Guest guest Posted April 22, 2002 Report Share Posted April 22, 2002 i am very clear about this... the following should not be undetaken without a guru 1) kundalini yoga 2) hatha yoga - looking at t.v. and practicing asanas specially standing on head can have disastrous effects!!! such asanas should be practiced only under the expert guidance of a trained yoga teacher... (pl read miss prainbow's earlier post) 3)pranayama 4) tantrik sadhana (like shava sadhana and vira sadhana etc) 5) om meditation (nirguna ) so, all yogas which involve the 'awakening' of kundalini should not be practiced without the guidance of a guru... one can always chant saguna mantras, do japa meditation and other modes of worship without a guru... there used to be a time when even sree lalita sahasaranama or devi mahatmiyam could not be recited or chanted without initiation... but over time, things have changed ... and now people are chanting these without initiation... this is my humble opinion... WHile the guru may not be needed to start on the path of simple sadhana but one needs a guru if one wants to practice specific sadhana. my 2 cents... jai gurudeva!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 my two paise (have you noticed that almost all small change in many countries have names starting with "p"?) I agree whole heartedly with you Kochu --- adi_shakthi16 <adi_shakthi16 wrote: > i am very clear about this... > > the following should not be undetaken without a guru > > 1) kundalini yoga > > 2) hatha yoga - looking at t.v. and practicing > asanas specially > standing on head can have disastrous effects!!! such > asanas should be > practiced only under the expert guidance of a > trained yoga teacher... > (pl read miss prainbow's earlier post) > > 3)pranayama > > 4) tantrik sadhana (like shava sadhana and vira > sadhana etc) > > 5) om meditation (nirguna ) > > so, all yogas which involve the 'awakening' of > kundalini should not > be practiced without the guidance of a guru... > > one can always chant saguna mantras, do japa > meditation and other > modes of worship without a guru... > > there used to be a time when even sree lalita > sahasaranama or devi > mahatmiyam could not be recited or chanted without > initiation... but > over time, things have changed ... and now people > are chanting these > without initiation... > > this is my humble opinion... > > WHile the guru may not be needed to start on the > path of simple > sadhana but one needs a guru if one wants to > practice specific > sadhana. > > my 2 cents... > > jai gurudeva!!! > > > > Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 Not the yanks. They always want to be diffrent. They have even 'changed' English so they can appear different. ;-) - Seshadri. , sankara menon <kochu1tz> wrote: > my two paise (have you noticed that almost all small > change in many countries have names starting with > "p"?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 OM Adi Shakti You say, "all yogas which involve the 'awakening' of kundalini should not be practiced without the guidance of a guru." This is true, but then you add, "one can always chant saguna mantras, do japa meditation and other modes of worship without a guru." Japa meditation too will ultimately lead to Kundalini rising and should not be practiced without a Guru. The saving grace of Japa meditation is that saguna mantras have imbedded in them a lock that tends to prevent Kundalini from arising until the sadhaka has purifed himself enough. When purification is sufficient, that same Mantra will produce a key to open the lock and allow the aspirant to cross the threshold of Satchitananda. Many time, however, the aspirant is impatient and is able to circumvent the lock so that Kundalini is released prematurely. It is here that real danger is encountered. So many people are dabbling in these practices that the incidence of premature Kundalini release has shot up. So much so, that the western psychiatric profession has given it a designation in their DSM IV of Spiritual Emergence Syndrome. All the spiritual practices you describe will, if practiced with enough faith, devotion, and intensity, lead to Kundalini rising. There is no other way of knowing Brahman, no other way for complete spiritual evolution than through Kundalini rising through the Chakras. Raising Kundalini may not be the stated intent of a spiritual practice but it is the basis for all authentic spiritual practices. They would not be spiritual practices if they did not ultimately involve Kundalinil. Kundalini is the power and the Pranamaya Kosha is the structure for all spiritual endeavours. That is why an experienced, knowledgeable person guide/Guru/priest/teacher is necessary for spiritual development. OM Namah Sivaya Omprem , "adi_shakthi16" <adi_shakthi16> wrote: > i am very clear about this... > > the following should not be undetaken without a guru > > 1) kundalini yoga > > 2) hatha yoga - looking at t.v. and practicing asanas specially > standing on head can have disastrous effects!!! such asanas should be > practiced only under the expert guidance of a trained yoga teacher... > (pl read miss prainbow's earlier post) > > 3)pranayama > > 4) tantrik sadhana (like shava sadhana and vira sadhana etc) > > 5) om meditation (nirguna ) > > so, all yogas which involve the 'awakening' of kundalini should not > be practiced without the guidance of a guru... > > one can always chant saguna mantras, do japa meditation and other > modes of worship without a guru... > > there used to be a time when even sree lalita sahasaranama or devi > mahatmiyam could not be recited or chanted without initiation... but > over time, things have changed ... and now people are chanting these > without initiation... > > this is my humble opinion... > > WHile the guru may not be needed to start on the path of simple > sadhana but one needs a guru if one wants to practice specific > sadhana. > > my 2 cents... > > jai gurudeva!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 Dear ompremji, true ! very true! of course, if you recite "om namo bhagvate vasudevaya{" 24 hours a day standing on one leg with eyes closed and hands held in a prayeful position like BHAKTA DHRUVA , sooner or later LORD SHRIMAN NARAYANA is bound to appear and give you his cosmic vision.... i was just referring to those bhaktas who before rushing to work do a 10 minute aarthi to god/ess and say prayers and do mala meditation (108 times) and mantra meditation for 15 minutes or so.... i such instances, 'kundalini' awakenng takes for ever to manifest... so you are right in mentioning the key word 'intensity' but in the busy humdrum of modern day life, do we really devote that much time to spiritual practice or sadhana? how many of us are full time yogis? we are all full time bhogis and part time yogis? at least, those who are still in grihasta ashrama or students. but , kundalini awakening although not a goal by itself is definitely a by product of all spiritual sadhana ( as you rightly mentioned but depends on faith, devotion and intensity) there is a very famous incident in the life if swami vivekananda - it is said that swamiji was very eager to experience the 'awakening of kundalini' and would constantly bug shri ramakrishna regarding this - shri ramakrishna did not oblige swami vivekananda - rather, young naren had to wait a long time before shri ramakrishna actually helped him in this regard... (may be collin or some other devotee can throw light on this.... i am writing from memory) so, some of us are 20 minute yogis and believe me it will be another liftime before our kundalini reaches the sahasara chakra... i wonder if mine has even travelled from muladhara as yet? smiles have a great day!!! love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 Thanks Adi, for a very practical question! I think many if not most of our members live the lives of householders -- and in Shakta, if I'm not mistaken, that is the preferred approach. An embrace of Her world rather than an ascetic rejection of it. But the fact remains that many devotees (and I will quote you here) "before rushing to work, do a 10-minute aarthi to god/ess and say prayers and do mala meditation (108 times) and mantra meditation for 15 minutes or so ... in such instances, Kundalini's awakening takes forever to manifest!" OmPrem noted the importance of "intensity" in spritual practice -- but I will echo your question: What is the solution? Is a daily observance like the one described above enough? Is it "better than nothing," or is it incumbent upon us to strive for more? Should we simply relax and hope for more time in our next incarnation? Or are there practical steps we can take to "intesinfy" our practice in the context of the householder life? Hoping the combined wisdom of our membership will yield some important insights on this question, which is so vital to so many ... Aum Maatangyai Namahe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 This intensity can be of any kind. It can be a longing for knowledge, longing for love and affection and longing for duty. It does not require a meditation or an elaborate puja or a great emotion and bhakthi or tantra and other austerities. It can be as simple as being truthful and following ones duties in life. A person when he performs his duties in his life and follows the dharmic path consciously or without is equal to the greatest saint. He need not trust in lord not need to know its existance. The kundalini because of the sathvik life will raise on its own and in its own way befetting the character of the person. Even otherwise if someone spends 10 minutes everyday in a puja, thats better than 0 minutes and 24 hours of ignorance. That little bit will add to his karma and will eventually build into a force that will propell the person to strive higher. My opinion is no body is lost. Everyone is a children of the lord. If the person is unable to wake up on his/her own, the lord will wake the person up. Sometimes as rudely as for kanakadaasa and purandara daasa or as simply as for tyagaaraja. Worrying here, to be honest, is not at all required. There is a story from the Living with the Himalayan masters: Swami Rama once had to go to a graveyard to do penance. During his penance, his mind started objecting to the activity so much so that at one time before it was over, he decided to give up and go back. On his way to the station, he was passing through a prostitute's house and the music and the song from the house kind of said shame and shame to Swami Raama. This prompted him to go back and resume his penance. Having completed his penance in its due course he goes back to the prostituites to pay her respects. He explains the situation from which she helped him and also addressing her as mother. Listening to the saint, a great transformation comes over her. She says if she can be a mother to the monk, she can be a mother to everyone else, and giving up her house goes to Kaashi and lives o the river boat uttering nothing but ram ram. If u ask her if she had her sleep, she will say ram and if she wants to sing she will say ram till one day she announced that she is leaving the body at an appointed time and it should be given to the fist to eat. The awakening call will come. It does not matter the life one has been living or the deeds one has been performing. Valmiki is another good example. Trust lord. No one is lost. Only that a gnani and a yogi knows what is happening and quite conscious of everything and others may not. In the hands of mother, every one is quite safe. Even with respect to time. - Seshadri. - "devi_bhakta" <devi_bhakta > <> Tuesday, April 23, 2002 3:35 PM Re: to guru or not to guru? Thanks Adi, for a very practical question!I think many if not most of our members live the lives ofhouseholders -- and in Shakta, if I'm not mistaken, that is thepreferred approach. An embrace of Her world rather than an asceticrejection of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 I think I have started to write very lengthy and verbose texts. - Seshadri. - Seshadri Tuesday, April 23, 2002 3:55 PM Re: Re: to guru or not to guru? This intensity can be of any kind. It can be a longing for knowledge, longing for love and affection and longing for duty. It does not require a meditation or an elaborate puja or a great emotion and bhakthi or tantra and other austerities. It can be as simple as being truthful and following ones duties in life. A person when he performs his duties in his life and follows the dharmic path consciously or without is equal to the greatest saint. He need not trust in lord not need to know its existance. The kundalini because of the sathvik life will raise on its own and in its own way befetting the character of the person. Even otherwise if someone spends 10 minutes everyday in a puja, thats better than 0 minutes and 24 hours of ignorance. That little bit will add to his karma and will eventually build into a force that will propell the person to strive higher. My opinion is no body is lost. Everyone is a children of the lord. If the person is unable to wake up on his/her own, the lord will wake the person up. Sometimes as rudely as for kanakadaasa and purandara daasa or as simply as for tyagaaraja. Worrying here, to be honest, is not at all required. There is a story from the Living with the Himalayan masters: Swami Rama once had to go to a graveyard to do penance. During his penance, his mind started objecting to the activity so much so that at one time before it was over, he decided to give up and go back. On his way to the station, he was passing through a prostitute's house and the music and the song from the house kind of said shame and shame to Swami Raama. This prompted him to go back and resume his penance. Having completed his penance in its due course he goes back to the prostituites to pay her respects. He explains the situation from which she helped him and also addressing her as mother. Listening to the saint, a great transformation comes over her. She says if she can be a mother to the monk, she can be a mother to everyone else, and giving up her house goes to Kaashi and lives o the river boat uttering nothing but ram ram. If u ask her if she had her sleep, she will say ram and if she wants to sing she will say ram till one day she announced that she is leaving the body at an appointed time and it should be given to the fist to eat. The awakening call will come. It does not matter the life one has been living or the deeds one has been performing. Valmiki is another good example. Trust lord. No one is lost. Only that a gnani and a yogi knows what is happening and quite conscious of everything and others may not. In the hands of mother, every one is quite safe. Even with respect to time. - Seshadri. - "devi_bhakta" <devi_bhakta > <> Tuesday, April 23, 2002 3:35 PM Re: to guru or not to guru? Thanks Adi, for a very practical question!I think many if not most of our members live the lives ofhouseholders -- and in Shakta, if I'm not mistaken, that is thepreferred approach. An embrace of Her world rather than an asceticrejection of it.To from this group, send an email to:shakti_sadhnaaYour use of is subject to the Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2002 Report Share Posted April 23, 2002 hey desh, very interestting observations!!! in the bhaagwat gita, arjuna asks sri krshna a queston"if one has faith but is slack in efforts because of the mind straying from ego and is imperfect in his yoga, what end does he come to,o krishna?< here what arjuna is askng sri krishna basically is if we do not follow the path of sadhna and i according to prescibed injunctions, what is to become of such a seeker? basically, if *intensity* is less and faith and devotion are less than perfect ? sri krishna replies- "neither in this world or in the next can be ruin for him, parha.no well-doer , o loved one, meets with a sad end- here sri krishna is assuring all the devotees that he welcomes all sadhakas who seek him , however imperfect their sadhna may be - in other words, no efforts for realizing god is ever wasted-a sadhak who has faith will ultimately arrive at the truth if not in this birth but in subsequent births........ in the next life he acquires he state of perfection he had failed in the previous life and finally attains the goal- so, even for those who are impure or not perfect in thir yogic path due to vasanas , sri krishna offers a ray of hope - we all know the story of valmiki!!! when valmiki was repenting his sins that he committed as a highway robber , shri narada muni redirected his enegies towards the holy name of rama. in spiritual life, one ray of devotion is enough to take us towards the blazing sun of llumination though the journey may be longer- btw sesh . do not worry about the verbosity or length of your posts- it is the content (and the intent) that is important ! love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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