Non-Attachment

[Guest guest]

Non-attachment is not concerned with things but with thoughts.

 

Non-attachment is not related to the outside but to the within

 

Non-attachment is not to do with the world but with oneself

 

One day a beggar went to see a Sufi fakir and found him seated on velvet cushion

inside a beautiful tent with it's ropes tied to golden pegs in the ground.

 

Seeing all this the beggar cried: "What is all this! I have heard so much about

you and your spirituality and non-attachment but I am completely disillusioned

by all this ostentation around you."

 

The fakir laughed and immediately jumped up and said "Let's go" and walked off

with the beggar not even waiting to put on his sandals.

 

After a while the beggar was distressed.

 

"I left my begging bowl in your tent. What shall I do without it? Please wait

while I go back and fetch it."

 

The Sufi roared in laughter. My friend said he," the gold pegs of my tent were

stuck in the earth, not in my heart;

but your begging bowl is still chasing you."

 

 

To be in the world is not attachment.

The presence of the world in the mind is the attachment.

 

And when the world disappears from the mind-

 

this is non-attachment.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

"To be in the world is not attachment.The presence of the world in

the mind is the attachment. And when the world disappears from the

mind- this is non-attachment"

 

How can we make this world dissappear in our mind?

[Guest guest]

-

<ashwini_puralasamy

<>

Friday, February 21, 2003 09:10 PM

Re: Non-Attachment

 

> "To be in the world is not attachment.The presence of the world in

> the mind is the attachment. And when the world disappears from the

> mind- this is non-attachment"

>

> How can we make this world dissappear in our mind?

 

A valid question.

 

You cannot make the world disappear, for in the very making, it's the world

in your mind.

 

It might be a spiritually coloured world, as compared to another who is

working to make his or her material misery disappear through acquisition,

accumulations, but really there is no difference, between the two.

 

What can be done, is to notice, how the world appears in your mind.

 

It appears in your mind through the sense of personal doership.

 

The belief structure, based on the assumptions.......

 

-It is "me-Nora" which worships Shakti.

 

-It is "me-Nora" which thinks, acts, does, behaves, chooses, discriminates,

judges etc.

 

-It is "me-Nora" which achieves the successes or the failures

 

 

How does the sense of personal doership, enable the world to appear in the

mind?

 

The other side of the coin of personal doership, is the "pay off", the

expectation, the hope, the desire, which drives the sense of personal

doership.

You do something, whether spiritual or material, whether prtofound or

profane, .......to get something in return.

It's a bargain, with a hoped pay-of.

 

And every body justifies his or her "pay-of" ...........as "divinely

inspired". <LOL>

 

This "pay off", this hope, the deepest wish you wish to be fulfilled

(whatever that be, the highest spiritual ascension that you can possible

imagine as your goal, or couple of million dollars), .........is the world

in your mind.

 

When the sense of personal doership is exposed, .........when the "me" is

exposed for the inference it is, ...........the resultant consequence is the

dropping of "hope", ........or "wish list" ..........or the "need to

become,

X, Y, Z", ...........the "need to have X,Y,Z." (whether that be Moksha or

mazuma)

 

 

And then there is pure existing, pure functioning, pure beingness, WHILE

being in the midst of Life, .......while being in the bazaar.

 

For the fakir to be enjoying life in a tent fastened by golden pegs plugged

in the ground, .......not in his heart.

 

Thus in the very moment, the fakir can get up and leave the tent with golden

plugs, in the instance, with out a backward glance, but for the beggar, the

beggng bowl still "has" him.

 

To be in the world and all that being "in", entails, .............but not of

the world.

 

Have you noticed, in all religious ceremonies of the East, it is not the

rose-flower which is used as an offering to divinity, but the Lotus flower?

 

Ever wondered why?

 

The Lotus flower is a symbol.

 

It always exists, is always born in dirt, in mud.

And yet nothing of the surrounding mud stains it's beauty.

 

In the world but not of the world.

[Guest guest]

"You cannot make the world disappear, for in the very making,

it's

the world in your mind"

 

Yes! perhaps we cannot make this world in our mind disappear, but can

we detach ourselves from it. Its there : visible and yet distance.

 

"The other side of the coin of personal doership, is the "pay

off",

the

expectation, the hope, the desire, which drives the sense of personal

doership. You do something, whether spiritual or material, whether

profound or profane, .......to get something in return. It's a

bargain, with a hoped pay-of.This "pay off", this hope, the deepest

wish you wish to be fulfilled (whatever that be, the highest

spiritual ascension that you can possible imagine as your goal, or

couple of million dollars), .........is the world in your mind"

 

So when I say : I do this because I wanted to. Nobody force me and

neither do I asked anything in return. But if it does ( weather

spiritual or material ) I consider it a blessing. If nothing comes

from this "doing" I am okay with it. Would you call that a

bargain

too? Or an expected "pay-off" unconsciously? Can this sense

of

personal doership too enable the world to appear in this person's

mind? Would you consider it as being non-attachement?

 

"Have you noticed, in all religious ceremonies of the East, it is

not

the rose-flower which is used as an offering to divinity, but the

Lotus flower? Ever wondered why? The Lotus flower is a symbol.

 

It always exists, is always born in dirt, in mud.

And yet nothing of the surrounding mud stains it's beauty.

 

In the world but not of the world"

>From message 873 :

 

"The lotus grows out of the mud and murky waters and is actually

nurtured by these very elements. As the plant grows out of the water

and reaches brightness and air it blooms into a beautiful flower. It

is said that during their development, the plants filter and purify

the body of water in which they find themselves, making the water

transparent. According to tradition, the muddier the water was to

start with, the more beautiful the lotus flower is when it arrives.

This flower bears no resemblance to the environment in which it was

raised, nor has its environment stained it. One who has grown out of

greed and hatred must not let them be stained by that upbringing.

They must search for the light. When they find that light they will

bloom into a

beautiful and harmless creature, which is capable of perfect

understanding"

[Guest guest]

Hiya Nora,

 

 

-

<ashwini_puralasamy

<>

Monday, February 24, 2003 09:08 PM

Re: Non-Attachment

 

 

<SNIP>

 

> So when I say : I do this because I wanted to.

 

 

S:

 

Indeed.

Now, invite you to unravel this very "want" and see for yourself, what about

that "want" which has occurred in the moment through a psycho-somatic

apparatus labeled by society as "Nora", ..........how much of it,

..........is to do with Nora.

 

And not just spiritual wants, any wants.

 

If you are moved to, share something specific about " I do this because I

wanted to" and we can jointly unravel that ......."this".

 

On the List or off-list, which ever your preference.

 

-----

 

 

 

 

> Nobody force me

 

S:

 

We typically assume, that influencing factors are only an external person,

or an external authority.

 

Any thought (and a wanting is just a series of thoughts), .......any action

which results from a choice (choosing a choice is again a thought),

..............and the consequential reaction to that action which occurred,

...........today, even neurological science and behavioural experts,

..............have concluded what the mystics have been hinting for thousands

of years.

 

That there is no individual "self", thinking, deciding, choosing, acting.

 

Every thought, every decision, every choice considered/opted/discarded,

every resultant action from that decision,....... it is the "whole"

thinking, choosing, opting/discarding, acting.

Moment to moment to moment.

 

 

Today quantum mechanics states,..... what once again was echoed by the

mystics, ........that there is no linear cause-effect continuum.

That everything is a cause of everything and every effect is the effect of

everything.

 

Pull a blade of grass and the Universe shakes, sang a Taoist sage.

 

-----

 

 

> and neither do I asked anything in return. But if it does ( weather

spiritual or material ) I consider it a blessing. If nothing comes from

this "doing" I am okay with it. Would you call that a bargain too?

 

--

 

No.:-)

 

If you are saying that "Nora" lives in a gestalt of total acceptability,

.......where the moment, .........as is served by Life, ...........,

................is acceptable in it's totality, exactly as it is,

..............and this gestalt is so, .............moment to moment to

moment, ..............then all I send across is a bow followed by a hug.

 

Thus this gestalt would accept in totality, .......members of a List who do

not toe the line, ....or an Osama ben Laden, .......or any of the

"distressing" events that living usually brings in.

 

 

 

----

 

> Or an expected "pay-off" unconsciously? Can this sense of personal

doership too enable the world to appear in this >person's mind?

 

 

Who will, in the biological computer, the instrument of the functioning of

divinity, named "Nora", .....who will know the answer to that?

 

You have later on brought up an old message on the Lotus flower and what the

symbology connotes?

 

Is the instrument named "Nora", a Lotus flower, ...........who else is to

know this?

 

And remember, real knowing, needs no external validation.

 

Real knowing does not even tremble, even if 6 Billion voices scream that

you are bogus, you are a fake.

 

 

 

> Would you consider it as being non-attachement?

 

It's a simple thing to ascertain for yourself.

 

The total indifference to the presence OR the absence of the "doing"

(whatever that "doing" is ), ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,with an equal indifference as to

what the resultant consequences will be, for either the presence OR the

absence of the "doing" .........is.............

 

Remember the indifference to BOTH the presence or the absence.

 

A preference of either and you are attached.

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

> "Have you noticed, in all religious ceremonies of the East, it is

> not

> the rose-flower which is used as an offering to divinity, but the

> Lotus flower? Ever wondered why? The Lotus flower is a symbol.

>

> It always exists, is always born in dirt, in mud.

> And yet nothing of the surrounding mud stains it's beauty.

>

> In the world but not of the world"

>

> >From message 873 :

>

> "The lotus grows out of the mud and murky waters and is actually

> nurtured by these very elements. As the plant grows out of the water

> and reaches brightness and air it blooms into a beautiful flower. It

> is said that during their development, the plants filter and purify

> the body of water in which they find themselves, making the water

> transparent. According to tradition, the muddier the water was to

> start with, the more beautiful the lotus flower is when it arrives.

> This flower bears no resemblance to the environment in which it was

> raised, nor has its environment stained it. One who has grown out of

> greed and hatred must not let them be stained by that upbringing.

> They must search for the light. When they find that light they will

> bloom into a

> beautiful and harmless creature, which is capable of perfect

> understanding"

 

 

Yes.

 

 

 

Yaba daba goopeeee gooooo