two. :-) If I had to choose however, I know what it would be.

 

))) Sounds like a fun night out at a gourmet restaurant :-)

"Well, well, well -- what wonderful menu choices tonight, my Dear!

That Pure Consciousness Appetizer certainly looks inviting, but I've

been hankering for the Brahman Souffle -- it's just been featured in

the latest Nirvikalpa Cuisine Magazine, and the Chef here really has

a way with it! Pure Rasa!"

 

>I never said that one is not indivisibly immersed in Brahman. I am

referring to a particular experience of it. Some call it Nirvikalpa

Samadhi, some call it other things. But since there is nothing but

Brahman, then it's hard not to be immersed in it.

 

))) Wouldn't you agree that one has to be able to stand apart from

something in order to "have the experience of it"? In other words,

differentiate oneself from it? If one were always already immersed in

it, however, how could one become the object of themselves?

 

Sri Ramana clarifies: "Samadhi is continuous inherence in the Self in

a waking state. Nidra or sleep is also inherence in the Self but in

an unconscious state. In SAHAJ SAMADHI the communion is continuous.

The immersion of the mind in the Self, but without its destruction,

is known as Kevala Nirvikalpa Samadhi. In this state one is not free

from vasanas and so one does not therefore attain mukti (liberation).

Only after the vasanas have been destroyed can one attain liberation."

 

Question: "When can one practice Sahaj Samadhi?"

 

Sri Ramana Maharshi: "Even from the beginning. Even

though one practises Kevala Nirvikalpa Samadhi for years

together, if one has not rooted out the vasanas one will not

attain liberation.

 

Question: "Is samadhi, the eighth stage of raja yoga, the

same as the samadhi you speak of?"

 

Sri Ramana Maharshi: "In yoga the term samadhi refers to

some kind of trance and there are various kinds of samadhi.

But the samadhi I speak of is different. It is SAHAJ SAMADHI.

>From here you have samadhan (steadiness) and you remain

calm and composed even while you are active. You realise that you are

moved by the deeper real Self within. You have no worries, no

anxieties, no cares, for you come to realise that there is nothing

belonging to you. You know that everything is done by something with

which you are in conscious union.

 

Question: "If this sahaj samadhi is the most desirable condition, is

there no need for nirvikalpa samadhi?"

 

Sri Ramana Maharshi: "The nirvikalpa samadhi of raja yoga may have

its use. But in Jnana yoga this sahaj sthiti (natural state) or sahaj

nishtha (abidance in the natural state) itself is the nirvikalpa

state. In this natural state, the mind is free from doubts. It has no

need to swing between alternatives of possibilities and

probabilities.It sees no vikalpas (differences) of any kind. It is

sure of the truth because it feels the presence of the real. Even

when it is active, it knows it is active in the reality, the Self,

the Supreme Being."

 

Question: "How can one function in the world in such a state?"

 

Sri Ramana Maharshi: "One who accustoms himself naturally to

meditation and enjoys the bliss of meditation will not lose his

samadhi state whatever external work he does, whatever thoughts may

come to him. That is Sahaja Nirvikalpa. Sahaj Nirvikalpa is Nasa

Manas (total destruction of the mind). Those who are in the laya

samadhi state (a trance like state in which the mind is temporarily

in abeyance) will have to bring the mind back under control from time

to time. If the mind is destroyed, as it is in sahaj samadhi, it will

never slide down from their high state.

 

Question:"Is samadhi a blissful or ecstatic state?"

 

Sri Ramana Maharshi: "In samadhi itself there is only perfect peace.

Ecstasy comes when the mind revives at the end of samadhi. In

devotion the ecstasy comes first. It is manifested by tears of joy,

hair standing on end, and vocal stumbling. When the ego finally dies

and the Sahaj is won, these symptoms and the ecstasies cease."

 

 

 

 

 

"When you don't require anything from the world and nothing from God,

when you don't desire anything, when you don't strive for anything,

don't expect anything, the divine will enter you, unasked and

unexpected. The wish for truth is the best of all wishes, but it's

still a wish. All wishes must be given up, that the truth can enter

your life."

 

~ Sri Nisargadatta

 

 

>I take a bit of exception to the preceding quote. Realization

occurs all kinds of ways and it happens to seekers and non-seekers.

But the fact of the matter is that it hardly happens at all. If one

could really discover the truth, one would find that the realized

ones are the rarest of the rare. So if one is able somehow to

realize, I wouldn't quibble about how it happened to them. I myself

practice nothing and seek nothing because I already have what I

want. If I didn't have what I want I would do whatever I please to

get it.

 

 

))) We can all probably agree that realization is very rare, and not

because folks haven't done "whatever they please to get it". In fact,

isn't it the very effort of these Satsang-goers to "get it" that you

comment unfavorably on below? It's fine to imagine that one has dined

to their own satisfaction, but why turn around then and poo-poo

others who still come to the table for nourishment? "Oh those silly

Satsang-goers, when are they ever going to git it!"

 

You write, "I have attended the satsangs of various satsang givers.

Some are of the lineage of Nisargadatta. They preach this philosophy

that you just quoted. It's an odd thing, because essentially the

philosophy is true, as far as it goes; but these satsang goers for

the most part aren't realizing anything. They go and pay their money

and ask their questions, some of them seem desperate. The satsang

giver tells them basically what you just quoted. Then the same

people keep coming back and coming back year after year and paying

money and paying money and it doesn't seem to me that most of them

ever get anywhere. Oh I know, I know, there's no where to get to,

right? Well that's where I disagree. And that's where the attendees

disagree. They think that there's somewhere to get to. And they

keep paying money to get it, even if it is nothing. And that's what

happens to most of them – nothing."

 

))) From the point of view of the nirvikalpa samadhi that you seem to

espouse, who do you imagine is going to be the recipient of this rare

boon of enlightenment?

Furthermore, do newly minted jnanis, flush with the satisfaction of

having finally "gotten it", then look down at the rest of the mere

mortals still striving for understanding and wag their fingers

disapprovingly?

Isn't it more like this:

 

"A jnani is not conscious of liberation or bondage. Bondage,

liberation, and orders of liberation are all for the ignorant, in

order that ignorance might be shaken off. There is only liberation,

and nothing else. Nor is there any difference between the jnani and

the ignorant (ajnani) in their conduct; the difference lies only in

their angles of vision."

 

~Sri Ramana,

Absolute Consciousness

 

 

 

LoveAlways