Sita for Shaktas. Personal Thoughts

[Guest guest]

"Despite Sita's submissive, secondary status in the Ramayana, it

is

extremely important to note that She is one of the most beloved

deities among Hindu women -- perhaps because She most closely

reflects the everyday reality of their lives. She is demure yet

quietly powerful; outwardly sublissive but inwardly very strong. She

does not seek recognition or reward for this strength; She simply

possesses it and employs it to better the lives of those who rely

upon Her. Perhaps this is the greatest lesson of Shaktism."

 

In my opinion Sita is actually the opposite of Durga and Kali. Yes !

why would a woman try to identify themselves with Durga or Kali when

they know they will never have the power and aggression enjoyed by

these two goddess. Sita/Sati and Durga /Kali when you look at it, is

the representation of the two different dimension. The very basic

tenant in Shaktism : the auspicious and the inauspicious aspect of

the Mahadevi. Sita balance it all up.

 

"Rama is weak because he is not able to look past social

convention

and see justice. Even though he knows that his wife is innocent, he

is not able to stand up for Her. So in a way, Rama is blind. He is

more interested in keeping up social appearances than in doing what

is right in an absolute sense. Only the Mother, Bhuv, accepts Her

daugther unconditionally, with open arms."

 

"Earth embraces Sita, seats her on the throne, and then the

throne

and Sita sank back into the ground" Ramayana (7.97).

 

To me Sita represents truth and justice. If we look around us in our

everyday lives the same thing is happening. We have seen many times

the truth are being suppressed and justice mocked at.

 

"Even when Rama demanded angrily for Sita's return, the earth

remain

silent and closed. Rama lives out his life in sorrow. He does not

marry again and has a golden image of Sita made, which he uses in her

place at religious rituals requiring the presence of a wife"

 

We couldn't help but to feel sorry for Rama right?. Should we?

This

exactly tells us of what happen if we constantly try to deny truth

and justice, we live in a life full of sorrow and pretense. But again

as some may say these are the divine play. In the real sense Rama and

Sita are not separated. They are always together. But these are

stories played by the divine one to teach us something. This is what

I learn from Sita and Rama.

 

 

Om ParaShaktiye Namaha

[Guest guest]

Some Sanskrit scholars expressed an opinion that the final part of Ramayana,

whichyou quote - the story of Sita's trial - was a later non-authentic addition

to the epic.

[Guest guest]

Thank you mouse [uri]

 

I would be very grateful if you could give us more details or perhaps

the URLS to this scholarly discussion on this supposedly non-

authentic addition to the Ramayana Epic. Ive been following the

Indology forum and they have different version to it too.

 

Thank you once again.

 

Om ParaShaktiye Namaha

[Guest guest]

Check with Dr. Ram Karan Sharma. I don't have any URLs, sorry. It is

from personal conversations with this scholar.

 

-

Nora

Thursday, November 28, 2002 02:00

Re: Sita for Shaktas. Personal Thoughts

 

 

Thank you mouse [uri]

 

I would be very grateful if you could give us more details or perhaps

the URLS to this scholarly discussion on this supposedly non-

authentic addition to the Ramayana Epic. Ive been following the

Indology forum and they have different version to it too.

 

Thank you once again.

 

Om ParaShaktiye Namaha

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sponsor

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Greetings Mouse <uri@o...>

 

Thank you. I will check it out.

[Guest guest]

Hello Nora.

 

I agree that, looked at in a certain way, Sita/Sati and Durga/Kali are

opposites. But, is there not a level at which the opposites merge?

 

Sati denounces the blasphemy of Daksha, even though she is Daksha's

daughter. Sita defies and repulses Ravana, even though she is Ravana's

captive. Don't these incidents speak of women's power and anger --

qualities of Kali and of Durga?

 

Did you know that there are substantial Sanskrit writings -- the _Kalika

Purana_ and the _Adbhuta Ramayana_ -- in which Kali is identified with Sati

and with Sita?

 

Om Shantih

Colin

 

Nora wrote:

>In my opinion Sita is actually the opposite of Durga and Kali. Yes !

>why would a woman try to identify themselves with Durga or Kali when

>they know they will never have the power and aggression enjoyed by

>these two goddess. Sita/Sati and Durga /Kali when you look at it, is

>the representation of the two different dimension. The very basic

>tenant in Shaktism : the auspicious and the inauspicious aspect of

>the Mahadevi. Sita balance it all up.

 

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[Guest guest]

Goodness Gracious colin !!!!!!! you went silence for sometime and

then you reappear with such information. Thank you and welcome back.

 

But, is there not a level at which the opposites merge?

Nope in my opinion there is no level where these two dimensions meet.

If we know where it is, then we will not be here aren't we?

 

Sati denounces the blasphemy of Daksha, even though she is Daksha's

daughter. Sita defies and repulses Ravana, even though she is Ravana's

captive. Don't these incidents speak of women's power and anger --

qualities of Kali and of Durga?

 

Agreed, but the way they go about doing in differently didnt they? We

can be angry/powerful in a graceful manner. Like my examples of Sita,

She is "submissive" but she is also strong in her own way.

 

Did you know that there are substantial Sanskrit writings -- the

_Kalika Purana_ and the _Adbhuta Ramayana_ -- in which Kali is

identified with Sati and with Sita?

 

Nope. Perhaps if you would be kind enough to share it with us, I am

sure the other members will be most grateful to you. I know that Kali

too is being identified with Krishna and Goddess Usha too. Infact

Kali can be identified with many other Goddess. There is also a Kali

in each and every one of us, that is my understanding of Kali.

 

Om ParaShaktiye Namaha

[Guest guest]

"in which Kali is identified with Sati "

 

Well this I am aware of via the Mahavidyas. Kali is the first

MahaVidyas.

[Guest guest]

>Goodness Gracious colin !!!!!!! you went silence for sometime and

>then you reappear with such information. Thank you and welcome back.

 

Thanks for the welcome, Nora! I've been silent because I've been spending

more time studying texts and less time reading and responding to postings.

When the topic of Sita and Kali came up, I had to reappear, because for the

last few weeks I have been studying the Adbhuta Ramayana.

>Agreed, but the way they go about doing in differently didnt they? We

>can be angry/powerful in a graceful manner. Like my examples of Sita,

>She is "submissive" but she is also strong in her own way.

 

In the Kali-Shiva mythology, there is a scene where a male person -- Lord

Shiva himself -- expresses strength in what could be called a submissive

way. Kali dances with such energy that the ground at her feet shows signs

of breaking up. Shiva then throws himself underneath her feet in order to

protect the earth.

 

A lot of people have heard versions of this story, but not so many know its

Sanskrit source. It is the book I've just mentioned -- the Adbhuta

Ramayana.

>Did you know that there are substantial Sanskrit writings -- the

>_Kalika Purana_ and the _Adbhuta Ramayana_ -- in which Kali is

>identified with Sati and with Sita?

>Nope. Perhaps if you would be kind enough to share it with us, I am

>sure the other members will be most grateful to you.

 

I think I've already posted a fair bit about the Kalika Purana on this

list. Members who want to know more could satisfy their curiosity by

searching for the name Kalika Purana in the group's archives.

 

One point I haven't mentioned before... The Kalika Purana says that when

Sati heard about the Daksha yajna, she remembered the terrifying (ugra)

form in which she appeared long before to Brahma and to Daksha. This form

is named in the text as Yoga Nidra, Vishnu Maya and Kalika. She appeared to

them in this form before she began her incarnation as Daksha's daughter.

Back then, she warned Daksha that her incarnation would end the moment he

treated her with disrespect.

 

What to say about the Adbhuta Ramayana? It is a variant of the Rama story,

with obvious shakta and shaiva influence, believed to have been composed

around the fifteenth century.

 

The edition in front of me was published just last year, and includes

English and Hindi translations alongside the Sanskrit text. The name of the

translator/editor is Shantilal Nagar, and it was published in Delhi by the

BRPC (India) Ltd.

 

People with an interest in India's Goddess traditions ought to thank

Shantilal Nagar for making this book more accessible to the modern world,

although readers who know some Sanskrit may notice imperfections in the

translation.

 

The word "adbhuta" means "astonishing". What is astonishing about this

version of the story of Rama?

 

The first astonishing thing is that Rama, the greatest of heroes, meets a

demon who is too strong for him. He gets an arrow in the chest, and falls

as if dead.

 

The second astonishing thing is that after this happens, gentle Sita

becomes wrathful Kali. She kills the demon who shot Rama, makes a necklace

of his heads, and then begins the world-shattering dance I've already

mentioned. She is still referred to as Sita and Janaki (as well as Kali)

while she is doing all this.

 

At first sight, such behavior might seem utterly contrary to Sita's

character as the loving consort. But, it is actually _because_ she loves

her man so much that she discover the power of her anger when he appears to

die. When the gods politely ask her to stop destroying, she says:

 

tasminnevam sthite devaah kam icchami jagaddhitam

graasam ekam karisyaami jagad etac caraacaram

 

While he remains like this, gods, how can I desire the welfare of the world?

I will make a single meal of this moving and still world.

 

(The above is my own translation. Nagar's translation of this verse is

bowdlerized -- apparently he thinks the concept of a goddess devouring the

world will upset some readers!)

 

The gods finally pacify Sita by bringing Rama back to life. Rama learns

that Sita is Mahesvari, who is also Mahesvara; and that he himself is

Mahesvara also, for he and his Goddess are one.

 

What do you make of that, Nora?

 

 

 

Colin Robinson

(colinr)

_________________________

To find out about Ferment, the journal about Kali as Great Goddess, go to

www.yogamagik.com/ferment Up to date list of recent articles, photos of a

shrine in Sydney, what people say about Ferment, how to contact us...

_________________________