Moksha and meat eating

[Guest guest]

Om Robert

 

Yes it is possible for someone to become fully Self-realized while

being a meat-eater. The native peoples living around the Arctic, for

example, do not have access to much fruit and vegetables and depend

on meat for their existence and yet do have a rich spiritual

tradition centering around Shamanism.

 

It is not the eating of meat per se that is the main problem. It is

the attitude with which the animal is killed and with which the meat

is consumed. Natives, for example, give thanks to the creator and to

the spirit of the animal that they kill when they take an animal life

to survive. We, on the other hand, go into a supermarket, and pick up

some meat nicely packaged on styrofoam and wrapped in cellophane,

take it home and cook it without a thought given to the horrific

conditions under which the animal was killed or to the devastating

ecological impact of the commercial meat industry.

 

But, there is a case for not eating meat in order to advance one's

spiritual development. Meat is tamasic. It requires a lot of energy

to digest it and the mind is weak and scattered as a result. The

digestive tract of carnivores is short while the digestive tract of

hervbivores is long, suggesting that even carnivores do not want to

hold meat in their systems for any longer than is necessary.

 

Next, there is the idea of ahimsa or non-violence referred to above.

One should not take the life of a conscious entity that has a soul

unless it is in the context of one's duty and there is no ego

involved in the action.

 

Another idea to consider is the ecological impact. Much more energy

and other resources are required to produce a pound of meat than is

required to produce a pound of grain or beans or fruit. One

slaughtered animal only feeds a few people for a few days whereas the

same amount of feed for the animal, if converted to grains for human

consumption, could feed many more people for a much longer period of

time. Plus with a vegetarian diet there is less clear cutting of

forest for grow space. Clearing land for pasturage plus the methane

from animal wastes contributes to increasing global warming.

 

Finally, the rapid-growth hormones sm antibiotics that are fed to the

animals in a modern meat industry are, in turn, ingested by the

people that eat the meat with the results that our immune systems are

compromised, we are less resistant to disease, and, as many studies

have shown, we act more violently on a day-to-day basis.

 

So, while it is possible under some conditions to attain Moksha while

eating meat, it is increasingly more difficult to do so given the

conditions under which many of us in industrialized countries have

the meat presented to us.

 

The choice is up to each individual.

 

OM Namah Sivaya

 

Omprem

 

 

, "drekiuk" <drekiuk> wrote:

> Can meat eating mlecchas attain Moksha by chanting the Holy Name or

> seed mantra of Ma Kali?

>

> Thank you in advance,

> Robert Reid.

[Guest guest]

Dear Respected Omprem:

 

You are absolutely correct when you say that meat eating has nothing

to do with realization "moxa".

 

Some of the learned members may already know but would like to quote

some references and let the members decide for themselves.

Unfortunately, consumption of meat always remains a sensetive subject

with vegeterian devotees.

 

Our Vedic sages really had no restriction meat eating.

 

na maa.nsa bhaxaNe doSho na maddye naca maithune .. mnusmuR^iti

5.56 ..

 

Meaning: Eating meat, drinking alcohol (drink that intoxicates), and

sex is not a dooShaa.

 

uxNo hi p~ncadasha saaka.m pacanti vi.nshtim .

utaahamadmi pIva idubhaa kuxI pR^iNanti me .. rg veda 10.86.14 ..

 

Meaning: Heare Indra himself says, thirtyfive bulls are cooked for

me I eat them become strong. This helps strengthen my biceps.

 

In the context of honoring son-in-law, a graduate, special dignitary

(guest) it is said :

 

"naamaa.nso madhuparko bhavati" (Ashvaalaayana gR^ihyasUtra 1.24.26)

 

Meaning: madhuparka is not considered to be complete without meat.

 

The story of Sage Vishvaamitra having eaten a dog leg is very well

known.

 

Buddha died of food poisoning after eating preparation pork (minced

meat known as kukurmutta) at this house of his disciple, chanDa.

 

However, this does not justify eating meat, but at the same token

eating meat has nothing to do with realization and moxa.

 

Regards,

 

Dr. Yadu

 

 

, "omprem" <omprem> wrote:

> Om Robert

>

> Yes it is possible for someone to become fully Self-realized while

> being a meat-eater. The native peoples living around the Arctic,

for

> example, do not have access to much fruit and vegetables and depend

> on meat for their existence and yet do have a rich spiritual

> tradition centering around Shamanism.

>

> It is not the eating of meat per se that is the main problem. It is

> the attitude with which the animal is killed and with which the

meat

> is consumed. Natives, for example, give thanks to the creator and

to

> the spirit of the animal that they kill when they take an animal

life

> to survive. We, on the other hand, go into a supermarket, and pick

up

> some meat nicely packaged on styrofoam and wrapped in cellophane,

> take it home and cook it without a thought given to the horrific

> conditions under which the animal was killed or to the devastating

> ecological impact of the commercial meat industry.

>

> But, there is a case for not eating meat in order to advance one's

> spiritual development. Meat is tamasic. It requires a lot of energy

> to digest it and the mind is weak and scattered as a result. The

> digestive tract of carnivores is short while the digestive tract of

> hervbivores is long, suggesting that even carnivores do not want to

> hold meat in their systems for any longer than is necessary.

>

> Next, there is the idea of ahimsa or non-violence referred to

above.

> One should not take the life of a conscious entity that has a soul

> unless it is in the context of one's duty and there is no ego

> involved in the action.

>

> Another idea to consider is the ecological impact. Much more energy

> and other resources are required to produce a pound of meat than is

> required to produce a pound of grain or beans or fruit. One

> slaughtered animal only feeds a few people for a few days whereas

the

> same amount of feed for the animal, if converted to grains for

human

> consumption, could feed many more people for a much longer period

of

> time. Plus with a vegetarian diet there is less clear cutting of

> forest for grow space. Clearing land for pasturage plus the methane

> from animal wastes contributes to increasing global warming.

>

> Finally, the rapid-growth hormones sm antibiotics that are fed to

the

> animals in a modern meat industry are, in turn, ingested by the

> people that eat the meat with the results that our immune systems

are

> compromised, we are less resistant to disease, and, as many studies

> have shown, we act more violently on a day-to-day basis.

>

> So, while it is possible under some conditions to attain Moksha

while

> eating meat, it is increasingly more difficult to do so given the

> conditions under which many of us in industrialized countries have

> the meat presented to us.

>

> The choice is up to each individual.

>

> OM Namah Sivaya

>

> Omprem

>

>

> , "drekiuk" <drekiuk>

wrote:

> > Can meat eating mlecchas attain Moksha by chanting the Holy Name

or

> > seed mantra of Ma Kali?

> >

> > Thank you in advance,

> > Robert Reid.

[Guest guest]

dear all,

 

i guess there is no thumb rule to it. Meat and alcohol

have properties which work on the aura and centres on

the spine. A siddha or a more realsied individual is

able to balance these changes while the non-realised

and seekers face its effects. Meat and alcohol have

Saurnine qualities and tend to dull the senses. It

then is a badhaka for a sadhaka. it is right to say

that the devas consumed meat and drank liquor. but

then they are devas. so too with the rishis. i do

recall reading some version of the Mahabharata where

Bhishma, on this deathbed, advises Yudhistira about

refraining from consuming liquor/meat and not tell

lies as the two things that an individual should not

do. my memory fails me on this. cany one jog my

memory. coming back, to the issue of meat and

liquor.... what is sauce for the geese is not for the

gander. lokha samastah sukhino bhavanthu

 

 

 

Exclusive Video Premiere - Britney Spears

http://launch./promos/britneyspears/

[Guest guest]

Namaste,

 

I refrain from eating beef and drinking alcohol, because I was

requested to by my brothers and sisters, at the mandir.

 

I have no problem with this, and accept that the cow is holy, as a

symbol of Mother Earth.

 

For anyone engaged in sensitive, subjective exercises in yoga, I

should think any drug - alcohol is a drug - could hinder their

spiritual progress, if not be dangerous to them. That is just my own

personal opinion; yes, the chakras are highly-tuned, psychic centres,

which drug abuse can only, ultimately, dull the receptivity of, I

should think.

 

Having said this, I do not abstain entirely from all meat

consumption - I live in a fairly cold part of the world, and intake

much in the way of protein, to maintain energy and body heat. In a

warmer climate, I could well see myself adopting an entirely

vegetarian diet: I adore traditional Indian, vegetarian cuisine!

 

There are those who would argue that to take drugs, alters

perception, whereby the drug user gains subjective insights, that

would not otherwise be attainable.

 

I on the other hand, believe in the power of the mind - I don't think

it needs drugs. If we are not ill, why do we need drugs, anyway? Are

they a short-cut to something else? In that case, maybe better take

the long way round, and enjoy the view!

 

Jai Om -

 

m6

 

, cool thurber

<coolthurber> wrote:

>

> dear all,

>

> i guess there is no thumb rule to it. Meat and alcohol

> have properties which work on the aura and centres on

> the spine. A siddha or a more realsied individual is

> able to balance these changes while the non-realised

> and seekers face its effects. Meat and alcohol have

> Saurnine qualities and tend to dull the senses. It

> then is a badhaka for a sadhaka. it is right to say

> that the devas consumed meat and drank liquor. but

> then they are devas. so too with the rishis. i do

> recall reading some version of the Mahabharata where

> Bhishma, on this deathbed, advises Yudhistira about

> refraining from consuming liquor/meat and not tell

> lies as the two things that an individual should not

> do. my memory fails me on this. cany one jog my

> memory. coming back, to the issue of meat and

> liquor.... what is sauce for the geese is not for the

> gander. lokha samastah sukhino bhavanthu

>

>

>

> Exclusive Video Premiere - Britney Spears

> http://launch./promos/britneyspears/

[Guest guest]

I am posting this on behalf of a coolthurber, because he

still cannot get access to the group.

 

cheers

 

dear all,

 

I guess there is no thumb rule to it. Meat and alcohol have

properties which work on the aura and centres on the spine. A siddha

or a more realsied individual is able to balance these changes while

the non-realised and seekers face its effects. Meat and alcohol have

Saurnine qualities and tend to dull the senses. It then is a badhaka

for a sadhaka. it is right to say that the devas consumed meat and

drank liquor. but then they are devas. so too with the rishis. i do

recall reading some version of the Mahabharata where Bhishma, on this

deathbed, advises Yudhistira about refraining from consuming

liquor/meat and not tell lies as the two things that an individual

should not do. my memory fails me on this. cany one jog my

memory. coming back, to the issue of meat and liquor.... what is

sauce for the geese is not for the gander. lokha samastah sukhino

bhavanthu