For Mahahradanatha was Story of Lalita versus Bhandasura

[Guest guest]

Mahahradanatha,

 

All that you've written here is well-known commentary to be found in

various books on the subject of rasayana and manifesting siddhis. What

I specifically requested from you is the text in the original language

where it specifically says the metals "fade away".

 

For others who may be interested in more info on this subject, a very

good article by B. V. Subbarayappa entitled, _Transmutation: Ancient

Indian Concepts and Practices_ can be found here:

 

http://ignca.nic.in/ps_04014.htm

 

Felicia

 

 

 

 

, "mahahradanatha"

<mahahradanatha> wrote:

>

> > > In Alchemy lead or mercury or stone is not changed

> > > to gold the lead or mercury or stone only fades away

> > > leaving only the gold to remain.

> >

> > Please show me one book on physical alchemy by a *practical*

> alchemist

> > in which this is claimed. Not a book on speculative alchemy, mind

> you.

> > Derivative speculative/mystical texts written by students who

> merely

> > meditate on what they *believe* to be a metaphor contain errors

> which

> > are obvious to any metallurgist.

>

>

> Hi Felicia

> I am glad you enjoyed my Post and will try to clarify your doubts.

>

>

> A) I was not talking about physical metals,

> B) and not talking about western Alchemy,

>

> Western Alchemy, whether laboratory or mystical, though it is not

> alltogether outside the scope of my studies, is not an appropiate

> topic for discussion on this list since this is a List especially

> concerned with Hindu Shakta Worship.

>

> 1.) In the Indian Alchemy (called Rasayana) and also in Chinese Yoga

> Alchemy,(called Neidan) which both once originated from a group of

> Immortal Teachers, the alchemy takes places (primarly) inside the

> body, not in the laboratory (alone).

>

> 2. Most (western) scholars are of the Opinion that "mystic"alchemy is

> derivative of laboratory alchemy, ie. laboratory alchemy was

> formulated first (earlier in history) and only later internalised.

>

> In fact there never existed such a thing as alchemy that was solely

> laboratory neither in india nor in China.

>

> Physical alchemy is the Application of Inner Alchemy using physical

> objects, the Yoga Process was the mould physical alchemy the cake.

>

> The Navnaths used many symbolic patterns to express their basic ideas

> one symbol set was those of alchemy.

>

> You wrote:

>

> >Not a book on speculative alchemy, mind you.

> >Derivative speculative/mystical texts written by students who merely

> >meditate on what they *believe* to be a metaphor contain errors which

> >are obvious to any metallurgist.

>

> you must allow me to use my own Sources if you want my answer, it

> makes no sense to ask a question and restrict the use of sources to

> documents that demand your prior approval.

>

> Every Indian or chinese Alchemist following traditional methods

> preparing a compound medicine or elixier or any other laboratory work

> will use Astrological timings, Yantras and Mantras Meditations and

> Pujas and will follow a ritualistic pattern of arranging the furnaces

> and pots according to the Patterns prescribed. There is no such thing

> as laboratory Alchemy only it always involves inner work and is- most

> importantly- not sucessful without it. Errors in the inner work can

> reflect in a useless medicine even if all physical ingredients have

> been correctly compounded.

>

> Even in western alchemy there are many stories that narrate that,

> induced by the mere silent physical presence of an accomplished

> alchemical master experiments have been carried out succesfully, by

> less advanced alchemists, which before without his presence always

> failed.

>

> Outer Alchemy is only symbolic of the inner process , pots and

> furnaces are only the material applications of an Inner science,

> laboratory Alchemy is not necessary to achieve the aims of Rasayana

> the important part of alchemy is achieved using your own body, in

> fact in Asian Alchemy the laboratory outside is only symbolic of the

> much more complicated laboratory inside.

>

> That it is the other way around and inner alchemy is

> specualtive/derivative or a metaphor believed in/ having its origin

> in pre scientific superstitous laboratory chemistry is an (arrogant)

> assumption of western scholars only.

>

> The Viewpoint of the Alchemists themselves is that inner alchemy is

> way superior to laboratory work,and is to be prefered, actually all

> experiments to achieve moksha by application of outer pills have been

> abandoned long ago because the side effects could be severe and only

> few achieved their aim, whereas inner alchemy was far more sucessful.

>

> In the presence of the elixier iron fades and gold appears .. in the

> context of yoga alchemy it is an allegory to hint that the physical

> body does not change into an Immortal body by application of pills or

> insertion of real mercury compounds in the body-or hatha yoga to

> reach physical eternal life but that the material body step by step

> through sadhana dematerializes. There are many accounts of siddhas

> not only Natha Siddhas, even today whose body after death disappears.

>

> This is accompanied by the appeareance of colored lights, the

> process may take two weeks where the body is steadly shrinking some

> leave dwarf like bodys behind if they have only partly accomplished

> this Rasayana Siddhi, only the Nails and hair is always left behind-

> these body parts cannot be subjected to the alchemical process.

>

> Iron is the Jiva with his malas or kleshas Gold is Sahaja Samadhi:

> Spontaneous Appearance of the nature already inherent in yourself

> without effort. You do not add something to yourself, or to the iron,

> but by fading or purifying the malas or kleshas and conditionings the

> true self can appear: the apprpriate Vehicle for the "I am" is the

> Siddha Deha or Vajra Kaya the indestructible Light Body. To become

> like this is the highest Aim of the Rasayana of the Natha akhanda

> Guru Mandal.

> The Aim in Indian Alchemy and Shaiva or Shakta Religion and chinese

> Alchemy, as i understand it is to realise what you are, not to

> become someone altogether different.

>

> This idea is more prominent in the western religions, there you

> have to repent and be saved because you are a Sinner and a bad person

> this is originally was an alien concept to most of Asian

> philosophies and religions sadly these teachings infect Asia and

> spread naround the globe through the contact of western "values"

> which is sadly reflected also by some western especially american

> Scholars and their false assumptions about Asian Religions, this

> empahsis on sin and evil is inherently christian in attitude.

>

> Maybe later some more talk tired now.

>

> Mahahradanatha

>