Guest guest Posted May 22, 2002 Report Share Posted May 22, 2002 Om Shanti The Secret of Misery: Expecting Returns If we examine our own lives, we find that the greatest cause of sorrow is this: we take up something, and put our whole energy on it– perhaps it is a failure and yet we cannot give it up. We know that it is hurting us, that any further clinging to it is simply bringing misery on us; still, we cannot tear ourselves away from it. The bee came to sip the honey, but its feet stuck to the honey-pot and it could not get away. Again and again, we are finding ourselves in that state. That is the whole secret of existence. Why are we here? We came here to sip the honey, and we find our hands and feet sticking to it. We are caught, though we came to catch. We came to enjoy; we are being enjoyed. We came to rule; we are being ruled. We came to work; we are being worked. All the time, we find that. And this comes into every detail of our life. We are being worked upon by other minds, and we are always struggling to work on other minds. We want to enjoy the pleasures of life; and they eat into our vitals. We want to get everything from nature, but we find in the long run that nature takes everything from us–depletes us, and casts us aside. Had it not been for this, life would have been all sunshine. Never mind! With all its failures and successes, with all its joys and sorrows, it can be one succession of sunshine, if only we are not caught. That is the one cause of misery: we are attached, we are being caught. Therefore says the Gita: Work constantly; work, but be not attached; be not caught. Reserve unto yourself the power of detaching yourself from everything, however beloved, however much the soul might yearn for it, however great the pangs of misery you feel if you were going to leave it; still, reserve the power of leaving it whenever you want. The weak have no place here, in this life or in any other life. Weakness leads to slavery. Weakness leads to all kinds of misery, physical and mental. Weakness is death. There are hundreds of thousands of microbes surrounding us, but they cannot harm us unless we become weak, until the body is ready and predisposed to receive them. There may be a million microbes of misery, floating about us. Never mind! They dare not approach us, they have no power to get a hold on us, until the mind is weakened. This is the great fact: strength is life, weakness is death.. Strength is felicity, life eternal, immortal; weakness is constant strain and misery: weakness is death. Attachment is the source of all our pleasures now. We are attached to our friends, to our relatives; we are attached to our intellectual and spiritual works; we are attached to external objects, so that we get pleasure from them. What, again, brings misery but this very attachment? We have to detach ourselves to earn joy. If only we had power to detach ourselves at will, there would not be any misery. That man alone will be able to get the best of nature, who, having the power of attaching himself to a thing with all his energy, has also the power to detach himself when he should do so. The difficulty is that there must be as much power of attachment as that of detachment. There are men who are never attracted by anything. They can never love, they are hard-hearted and apathetic; they escape most of the miseries of life. But the wall never feels misery, the wall never loves, is never hurt; but it is the wall, after all. Surely it is better to be attached and caught, than to be a wall. Therefore the man who never loves who is hard and stony, escaping most of the miseries of life, escapes also its joys. We do not want that. That is weakness, that is death. That soul has not been awakened that never feels weakness, never feels misery. That is a callous state. We do not want that. At the same time, we not only want this mighty power of love, this mighty power of attachment, the power of throwing our whole soul upon a single object, losing ourselves and letting ourselves be annihilated, as it were, for other souls–which is the power of the gods–but we want to be higher even than the gods. The perfect man can put his whole soul upon that one point of love, yet he is unattached. How comes this? There is another secret to learn. The beggar is never happy. The beggar only gets a dole with pity and scorn behind it, at least with the thought behind that the beggar is a low object. He never really enjoys what he gets. We are all beggars. Whatever we do, we want a return. We are all traders. We are traders in life, we are traders in virtue, we are traders in religion. And alas! we are also traders in love. If you come to trade, if it is a question of give-and-take, if it is a question of buy -and-sell, abide by the laws of buying and selling. There is a bad time and there is a good time; there is a rise and a fall in prices: always you expect the blow to come. It is like looking at the mirror. Your face is reflected: you make a grimace– there is one in the mirror; if you laugh, the mirror laughs. This is buying and selling, giving and taking. We get caught. How? Not by what we give, but by what we expect. We get misery in return for our love; not from the fact that we love, but from the fact that we want love in return. There is no misery where there is no want. Desire, want, is the father of all misery. Desires are bound by the laws of success and failure. Desires must bring misery. Om Shanti Contributed by adreamgodus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2002 Report Share Posted May 22, 2002 OM Nora This is one of the most confused `thought' processes that I have ever heard. It is linguistic legerdemain. First, it focuses on only one of the kleshas - atttachment. It says that which brings pleasure eventually brings displeasure and our main method of maintaining pleasure (as if this was a significant goal) is to know when to let go. It seems to imply that that the Bhagavad Gita says that one can enjoy the fruits of the world provided one can `reserve the power of leaving it [those fruits] whenever you want'. This is like a alcoholic or drug addict saying, `Perhaps I can just cut down a bit.' or `I can quit anytime I want' or `I only get high on the weekends'. These are all lies and snares of self-delusion. The post says, "If only we had power to detach ourselves at will, there would not be any misery." This is entirely wrong-headed. It should say, "There would not be any misery if only we had the power to be detached from the events of the world all the time." But the post makes the same mistake that all neophytes make and assumes that if one is detached from the world all the time, then one is hard-hearted and/or apathetic and can never love. Nothing could be further from the Truth. For one to be detached from the events of the world does not mean that one is unmindful of those events or unconcerned about them or does not love the events of the world. One is only able to be detached from the events of the world, if one is firmly rooted in Brahman. At that point, one is and projects Satchidananda into one's daily activities. The person is Love manifested. The person projects the Bliss of his/her Being and views the world with Pure Consciousness. To others, this Bliss and Pure Consciousness appears as Pure Love and Compassion. The post claims that we want `the mighty power of love. But it confuses that mighty power of love with `the mighty power of attachment' and claims that one must `want to be higher than the gods' and so have the `whole soul projected on that one point of love' and yet remain unattached. It wants to be completely engaged with the Divine and yet remain an individual. The post admits that it does not know how to do that when it says, `How comes this? There is another secret to learn.' There is no secret. The `secret' is to give up the idea that the soul is separate from `that one point of love'. This is an illusion based on faulty inferences from the faulty sensory data that claims to tell us that the universe is composed of separate objects. The soul is not separate from `point of love'. It is that `point of love'. The post is wrong. You cannot be what you are and yet detached from what you are. (Unless, of course, you are psychotic, sociopathic or schizophrenic. But, even here, it is only in the mind of the beholder and not a reality.) Recognition of the Samadhi state of consciousness (where all seen to be One, where there is no separation and where the `point of love' is omnipresent) as one's true state, and the identification of this state as one's true state results in the person at last being his/her true Self, Satchidananda. Here, one does not have to be concerned about how to put his/her `whole soul upon that one point of love, yet [be] unattached'. Seeing that one's soul is that point of love results in one being unattached, that is, unidentified with anything particular in the universe.It makes no sense to say that one is still attached to Satchidananda because one is always who they are. What else can they be? The problem of estrangement and yearning for love begins when we believe the evidence of the senses and start to identify with the things and events of the phenomental world. Through all of these misidentifications, our true identity remains. It is through Sadhana that we roll back our misidentifications until we at last become of our True Identity as Satchidanada. OM Namah Sivaya Omprem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2002 Report Share Posted May 22, 2002 OM omprem Phew !!!!!! I thought im the only one. I mean im not criticing Swami but I really dont understand what he is trying to say. Maybe its me. Ive read this several time and I still dont understand. This is a repost Omprem contributed by one of our ex members in the old club. I thought that if I repost this somebody will be able to make it simple for me or other members to understand. I just dont have the heart to erase old posts even though I dont understand them. Im trying to repost them bit by bit. Maybe Adi Ma will come to our rescue. Om ParaShaktiye Namaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2002 Report Share Posted May 22, 2002 OM Nora NO, it's not you. That repost just does not make sense on a linguistic, logical, or transcendental basis. As far as I'm concerned, there is no possibility of anyone coming to your rescue by making that repost simple and understandable because it rests on several misconceptions: 1. That one can be attached and non-attached to the same thing at the same time. 2. That pleasure in the phenomena of the world is a meaningful goal. 3. That sustaining pleasure in the phenomena of the world is a sustainable goal. 4.. "That man alone will be able to get the best of nature". This is the most egotistical of statements. 5. That to be detached toward the phenomena of the world is to be hard-hearted and/or apathetic and can never love. 6. That one is not already That which he/she seeks. 7 (a) That there is a phenomenal world of separate objects within which we conduct our lives 7(b) That we interact with other people who are also separate each from the other and from us. 8. That is it is okay and indeed desirable to attach oneself to a thing with all one's energy and that "If only we had power to detach ourselves at will, there would not be any misery." And that's just from 3 or 4 paragraphs. Jaya Maa/Om Namah Sivaya Omprem , "thegoddessisinme2002" <ashwini_puralasamy> wrote: > OM omprem > > Phew !!!!!! I thought im the only one. I mean im not criticing Swami > but I really dont understand what he is trying to say. Maybe its me. > Ive read this several time and I still dont understand. This is a > repost Omprem contributed by one of our ex members in the old club. I > thought that if I repost this somebody will be able to make it simple > for me or other members to understand. I just dont have the heart to > erase old posts even though I dont understand them. Im trying to > repost them bit by bit. Maybe Adi Ma will come to our rescue. > > Om ParaShaktiye Namaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2002 Report Share Posted May 22, 2002 namaskar ompremji and greetings nora, dear!!! For one thing , i myself was pretty 'miserable' this morning. It happens specially when my 'blood sugar' drops down!! today it was at a record low of 49! so, i immediately gulped down a galss of pure orange juice and decided not to go to work.... so, when i read dreamy's post in this frame of mind, i did like the post and the powerful message therein... the way i understood or wanted to understand the message was in the light of Bhagvat Gita's 'Karma-phala-thyaga' -THAT IS DO NOT BE ATTACHED TO THE FRUITS OF YOUR ACTION... THIS IS ONE WAY OF AVOIDING MISERY. also. misery comes from expectation of rewards for your actions.... but after i read ompremji ctitique, i read and re-read the post...much of what ompremji has written also makes sense ... because in the ulitimate analysis 'we are already THAT which we are seeking outside of ourselves' - the famous musk in the deer example!! ********************************************************************** Here is Swami vivekananda's original text in its entirety... Swami Vivekananda WORK AND ITS SECRETS LosAngles,California, January 4, 1900 One of the greatest lessons I have learnt in my life is to pay as much attention to the means of work as to its end. He was a great man from whom I learnt it , and his own life was a practical demonstration of this great principle. I have been always learning great lessons from that one principle,and it appears to me that all the secret of life is there; to pay as much attention to means as to the end. Our great defect in life is that we are so much drawn to the ideal , the goal is so much more enchanting so much more alluring, so much bigger in our mental horizon, that we lose sight of the details altogether. But whenever failure comes, if we analyse it critically, in ninety nine percent of cases we shall find that it was because we did not pay attention to the means. Proper attention to the finishing, strengthening of the means is what we need. With the means all right, the end must come. We forget that it is the cause that produces the effect; the effect cannot come by itself; and unless the causes are exact, proper, and powerful, the effect will not be produced. Once the ideal is chosen and the means determined, we may almost let go of the ideal, because we are sure it will be there, there is no more difficulty about the effect . The effect is bound to come. If we take care of the cause, the effect will take care of itself. The realization of the ideal is the effect. The means are the cause : attention to the means, therefore, is the great secret of life. We also read this in the Gita and learn that we have to work , constantly work with all our power ; to put our whole mind in the work. Whatever it be, that we are doing. At the same time, we must not be attached. That is to say, we must not be drawn away form the work by anything else; still, we must be able to quit the work whenever we like. If we examine our own lives, we find that the greatest cause of sorrow is this : we take up something, and put our whole energy on it - perhaps it is a failure and yet we cannot give it up. We know that is hurting us, that any further clinging to it is simply bringing misery on us; still, we cannot tear ourselves away from it. The Bee came to sip the honey, but its feet stuck to the honey pot and it could not get away. Again and again, we are finding ourselves in that state. That is the whole secret of existence. Why are we here? We came here to sip the honey, and we find our hands and feet sticking to it. We are caught, though we came to catch. We came to rule; we are being ruled. We came to work; we are being worked. All the time, we find that. And this comes into every detail of our life. We are being worked upon by other minds, and we are always struggling to work on other minds. We want to enjoy the pleasures of life; and they eat into our vitals. We want to get everything from nature, but we find in the long run that nature takes everything from us - depletes us , and casts us aside. Had it not been for this, life would have been all sunshine. Never mind! With all its failures and success. With all its joys and sorrows, it can be one succession of sunshine, if only we are not caught. That is the one cause of misery: we are attached, we are being caught. Therefore says Gita: Work constantly; work, but be not attached; be not caught. Reserve unto yourself the power of detaching yourself from everything, however beloved, however much the soul might yearn for it, however great the pangs of misery you fee if you were going to leave it; still, reserve the power of leaving it whenever you want. The weak have no place here, in this life or in any other life. Weakness leads to slavery. Weakness leads to all kinds of misery, physical and mental. Weakness is death. There are hundreds of thousands of microbes surrounding us, but they cannot harm us unless we become weak, until the body is ready and predisposed to receive the. There may be a million microbes of misery, floating about us. Never mind! They dare not approach us, they have no power to get a hold on us, until the mind is weakened. This is the great fact: strength is life, weakness is death. Attachment is the source of all our pleasures now. We are attached to our friends, to our relatives; we are attached to our intellectual and spiritual works; we are attached to external object, so that we get pleasure form them. What, again, brings misery but this very attachment? We have to detach ourselves to earn joy. If only we had the power to detach ourselves to earn joy. If only we had power to detach ourselves at will, there would not be any misery. That man alone will be able to get the best of nature, who having the power of attaching himself to a thing with all his energy, has also the power to detach himself when he should do so. The difficulty is that there must be power to attachment as that of detachment. There are men who are never attracted by anything. They can never love, they are hard hearted and apathetic; they escape most of the miseries But the wall never feels misery, and the wall never loves, is never hurt; but it is the wall, after all. Surely it is better to be attached and caught, than to be a wall. Therefore the man who never loves, who is hard and stony, escaping most of the miseries of life, escapes also its joys. We do not want that. That is weakness, that is death. That soul has not been awakened that never feels weakness, never feels misery. That is a callous state. We don't want that. At the same time, we not only want this mighty power of love, this mighty power of attachment, the power of throwing our whole soul upon a single object, loosing ourselves and letting ourselves be annihilated, as it were, for other souls which is the power of gods. The perfect man can put his whole soul upon that one point of love, yet he is unattached. How come this? There is another secret to learn. The beggar is never happy. The beggar only gets a dole with pity and scorn behind it, at least with the thought behind that the beggar is a low object. He never really enjoys what he gets. We are all beggars. Whatever we do we want a return. We are all traders. We are traders in life, we are traders in virtue, we are traders in religion. And alas! we are also traders in Love. If you come to trade, if it is a question of give and take, if it is a question of buy and sell, abide by the laws of buying and selling. There is a bad time and there is a good time; there is a rise and a fall in prices: always you expect the blow to come. It is like looking at the mirror. Your face is reflected: you make a grim face there is one in the mirror; if you laugh, the mirror laugh. This is buying and selling, giving and taking. We get caught. How? Not by what we give, but by what we expect. We get misery in return for our love; not form the fact that we love, but from the fact that we want love in rerun. There is no misery where there is no want. Desire, want, is the father of all misery. Desire are bound by the laws of success and failure. Desires must bring misery. The great secret of true success, of true happiness, is this: the man who asks for no return, the perfectly unselfish man, is the most successful. It seems to be a paradox. Do we not know that every man who is unselfish in life gets cheated, gets hurt? Apparently, Yes. "christ was unselfish, and yet he was crucified." True, but we know that his unselfishness is the reason, the cause of a great victory the crowning of millions upon millions of lives with the blessings of true success. Ask nothing; want nothing in return. Give what your have to give; it will come back to you but multiplied a thousand fold but the attention must not be on that. Yet have the power to give: give, and there it ends. Learn that the whole of life is giving. that nature will force you to give. So give willingly. Sooner of later your will have to give up. You come into life to accumulate. With clenched hands you want to take. But nature puts a hand on your throat and makes your hands open. Whether your will it on not, you have to give. The moment you say, "I will not". the blow comes; you are hurt. None is there but will be compelled, in the long run, to give everything. And the more one struggles against this law, the more miserable one feels. It is because we dare not give, because we are not resigned enough to accede to this grand demand of nature, that we are miserable. The forest is gone, but we get heat in return. The sun is taking up water from the ocean, to return it in showers. Your are a machine for taking and giving: you take, in order to give. Ask, therefore, nothing in return; but the more you give, the more will come to you. The quicker it will be filed up by the external air; and if you close all the doors and every aperture, that which is within will remain, but that which is outside will never come in, and that which is within will stagnate, degenerate, and become poisoned. As river is continually emptying itself into the ocean and is continually filing up again. Bar not the exit in to the ocean. The moment you do that , death seizes you. Be, therefore, not a beggar; be unattached. This is the most terrible task of life! You do not calculate the dangers on the path. Even by intellectually recognizing the difficulties, we really don't know them until we feel them. From a distance we may get a general view of a park; well, what of that? We feel and really know it when we are in it. Even if our every attempt is a failure and we bleed and torn asunder, yet, through all this, we have to preserve our heart we must assert our God head in the midst of all these difficulties. Nature wants us to react, to return blow for blow, cheating for cheating, lie for lie, to hit back with all our might. Then it requires a super divine power not to hit back, to keep control, to be unattached. Every day we renew our determination to be unattached. We cast our eyes back and look at the past object of our love and attachment, and feel how every one of them made us miserable. We went down into the depths of despondency because of our "love"! We found ourselves mere slaves in the hands of others, we were dragged down and down! And we make a fresh determination: "Henceforth, I will be master of myself; henceforth, I will have control over myself." But the time comes, and the same story once more! Again the soul is caught and cannot get out. The bird is in a net, struggling and fluttering; This is our life. I know the difficulties. Tremendous they are, and ninety percent of us become discourage and lose heart, and in our turn, often become pessimists and cease to believe in sincerity, love, and all that is grand and noble. So , we find men who in the freshness of their lives have been forgiving, kind, simple, and guileless, become in old age lying masks of men. Their minds are a mass of intricacy. There may be a good deal of external policy, possibly. They are not hot headed they do not speak, but it would be better for then to do so; their hearts are dead and, therefore, they do not speak, They do not curse, not become angry; but it would be better for them to be able to be angry; a thousand times better , to be able to curse. They cannot. There is death in the heart, for cold hands have seized upon it, and it can no more act, even act, even to utter a curse, even to use a harsh word. All this we have to avoid; therefore I say, we require super divine power. Super human power is not strong enough. Super divine strength is the only way, the one way out. By it alone we can pass through all these intricacies, through these showers of miseries, unscathed. We may be cut to pieces , torn asunder, yet our hearts must grow nobler an nobler all the time. It is very difficult , but we can overcome the difficulty by constant practice. We must learn that nothing can happen to us, unless we make ourselves susceptible to it. I have just said, no disease can come to me until the body is ready; it does not depend alone on the germs , but upon a certain predisposition which is already in the body. We get only that for which we are fitted. Let us give up our proud and understand this, that never is misery undeserved, There never has been a blow undeserved: there never has been evil for which I did not pave the way with my own hands. We ought to know that every blow you have received, came to you because you prepared yourselves for it. You did half, and the external world did the other half: that is how the blow came. That will sober us down. At the same time, from this very analysis will come a note of hope, and the note of hope is: " I have no control of external world, but that which is in me and nearer unto me, my own world, is in my control. If the two together are required to make a failure, if the two together are necessary to give me a blow, I will not contribute the one which is in my keeping; and how then can the blow come? If I get real control of myself, the blow will never come." We are all the time, form our childhood, trying to lay blame upon something outside ourselves. We are always standing up to set right other people, and not ourselves. If we are miserable, we say, "Oh, the world is a devil's world." We curse others and say, "What infatuated fools!" But why should we be in such a world, if we really are so good? If this is a devil's world, we must be devils also; why else should we be here? "Oh, the people of the world are so selfish!" True enough, but why should we be found in that company, if we be better? Just think of that. We only get what we deserve. It is a lie when we say, the world, is bad and we are good. It can never be so. It is terrible lie we tell ourselves. This is the first lesson to learn: be determined not to curse anything outside, not to lay the blame upon any one outside, but be a man, stand up. Lay the blame on yourself. You will find, that is always true. Get hold of yourself. If it not a shame that at one moment we talk so much of our manhood , of our being gods that we know everything, we can do everything, we are blameless. spotless, the most unselfish people in the world; and at the next moment a little stone huts us, a little anger makes "these gods" miserable! Should this be so if we are such gods? Is if true that the world is to blame? Could God , who is the purest and the noblest of should, be made miserable by any of our tricks? If you are of unselfish, You are like God. What world can hurt you? You would go through the seventh hell unscathed, untouched, But the very fact that you complain and want to lay the blame upon the external world shows that you feel the external world the very fact that you feel shows that you are not what you claim to be. You only make your offence greater by heaping misery upon misery, By imagining that the external world is hurting our , and crying out, "Oh , this devil's world! This man hurts me; that man hurts me!" and so forth. It is adding lies to misery. We are to take care of ourselves that much we can do and give up attending to others for a time. let us perfect the means; the end will take care of itself. For the world can be good and pure, only if our lives are good and pure. It is an effect, and we are the means. Therefore, let us purify ourselves. Let us make ourselves perfect. " ********************************************************************** now, ompremji here is the full text!!! do you still think swamiji is going off at a tangent? personally, i liked the last sentence very much . it says " let us purify ourselves. let us make ourslves perfect." is this not what hatha yoga or patanjali yoga teaches us? meditate and purify!!! i think our swamiji is talking about a lot of things here 1) vairagya-non-attachment- 2) viveka-discrimination 3) yama- contol 4)abhyasa=practice 5) niyama-discipline 6) theor of karma 7) renunciation... well ompremji, i was always an admirer of swamiji from my eenage years... swamiji was known for his oratorial skilss; in fact, his chicago address at the parliament of religions is the most quoted speech ! please read this whole text not just dreamy's abridged version of it and tell me, if it makes sense!!! with regards. love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2002 Report Share Posted May 25, 2002 OM Adi Shakti I'll ignore the in-your-face challenge at the end of your post and instead applaud the diligence with which you tracked down and posted the original speech. At the beginning and the end of this speech, Swami Vivekananda emphasizes the necessity of Sadhana - taking personal responsibility of our spiritual salvation, paying constant attention to our thoughts and actions, and employing various techniques to take us closer and closer to a deep appreciation of our true, divine nature - for any spiritual development to take place. In the last paragraph, he echoes my favourite motto of Swami Sivananda, "Reform yourself. Let the rest of the world reform itself." Swami Vivekananda tries to introduce the concepts of karma, karma yoga, viveka, vairagya, kleshas, sadhana, abhyasa to a largely Western audience by using Western metaphors and its scientific and cultural references. This approach is somewhat unsuccuessful in spots. From a literary criticism point of view, he does best when he speaks from the heart without attempting to pre-judge his audience and without using artificial connections with his audience; he is most unsuccessful when he tries to use these stragtegems on his audience to make his point. For example, he use the ends and means connunbrium (that undergraduates love to play with and that is the basis of much of the environmental debates occuring today) to make the point that we are already are that which we seek and that emphasizing an external source of divinity can obscure our internal divinity. But he starts to lose the point when he says `we can almost let go of the ideal'. What is required instead is that one never lets go of the ideal and always sees the end in the means. Then, he compounds this weakness by claiming the Gita says we should `constantly work with all our power; to put our whole mind in the work. Whatever it be, that we are doing. At the same time, we must not be attached. That is to say, we must not be drawn away from the work by anything else; still, we must be able to quit the work whenever we like.' This language is confusing in itself but all the more so as he just finished saying to focus on the means. What the Gita actually says is: ` But whosoever, controlling the senses by the mind, O Arjuna, engages himself in Karma Yoga with the organs of action, without attachment, he excels' (III.7) `Therefore, without attachment do thou always perform actions which should be done; for by performing actions without attachment man reaches the Suprem' (III. 19) `As the ignorant men act from attachment to action, O Bharata, so should the wise act without attachment, wishing the welfare of the world.' (III.25) A few paragraphs later, he does agree that the Gita is saying `work, but be not attached; be not caught.' But he immediately confuses the thought by saying, `Reserve unto yourself the power of detaching yourself from everything, however beloved'. One should always be detached in one's work. One should not only have the power of detachment but should be exercising that power all the time. Gurus and sages often seem to say one thing to one person and something opposite to another. Far from being inconsistent, they are telling the person what he/she is capable of absorbing at that time. Later, the Guru or sage will explain more to the person. It seems to me that one explanation for the weaker areas of this speech is that Swami Vivekananda made some assumptions about his Western audience and proceeded to give them what he thought they were capable of dealing with. Plus, he fell victim to a common human error. He believed in the validity of a way of expressing an idea (in this case, his formulation that we put our whole energy into something and cannot give it up even if it makes us miserable. But we must still be ready to detach ourselves from the task.). He like this concept so much that he could not give it up even though it was causing more confusion than it was removing. This idea of his that we do not want to give up that in which we have invested our time and energy but we must be ready to give it up to find joy is a recurring theme. But, to me, it is a theme that is confusing and unproductive considering an audience that isn't already familiar with where he is going with the idea. Far be it for me to disagree with Vivekananda's spiritual ideas. But I do think that in this case he made some mistakes in the way he choose to express them. And, ironically, the mistakes reflect exactly the point he was trying to make. There are other examples. One such centers around his ideas that artificial detachment leads to callousness, hard-heartedness and apathy. He belabours this point but does it even have to be mentioned? He makes it seem more powerful than it is. Another example is the astounding statement, `The weak have no place here, in this life or in any other life.' This is just plain rubbish and an example of him getting carried away with a train of thought. Another example is the statement, `The soul has not been awakened that never feels weakness, never feels misery.' The soul does not feel emotions but as a manifestation of Brahman is Satchitananda radiates Ananda. It is the other koshas that are susceptible to emotions. It is those emotions that obscure our realization of our soul. Swami Vivekananda knows this but to make a point, used the misleading statement above. There are some excellent uses of language and ideas: `We must learn that nothing can happen to us, unless we make ourselves susceptible to it.' `We find men who in the freshness of their lives have been forgiving, kind, simple, and guileless, become in old age lying masks of men. Their minds are a mask of intricacy.' Without doing an exhaustive critique of this speech, let me just say that he made some mistakes of emphasis and composition that are misleading and confusing. OM Namah Sivaya Omprem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2002 Report Share Posted May 25, 2002 thanks ompremji! you state that 'far be it for me to disagree with swami vivekananada's spiritual ideas." i will also echo this sentiment. ompremji, you will at least agree with me on one point... that it is our beloved swamiji who introduced 'vedanta' to the west and if it were not for him, 'vedanta' would not be a household word today. He did take the 'mist' (mystery) out of eastern mysticism by introducing the concept of karma yoga to a western audience... you are right though ! language is a very powerful tool - it can be an effective tool ; but sometimes it can cause confusion. i personally i prefer american english to indian version of british english!!! swamiji always thought in bengali and spoke in english! Smiles!! but, one thing we must grant to swami vivekananda ! he worshipped the living god in all men and women... says our beloved karma yogi swami vivekanandaji... "And may I be born again and again, and suffer thousands of miseries, so that I may worship the only God that exists, the only God I believe in, the sum total of all souls. And above all, my God the wicked, my God the miserable, my God the poor of all races, of all species, is the special object of my worship,It may be that I shall find it good to get outside my body -- to cast it off like a worn-out garment. But I shall not cease to work. I shall inspire man everywhere, until the world shall know that it is one with God." on this note, let me salute the divine in one and all!! love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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