over stretching?

[Guest guest]

Hi once again - I've got a question regarding the

above mentioned topic heading. If i'm REALLY sore,

should I continue to practice yoga everyday? every other

day? is it all right to stretch sore muscles?

[Guest guest]

yes, continue to do yoga, but back off. Really

sore muscles mean that you've done some light damage

to them. Allow them to rest and take a lighter

emphasis, be gentle until you heal. A pleasant soreness in

the bellies of some muscles is okay once in awhile,

but if you expereince it a lot you're doing to much.

Be patient and enjoy where you are

today.<br>Namaste,<br>Draupadi

[Guest guest]

While I definitely believe that you should always

be careful not to overdo yoga or any other physical

activity, I'm not so sure that muscle soreness is a bad

sign or a sign that you need to back off. I think most

Ashtanga teachers would suggest that ideally you would

practice daily. And I have often heard that you will be

sore at first and that the soreness will gradually

lessen, even as you continue to practice daily. Also, I

seem to come across the idea a lot in the world of

weight training that the cure for sore muscles is to

repeat the previous days workout. I've heard this in

yoga circles as well. There is a difference in muscle

soreness in the belly of the muscle and pain that results

from stress to the tendons at the ends of the muscle.

One thing that I think is important to keep in mind

when practicing is that stretches should be aimed at

the belly (the middle) of the muscle and not at the

ends (tendons, insertion points, joints) of the

muscles. You may find that you can make muscle soreness

disappear just by stretching into it. This soreness may be

more of an indication that you are just beginning the

process of stretching out chronically tense muscles

rather than that you are overdoing it.<br><br>Note that

I am not a yoga teacher, an advanced practitioner

or a doctor - these are just some opinions to

consider.

[Guest guest]

A little more on the subject:<br><br>I used to

always hear this idea that you MUST practice daily (or

often) and that if you don't, you may become stiffer

rather than more flexible. This always seemed to make no

sense to me. I figured any yoga is better than no yoga.

While I still pretty much think that any is better than

none, I think I have come to understand why it is best

to keep up regular practice. Of course the more the

better anyway, but I think I figured out why a little

stretching now and then MAY actually lead to more stiffness.

There is an automatic reaction in the body to

stretching, which is that the body stretches back. I think

this may mainly be a function of the fascia, which

permeates and surrounds all muscles. So when you stretch,

the fascia reacts by stretching back and maybe

becoming even a bit denser and thus possibly reinforcing

the previous state of tension. By continuously

performing the same stretches (like daily), the tissues may

be taught to stay where they are being stretched

rather than being allowed to contract back to where they

were. There is a lot of science on this and while I

have read a lot on it, I can't say I have really come

to totally understand it. But there does seem to be

scientific reasons why it is best to practice on a daily

basis. Also I think a day of rest a week may be good. I

think there may be some disagreement in the Ashtanga

community on this, some saying not to practice on

Saturdays, moon days, etc, and some may say that everyday is

best.<br><br>Some resources for more indepth info on the physiology

of stretching:<br><br>Anatomy of Hatha Yoga - David

Coulter<br> (excellent new book with lots of detailed

info)<br>Job's Body - Deane Juhan<br> (classic text for

bodyworkers)<br>Beyond Stretching: Russian Flexibility <br>Breakthroughs

- Pavel Tsatsouline<br> (interesting ideas from

Pavel with a lot of science on

stretching)<br>Stretching Scientifically - Thomas Kurz<br> (have not read

much of it yet, lost of info)<br>The Endless Web:

Fascial Anatomy and Physical Reality - Louis Schultz and

Rosemary Feitis<br> (all about the fascia - very

interesting)<br><br>I'm not saying everyone should read this stuff, just

some books that may be of interest to some. You can

get really confused trying to figure this all out.

Sometimes the more you know, the less you know. I like the

adage from Pattabhi Jois - Ashtanga is 99 percent

practice and 1 percent theory.

[Guest guest]

Here is a quote from 15-Minute Yoga by Godfrey

Devereux (page 71):<br><br>Aches<br><br>Yoga is going to

make your muscles ache. Most of our muscles have not

been fully used, and have become too short. They ache

during yoga because they are being awakened. The muscles

are being lengthened back to their optimal length.

They are being asked to use their fibers in ways that

they are no longer used to. Once the muscle fibers

have reawoken this should stop. Then as you proceed to

lengthen the muscles further they will not necessarily

ache as you do so, provided you do so slowly but

surely, little by little, day by day. If you push past

your limits the muscle will ache and then tighten in

response. If you stop practicing, when you start again you

will probably again have to do through a temporary

aching period. Over time this period gets shorter and

shorter.<br><br>A muscle that aches aches exactly in proportion

with your use of the muscle, As you go deeper into the

stretch the ache increases. If you lessen the stretch the

ache begins to fade. As soon as you change the posture

the ache stops. If it continues it is because you

ignored the signals, pushed past the limits and strained

the muscle. This is not necessary and just leads to

muscle tightening, which will produce more aching when

it is released.<br><br>The best way to deal with

muscles that ache the day after a practice is to practice

again. Not practicing because they hurt just prolongs

the reawakening process. Each time you start again

your muscles will ache, and you will never get to the

point where there is no more aching even though your

muscles are still being lengthened.<br><br>Sometimes we

may have such a strong mental resistance to muscles

aching that it feels like pain. We have to learn to

distinguish between the activity of the nerves and that of

the mind. Then we can know if what the nerves are

transmitting is really pain, or actually just

effort.<br><br>---------------<br><br>Godfrey also discusses pain as distinct

from aching

(soreness). Here are some words on pain from the same

book:<br><br>Pain, as opposed to aching or shock, is not necessary

in yoga. Whatever the reason, your response should

be the same. Do not sustain the actions that bring

pain. Pain is the body's warning sgnal that cells are

under strain to the point of harm. This is always the

case. Even if it only results in minor muscle tearing,

pain will bring with it a protective muscular

tightening that is the opposite of what you are looking for.

Just stop. Back off ad resume the posture with a

greater concern for sensitivity and awareness than for

movement - for quality rather than quantity.

[Guest guest]

I agree with a lot that you say, but I think the

heart of the whole matter is what type of soreness. A

pleasant soreness in some muscles is fine once in a while

after any workout. If you're sore to the point of real

pain, or have difficulty moving through your normal

day, it is a sign that you are not strong enough for

the routine you are doing. Having very sore muscles

proves it. Tired or hurt muscles are less flexible than

fresh and healthy ones.<br>Ashtanga taught in a

traditional manner introduces the student safely and

systematically into the series. Most classes as taught in the

west, everyone dives in likes it's a competition to get

through to the end of the first series. Some sort of

race. Yoga or any other training has to be systematic.

Gradually increase your routine.

[Guest guest]

Agreed. I think it is always good to get into

things gradually, especially a physical practice as

intense as Ashtanga yoga. Most people are in too much of

a hurry. Slow and steady is good.<br><br>Another

quote, for what its worth, this one from Stretching

Scientifically by Thomas Kurz:<br><br>Question: When one has a

couple of days off, due to muscle soreness or just rest

days, does it cause flexibility to decrease and set one

back in training schedule?<br><br>Answer: Flexibility

usually does not decrease much, and may even increase

because of the rest the muscles got. If you do isometric

stretches or any strength exercises even when you are sore

because you are so anxious not to lose your flexibility

temporarily, you may injure yourself and lose it permanently.

You can do relaxed stretches however, even if your

muscles are sore, as long as doing these stretches is not

painful.

[Guest guest]

Yes it is OK to strech sore muscles!. Continue

your practice, unless you hit a sharp PAIN (not to be

confused with soreness). Soreness is a sign that you are

streching, and an invitation to continue on, pain tells you

that you are injuring yourself and urge you to stop

and reconsider what you are doing. <br>From my

experience of studying and teaching on retreats, the

soreness goes worse for the first three days, then

gradually lessens as the muscles adjust to their new

workload. Within a week of daily practice, it's gone unless

you keep adding new postures, and in other words,

streching more. <br><br>Regards,<br><br>Christophe

Mouze<br>Yoga Holidays<br>www.yogaholidays.net<br><br>Happy

practice