Guest guest Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 swastik108 BUT, I do recall reading somewhere that for some she is considered a daughter of Shiva. Question is how seriously should the idea of daughter be taken in that case, because I also noticed during Durga Puja Lakshmi and Saraswati are often referred to as daughters of Durga! I think all these concept of daughter , is another way of trying to bring some sense to divinity. How else can you try to explain to simple minded folk. You try to bring in all the philosophical theories, a simple minded people will never understand. So the most logical thing to do is to bring this family association – something its easier for them to relate to. But if you look within our own bodies, the microscopically, the concept of daughter make some sense. There are two types of cell division. The first one : Our body cell divide or reproduce themselves to maintain the wear and tear of our body. When the cell divides and maintain the same replica of the "parent single cell" they are call The Daughter. The Daughter Cell have the same hereditary material and genetic potential of the Single Parent Cell. So if Durga is the "Single Parent cell" and having the ability to multipy herself, make sense that Lakshmi and Saraswati is known as the Daughter. The Second cell division is the reproductive division. They do not call these Daughter because the cell are not identical. The cell, of what we call the Zygote contains a mixture of DNA from 2 parent and throught the repeated mitotic process, it develops into a new organism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 This is going away very far from what I want to know. My idea is: Ganesha and Skanda are the sons of Parvati/Shiva, do they have a daughter too?This cell thing... I am not interested in that. As far as Lakshmi and Sarasvati are concerned: In one way it makes sense to see them as the daughters of Shiva/Parvati. When Shiva and Parvati are Supreme and Vishnu and Brahma are their devotoees, one could sss it in a way that each of them received a daughter of The Supreme Couple as a wife due to the excelence of their devotion. It also makes sense from a Shakta standpoint: Not Brahma creates but his Shakti (=Sarasvati), not Vishnu preserves but his Shakti (=Lakshmi).So you could see Vishnu/Brahma merely as the devoted servants of their wives. On the other hand, what I read about Lashmi seems not in agreement with a deity of the Shiva/Parvati family.She always is portrayed as the exemplary high-cast wife, always submissive to Vishnu.But that's the Vaishnava viewpoint... If some has more information about Lashmi and Sarasvati from the Shakta/Shaiva point of view, please let me know. I am also interested to know about their Tantric forms and their worship in Bengal. Alexandra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 haaaaaaaaaaaaaaa That is not meant for you actually Ms Alexandra. That is a general information meant for everybody. I am happy that at least now you are really talking. Keep it up! Lets see what others have to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 11, 2004 Report Share Posted July 11, 2004 this geneological discussion is all wrong. The relationships and acts are all allegorical. It has nothing to do with human relationships. This is a case of going astray. These things have nothing to do with sadhana. alexandra_108 <alexandra_108 wrote: This is going away very far from what I want to know. My idea is: Ganesha and Skanda are the sons of Parvati/Shiva, do they have a daughter too?This cell thing... I am not interested in that. As far as Lakshmi and Sarasvati are concerned: In one way it makes sense to see them as the daughters of Shiva/Parvati. When Shiva and Parvati are Supreme and Vishnu and Brahma are their devotoees, one could sss it in a way that each of them received a daughter of The Supreme Couple as a wife due to the excelence of their devotion. It also makes sense from a Shakta standpoint: Not Brahma creates but his Shakti (==Sarasvati), not Vishnu preserves but his Shakti (==Lakshmi).So you could see Vishnu/Brahma merely as the devoted servants of their wives. On the other hand, what I read about Lashmi seems not in agreement with a deity of the Shiva/Parvati family.She always is portrayed as the exemplary high-cast wife, always submissive to Vishnu.But that's the Vaishnava viewpoint... If some has more information about Lashmi and Sarasvati from the Shakta/Shaiva point of view, please let me know. I am also interested to know about their Tantric forms and their worship in Bengal. Alexandra / Mail is new and improved - Check it out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 11, 2004 Report Share Posted July 11, 2004 Manasa Devi, the serpent goddess, is considered a daughter of Lord Shiva, especially in Bengal. When you consider that Deity is beyond form, and aspects like gender and age are applied to Deity to facilitate our limited human minds, is it surprizing that concepts like "son" or "daughter" in relation to the Divine are fluid and ever-changing? In the Shreemad Devi Bhagavatam, Durga (source of all Power or Shakti) is described as "mother" to Lakshmi and to Sarasvati. This means that the powers of Abundance and Knowledge are manifest within Durga, but can appear without Her. Similarly, Lakshmi yeilds the <amsha> or <avatara> of Radha (Power of Divine Bliss), and Sarasvati yeilds Savitri (Power of Mantric Speech). Via Radha, all women following the path of Bhakti become manifest, while via Savitri, all women following the Path of Jnana are empowered. As a general rule, Deities who are "children" or "avatars" of other Godforms are seen as partial manifestations of those Godforms. There are always exceptions, however. To Gaudiya Vaishnavas, for example, Krishna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead (even though he usually is portrayed as an <avatara> of Vishnu). To Ganapatyas, Ganesha is the First Person and source of Creation (even though he is usually portrayed as son of Shiva and Parvati). -- Len/ Kalipadma On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 15:52:55 -0000 "N. Madasamy" <ashwini_puralasamy writes: > swastik108 BUT, I do recall reading somewhere that for some > she is considered a daughter of Shiva. Question is how seriously > should the idea of daughter be taken in that case, because I also > noticed during Durga Puja Lakshmi and Saraswati are often referred > to > as daughters of Durga! > > I think all these concept of daughter , is another way of trying to > bring some sense to divinity. How else can you try to explain to > simple minded folk. You try to bring in all the philosophical > theories, a simple minded people will never understand. So the most > logical thing to do is to bring this family association – > something its easier for them to relate to. > > But if you look within our own bodies, the microscopically, the > concept of daughter make some sense. There are two types of cell > division. > > The first one : Our body cell divide or reproduce themselves to > maintain the wear and tear of our body. When the cell divides and > maintain the same replica of the "parent single cell" they > are call > The Daughter. The Daughter Cell have the same hereditary material > and > genetic potential of the Single Parent Cell. So if Durga is > the "Single Parent cell" and having the ability to multipy herself, > make sense that Lakshmi and Saraswati is known as the Daughter. > > The Second cell division is the reproductive division. They do not > call these Daughter because the cell are not identical. The cell, of > > what we call the Zygote contains a mixture of DNA from 2 parent and > throught the repeated mitotic process, it develops into a new > organism. > > > > > ------------------------ Sponsor > --------------------~--> > Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Companion Toolbar. > Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! > http://us.click./L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/XUWolB/TM > --~-> > > > > Links > > > > > > ______________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 11, 2004 Report Share Posted July 11, 2004 Your information is most helpful. Thank you very much. kalipadma wrote: Manasa Devi, the serpent goddess, is considered a daughter of Lord Shiva, especially in Bengal. When you consider that Deity is beyond form, and aspects like gender and age are applied to Deity to facilitate our limited human minds, is it surprizing that concepts like "son" or "daughter" in relation to the Divine are fluid and ever-changing? In the Shreemad Devi Bhagavatam, Durga (source of all Power or Shakti) is described as "mother" to Lakshmi and to Sarasvati. This means that the powers of Abundance and Knowledge are manifest within Durga, but can appear without Her. Similarly, Lakshmi yeilds the or of Radha (Power of Divine Bliss), and Sarasvati yeilds Savitri (Power of Mantric Speech). Via Radha, all women following the path of Bhakti become manifest, while via Savitri, all women following the Path of Jnana are empowered. As a general rule, Deities who are "children" or "avatars" of other Godforms are seen as partial manifestations of those Godforms. There are always exceptions, however. To Gaudiya Vaishnavas, for example, Krishna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead (even though he usually is portrayed as an of Vishnu). To Ganapatyas, Ganesha is the First Person and source of Creation (even though he is usually portrayed as son of Shiva and Parvati). -- Len/ Kalipadma On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 15:52:55 -0000 "N. Madasamy" writes: > swastik108 BUT, I do recall reading somewhere that for some > she is considered a daughter of Shiva. Question is how seriously > should the idea of daughter be taken in that case, because I also > noticed during Durga Puja Lakshmi and Saraswati are often referred > to > as daughters of Durga! > > I think all these concept of daughter , is another way of trying to > bring some sense to divinity. How else can you try to explain to > simple minded folk. You try to bring in all the philosophical > theories, a simple minded people will never understand. So the most > logical thing to do is to bring this family association – > something its easier for them to relate to. > > But if you look within our own bodies, the microscopically, the > concept of daughter make some sense. There are two types of cell > division. > > The first one : Our body cell divide or reproduce themselves to > maintain the wear and tear of our body. When the cell divides and > maintain the same replica of the "parent single cell" they > are call > The Daughter. The Daughter Cell have the same hereditary material > and > genetic potential of the Single Parent Cell. So if Durga is > the "Single Parent cell" and having the ability to multipy herself, > make sense that Lakshmi and Saraswati is known as the Daughter. > > The Second cell division is the reproductive division. They do not > call these Daughter because the cell are not identical. The cell, of > > what we call the Zygote contains a mixture of DNA from 2 parent and > throught the repeated mitotic process, it develops into a new > organism. > > > > > ------------------------ Sponsor > --------------------~--> > Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Companion Toolbar. > Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! > http://us.click./L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/XUWolB/TM > --~-> > > > > Links > > > > > > ______________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! New and Improved Mail - Send 10MB messages! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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