Digest Number 1511

September 25, 2005

Dear Ms. Mary Ann,

I liked ur thoughts, and will say from my side, u remain whatever u r "western

or christian or member of other religion" . but know the spritual mechanism

which is discovered in india comprising two basic things - yoga and kundalini.

Essentially there is only one god, i may address it with term "Shiva" u can use

any other name, fine !! therefore we all belong to only one universal religion,

becoz there is only one god there is only one religion, that's it, threfore

never feel isolated and pls. never let feel being isolated to any human being.

Also, As god never needs any sort of advertisement or campaign to spread it's

name, it's foolish to use mission or missionaries and converting religions. it's

all motivated politics normally those do who doesnt understand religion at all.

even ur life style is different, no problem, innocense of heart counts here,

inner purity and honest feelings does matter.

age,color, cast,religion,community and sex are things that stops u to realize ur

reality, just understand why me and u feel we are only male and female while we

are souls? souls wear body like clothes and it's no more a secret. let's behave

with this approach and most of the problems of the world are no more, no more

terrorism in the name of god at all as God can save itself, and who is enemy of

god? is there any ..... ?????

Pls. continue with ur sadhan and have ur own realization.

regards,

Lalit Mishra.

wrote:

There are 12 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"manoj_menon"

2. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"Mary Ann"

3. Please teach me Anganyasa and Karanyasa

"ammabantu"

4. Re: Please teach me Anganyasa and Karanyasa

"Adwaith Menon"

5. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"Mary Ann"

6. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"manoj_menon"

7. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"just4amusement"

8. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"just4amusement"

9. Re: Please teach me Anganyasa and Karanyasa

Len Rosenberg

10. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"Mary Ann"

11. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"mahahradanatha"

12. Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

"just4amusement"

______________________

Message: 1

Sat, 24 Sep 2005 16:46:59 -0000

"manoj_menon"

Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

, "Mary Ann"

wrote:

> This distinction matters to me because I am not a Hindu, and have no

> intention of becoming Hindu, if that is even possible for

> westerners.

I don't see why it is not possible. if there can be western buddhists

(Robert Thurman, Jack Cornfield etc), there can be western hindus too.

As extreme examples, look at the late Sivaya Subramuniya Swami and

Swami Satyananda Saraswati. There are many examples of

reasonably-committed householder westerners too.

> But I am a serious yoga student/practitioner (though I'm

> sure purists would argue against this, esp. since I haven't yet

> begun incorporating bija mantras into my practice

Ashtanga-yoga, that was earliest organized by Patanjali in written

form, does not *require* usage of bijas to make you a yoga practioner.

Although if you have a guru (and you usually must to practice it in

its entirety), and (S)he imparts it you as part of the practice, then

you must incorporate the bijas too.

Essentially, ashtanga-yoga is about breathing in-and-out into the goal

using the techniques of mediation at its higher stages (all learned

usually under the guidance of a qualified guru; to give you an idea on

the insistence of the guru for this practice, consider him as a coach

of a sports team like basketball or football and give him that much

(and possibly more) respect); anything else other than breathing and

meditation is an addition made by various gurus based on the shisya's

spiritual make-up.

Now, Hatha-yoga takes the 3rd limb of the ashtanga - asana - to its

extreme and has developed wonderful complicated exercises. Ashtanga

focusses on moderation; to focus on all the 8 limbs to go into the

goal. It is said that it is possible to achieve the goal using Hatha

alone, but the pitfalls (distractions) are many, and success is rare

but usually spectacular.

If you do not have a guru and are practising the 3rd anga (limb or

component) of the ashtanga, i.e. asana, as you are drawn to it, I do

not think you need to worry about non-usage of bijas to stop you from

being qualified as a serious yoga student.

______________________

Message: 2

Sat, 24 Sep 2005 17:25:40 -0000

"Mary Ann"

Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

Hi - I was kind of joking about the bija mantras in that someone had

posted recently that all serious students of hathayoga or yoga use

them, and I haven't. In fact, I was first introduced to them in

asana practice in a workshop called Shakti Sadhana here in the Los

Angeles area, but the teacher was truly a buffoon, and I hadn't

really thought of the practice again until recently.

I guess I'm also saying I don't want to have to become Hindu to

practice yoga. I think of it more the way Amma says about the

Divine - if you have a heart of love and compassion, you don't have

to pray to any God(dess); God is love and compassion. I am drawn to

the information available through yoga, and especially hathayoga.

This is not meant to disparage any religion or belief about what

yoga is. I prefer to let yoga, through hathayoga, teach me.

Otherwise, I feel a bit of pressure to conform to something that

doesn't really fit for me in terms of identifying with a religion.

I also haven't been practicing Ashtanga, the 8 limbs. I guess I have

been practicing only hathayoga, with most success from me coming

through the Viniyoga lineage.

What about you? Are you a hathayoga practitioner, or Ashtanga?

, "manoj_menon"

wrote:

> , "Mary Ann"

> wrote:

> > This distinction matters to me because I am not a Hindu, and

have no

> > intention of becoming Hindu, if that is even possible for

> > westerners.

>

> I don't see why it is not possible. if there can be western

buddhists

> (Robert Thurman, Jack Cornfield etc), there can be western hindus

too.

> As extreme examples, look at the late Sivaya Subramuniya Swami and

> Swami Satyananda Saraswati. There are many examples of

> reasonably-committed householder westerners too.

>

> > But I am a serious yoga student/practitioner (though I'm

> > sure purists would argue against this, esp. since I haven't yet

> > begun incorporating bija mantras into my practice

>

> Ashtanga-yoga, that was earliest organized by Patanjali in written

> form, does not *require* usage of bijas to make you a yoga

practioner.

> Although if you have a guru (and you usually must to practice it in

> its entirety), and (S)he imparts it you as part of the practice,

then

> you must incorporate the bijas too.

>

> Essentially, ashtanga-yoga is about breathing in-and-out into the

goal

> using the techniques of mediation at its higher stages (all learned

> usually under the guidance of a qualified guru; to give you an

idea on

> the insistence of the guru for this practice, consider him as a

coach

> of a sports team like basketball or football and give him that much

> (and possibly more) respect); anything else other than breathing

and

> meditation is an addition made by various gurus based on the

shisya's

> spiritual make-up.

>

> Now, Hatha-yoga takes the 3rd limb of the ashtanga - asana - to its

> extreme and has developed wonderful complicated exercises. Ashtanga

> focusses on moderation; to focus on all the 8 limbs to go into the

> goal. It is said that it is possible to achieve the goal using

Hatha

> alone, but the pitfalls (distractions) are many, and success is

rare

> but usually spectacular.

>

> If you do not have a guru and are practising the 3rd anga (limb or

> component) of the ashtanga, i.e. asana, as you are drawn to it, I

do

> not think you need to worry about non-usage of bijas to stop you

from

> being qualified as a serious yoga student.

______________________

Message: 3

Sat, 24 Sep 2005 18:08:59 -0000

"ammabantu"

Please teach me Anganyasa and Karanyasa

Can anyone help me to learn anganyasa, karanyasa and other forms of

nyasa. I find it in various pujas.

Thanks in advance.

______________________

Message: 4

Sat, 24 Sep 2005 18:37:35 -0000

"Adwaith Menon"

Re: Please teach me Anganyasa and Karanyasa

/message/15507

, "ammabantu"

wrote:

> Can anyone help me to learn anganyasa, karanyasa and other forms of

> nyasa. I find it in various pujas.

> Thanks in advance.

______________________

Message: 5

Sat, 24 Sep 2005 19:10:36 -0000

"Mary Ann"

Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

I wanted to correct something I was wrong about: I DO practice the 8

limbs of yoga. I said I didn't because there is a class

called "Ashtanga Yoga" at the studio where I practice, and I don't

take it. I have found it unhelpful. It is comprised of a series (or

more than one series) of asanas done under self-direction that

become more complex as you progress through the series. I have a lot

of structural issues to deal with, and the class wasn't helpful to

me.

Today I took Bija Bennett's book Emotional Yoga off my shelf and

read it during breakfast. She explains the terms that Suresh Deepak

had posted that I didn't know - this book has been sitting on the

shelf since my first skim-through. The author says:

"Based on the explorations of the Indian Vedic seers, or rishis,

yoga and Ayurveda both acknowledge a broader view of the human

process. Rather than see the body and mind as a set of biochemical

processes, they view it as a collection of layers ranging from

material, to subtle, to causal. Like the petals of a rose, all

layers unfold from within one another-from the outer physical layer

(annamaya), to the vital energy layer (pranamaya), to the mental and

emotional layer (manomaya), to the intelligence layer (vijnanamaya),

to the deepest dimension of consciousness (anandamaya)."

She describes her work in this book as follows:

"In Emotional Yoga, I have adapted the Yoga Sutra's traditional

eight limbs to represent both the qualities of awareness that are

potentially present in every emotional experience, and which we can

access, and the teachings and practices for emotional self-healing

and growth. Collectively, these qualities and practices lead us

through a natural cycle of self-transformation through which we can

align both the physical and emotional aspects of ourselves.

The qualities of the eight limbs are:

Allowance

Allegiance

Will and Power

Love

Harmony

Knowledge

Wisdom

Synergy

These eight qualities are based on ancient insight that there are

intelligent, energetic properties in nature that manifest as

physical reality, both within us and without. Like playing the

various tones of a musical scale, when we attune ourselves to a

deeper flow of energy and awareness, we create internal

transformation and change that are inherently harmonious with our

true natures.

The teachings and practices of the eight limbs are:

Intelligent Behaviors

Personal Attitudes

Bodily Exercise

Conscious Breathing

Sensory Awareness

Focusing Attention

Sustaining Attention

Increasing Wholeness."

>From the above, I recognize that I have been practicing the 8 limbs.

Here is a quote from Rumi in the book that is quite beautiful:

"Every forest branch moves differently in the breeze, but as they

sawy they connect at the roots."

Namaste, All

, "Mary Ann"

wrote:

> Hi - I was kind of joking about the bija mantras in that someone

had

> posted recently that all serious students of hathayoga or yoga use

> them, and I haven't. In fact, I was first introduced to them in

> asana practice in a workshop called Shakti Sadhana here in the Los

> Angeles area, but the teacher was truly a buffoon, and I hadn't

> really thought of the practice again until recently.

>

> I guess I'm also saying I don't want to have to become Hindu to

> practice yoga. I think of it more the way Amma says about the

> Divine - if you have a heart of love and compassion, you don't

have

> to pray to any God(dess); God is love and compassion. I am drawn

to

> the information available through yoga, and especially hathayoga.

> This is not meant to disparage any religion or belief about what

> yoga is. I prefer to let yoga, through hathayoga, teach me.

> Otherwise, I feel a bit of pressure to conform to something that

> doesn't really fit for me in terms of identifying with a religion.

>

> I also haven't been practicing Ashtanga, the 8 limbs. I guess I

have

> been practicing only hathayoga, with most success from me coming

> through the Viniyoga lineage.

>

> What about you? Are you a hathayoga practitioner, or Ashtanga?

>

> , "manoj_menon"

> wrote:

> > , "Mary Ann"

> > wrote:

> > > This distinction matters to me because I am not a Hindu, and

> have no

> > > intention of becoming Hindu, if that is even possible for

> > > westerners.

> >

> > I don't see why it is not possible. if there can be western

> buddhists

> > (Robert Thurman, Jack Cornfield etc), there can be western

hindus

> too.

> > As extreme examples, look at the late Sivaya Subramuniya Swami

and

> > Swami Satyananda Saraswati. There are many examples of

> > reasonably-committed householder westerners too.

> >

> > > But I am a serious yoga student/practitioner (though I'm

> > > sure purists would argue against this, esp. since I haven't

yet

> > > begun incorporating bija mantras into my practice

> >

> > Ashtanga-yoga, that was earliest organized by Patanjali in

written

> > form, does not *require* usage of bijas to make you a yoga

> practioner.

> > Although if you have a guru (and you usually must to practice it

in

> > its entirety), and (S)he imparts it you as part of the practice,

> then

> > you must incorporate the bijas too.

> >

> > Essentially, ashtanga-yoga is about breathing in-and-out into

the

> goal

> > using the techniques of mediation at its higher stages (all

learned

> > usually under the guidance of a qualified guru; to give you an

> idea on

> > the insistence of the guru for this practice, consider him as a

> coach

> > of a sports team like basketball or football and give him that

much

> > (and possibly more) respect); anything else other than breathing

> and

> > meditation is an addition made by various gurus based on the

> shisya's

> > spiritual make-up.

> >

> > Now, Hatha-yoga takes the 3rd limb of the ashtanga - asana - to

its

> > extreme and has developed wonderful complicated exercises.

Ashtanga

> > focusses on moderation; to focus on all the 8 limbs to go into

the

> > goal. It is said that it is possible to achieve the goal using

> Hatha

> > alone, but the pitfalls (distractions) are many, and success is

> rare

> > but usually spectacular.

> >

> > If you do not have a guru and are practising the 3rd anga (limb

or

> > component) of the ashtanga, i.e. asana, as you are drawn to it,

I

> do

> > not think you need to worry about non-usage of bijas to stop you

> from

> > being qualified as a serious yoga student.

______________________

Message: 6

Sat, 24 Sep 2005 23:17:16 -0000

"manoj_menon"

Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

, "Mary Ann"

wrote:

> I also haven't been practicing Ashtanga, the 8 limbs. I guess I have

> been practicing only hathayoga, with most success from me coming

> through the Viniyoga lineage.

>

> What about you? Are you a hathayoga practitioner, or Ashtanga?

I read your later post where you mentioned that you are practising the

asht-anga. good!

No, I am not a serious yoga practionioner, and definitely not the

hatha-yoga variety.

My early commitment to spirituality came via the relatively secular

modes of yoga practice because of a back ache. I practised it

diligently for 6 months or so, but I had to move away from the place

because of my job and could not find enough inspiration to sustain the

practice all by myself. A major reason was that while it fed my

spiritual hunger greatly, it did little to relieve the intense back

ache. I go to a chiropractor these days, and his skills in back-

twisting have relieved the back ache considerably. I find chiropractic

to be an amazing physical equivalent therapy of the Kundalini yoga

practice.

I started off with a few simple asanas which was supervised by

selfless volunteers, which culminated in a generally thoughtful

satsang by the yoga master (a kind avuncular man). He also made us

practise a few pranayams and shava-asana which was great, and left us

with the advice of being more and more aware of our breath, and

eventually when the practice was perfected, he said we must graduate

that pratice to the awareness of our entire life. He also said

basically this: "Keep your practices simple. Become more and more

aware of your breath, and these centering practices will one day the

give you clarity regarding the purpose of your life also." This was in

Mumbai more than 10 years ago, where I then lived.

But my spiritual readings took off from that time, and then Ammachi's

entry into my life gave a very different twist to my spiritual life.

There is a small but significant component of meditation in my life,

but much is spent in trying to be the witness of all that happens. I

am also grateful to Her for having giving me more than just a glimpse

of what it means to be "devotional". Her intense love and compassion

have, as if, blasted through the cold rock around my heart, and made

me more receptive to what Love truly is. and what to speak of the

bhajans! I see Krishna and Shiva in my mind's eye so clearly when

their bhajans are being sung.

anyway, to sum it all up, this is my analysis of my life: I have been

more lucky than i have been deserving. I pray to remain so!

Jai Ma!

______________________

Message: 7

Sun, 25 Sep 2005 00:01:55 -0000

"just4amusement"

Re: Modern 'Mahishasura Mardini' Sells For Record $1.54 Million

There is an excellent article in the current issue of Hinduism

Today entitled 'Confessions of a Western Hindu'. The author,

Swami Shankarananda who is a disciple a Swami Muktananda

agrees that there is such a thing as a western Hindu and adds.

"As Western Hindus, we are pioneers writing n a clean slate. We

are on the cutting edge of a cultural and spiritual evolutionary

process....A new chapter in the evolution of Hinduism has

arisen.

He also makes the point that western Hindus will not accept

being at the bottom of the caste system.

, "manoj_menon"

wrote:

> , "Mary Ann"

> wrote:

> > This distinction matters to me because I am not a Hindu, and

have no

> > intention of becoming Hindu, if that is even possible for

=== message truncated ===

for Good

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September 25, 2005

I second that motion LALITJI. Actually, for MARY ANN to say, "this dinstiction

matters to me because I have no intention on being a Hindu, if that's even

possible, etc", sounds quite SANCTIMONIOUS and CONDESCENDING especially on a

board for HINDUS or serious practitioners of SANATANA DHARMA/SHAKTI MARG. You

would expect that comment on a less serious, NON-SPIRITUAL forum such as a YOGA

HEALTH practitioners board.

Personally, I don't really think that she thought about how condescending that

actually sounded, and in fact, maybe didn't mean it that way. But nevertheless,

that was a definite, serious, unintentional display of the UGLY

AMERICAN/WESTERNER syndrome wherein other SUPPOSEDLY less civilized cultures are

debased or slighted, and at the same time sucked dry for what's deemed as

valuable (i.e.YOGA, AYURVEDA, etc.). I would venture to say that the indian

perception of this western attitude of condescension is definitely, among other

things, why the same SANCTIMONIOUS attitude is reflected back to them in the

attitude of some temple priests who do not want to let WESTERNERS into temples.

Nevertheless, for the sake of MA, and NAVARATRI, which is fast approaching,

can't we all get along? One of the cardinal rules of the SHAKTI MARG, amongst

other things is to watch ones VAK (SPEECH). Because the VAK INDRIYA power that

MATA gives her devotees is probably even more powerful than on other paths, some

of you have to learn to direct anger not in mean words and such. At worst, a

divine indifference at what someone says to you (MARYANN), should be displayed.

USE soft speech (which is the trade mark of MA) and direct energy in the right

way.

JANARDANA DASA

Lalit Mishra <litsol wrote: