Guest guest Posted August 4, 2000 Report Share Posted August 4, 2000 namaste, Tantra has been desrcibed as a part of shruthi and its efficacy cannot be doubted at all. however the fact remains that vedic rituals are easier. The bhagavatha puraanam, says that Shruthir dwividou prokthaha taantriki vaidiki chaethi.... Tantra is defined as tam trayate ysmaath tantrethi prakeerthithaha. When people define shatrus as being external and internal i am in conformity with them, as the parashurama kalpla sutras say antarbahicha ari prayanthe vidwatjannaha antarari nirmoolayanthe etc..... namste gp - miinaaxii tanaya Ambaa-L Friday, August 04, 2000 3:16 AM prayoga In the context of mahAkALi vairi naashana kavacha, Ganesh remarked that it is a xudra prayoga. I have not read that text, in general, I am wary of tantric works. But in a general context, the prayoga can be kshudra or uttama depending on the devotee's attitude. Take mahAlaxmi ashhTakam for instance, below I quote the relevant verses from the Jaguar site. This is a text I had committed to memory long ago. But I never paid that much importance to phala shruti. But once in while I used wonder why, ekakAle paThennityaM mahApApavinAshanam.h . dvikAla.n yaH paThennitya.n dhanadhAnyasamanvitaH .. trikAlaM yaH paThennityaM mahAshatruvinAshanam.h . mahAlakshmiirbhavennityaM prasanna varadA shubhA .. after reading thrice all that happens is destruction of one's enemies (mahaa shatru vinaashanam). Is it not mean? Prof. Murthy wrote his insight on this few years back in Advaita-L. Which makes it wonderfully uttama. The enemies mentioned here are the kAma, krodha, lobha, moha, mada, and mAtsarya. The six deadly ones. One can say kAma is worst of all, as krodha is a reaction to unfulfilled kAma. They torment us even after we say kAmonakArshin namo namaH | kamonakarishit kamaH karoti nAham karomi kamaH karta naaham karta kaamaH kaarayita naaham kaarayita eshha te kaama kaamaaya svaaha || and so on. Here (in the ashhTakam) the devotee is praying to God to destroy the six deadly enemies who spring from the dark avidya and torments the devotees. With this reading of mahAshatru vinaashanam, whole things become supremely beautiful prayer (Thanks to Murthy_garu for his wonderful insight). I guess there must be some scope in the mahAkALi vairi nashana kavacha for a postive interpretation as well. However, till one develops enormous purity and knowledge, it is safe to stay away from tantra. That is my feeling. Ganesh, a very knowledgeable person like you should write more often to the list. We all will be benefited. ===== ambaaL daasan Ravi sharaNaagata raxakii nivEyani sadaa ninnu nammiti miinaaxii http://www.geocities.com/kaamaakshi Kick off your party with Invites. http://invites./ AUM shrImAtre namaH Archives : / : http://www.geocities.com/kaamaakshi/ : http://www.escribe.com/religion/ambaa/ Contact : miinalochanii & lotus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 4, 2000 Report Share Posted August 4, 2000 shrii lalitaaparameshvarii tiruvaDigale sharanam. namaste >The bhagavatha puraanam, says that > >Shruthir dwividou prokthaha >taantriki vaidiki chaethi.... Ganesh ji , i like to know whether this this statement is from the devi bhaagavatam or the vaishnava bhaagavatam. does any other purana has any statements like this , especially in the so called vaishnava puraanaas. >Tantra is defined as tam trayate ysmaath tantrethi prakeerthithaha. thank you very much for the defnition. shrii baalaaparameshvarii tiruvaDigale sharanam. with regards and namaste to all kumar. ______________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 4, 2000 Report Share Posted August 4, 2000 The Vaishnava Bhagavatham, says this. - kumar anand Friday, August 04, 2000 10:24 PM Re: TANTRA PRAYOGAS shrii lalitaaparameshvarii tiruvaDigale sharanam. namaste >The bhagavatha puraanam, says that > >Shruthir dwividou prokthaha >taantriki vaidiki chaethi.... Ganesh ji , i like to know whether this this statement is from the devi bhaagavatam or the vaishnava bhaagavatam. does any other purana has any statements like this , especially in the so called vaishnava puraanaas. >Tantra is defined as tam trayate ysmaath tantrethi prakeerthithaha. thank you very much for the defnition. shrii baalaaparameshvarii tiruvaDigale sharanam. with regards and namaste to all kumar. ______________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com AUM shrImAtre namaH Archives : / : http://www.geocities.com/kaamaakshi/ : http://www.escribe.com/religion/ambaa/ Contact : miinalochanii & lotus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 4, 2000 Report Share Posted August 4, 2000 - kumar anand Friday, August 04, 2000 10:24 PM Re: TANTRA PRAYOGAS shrii lalitaaparameshvarii tiruvaDigale sharanam. namaste >The bhagavatha puraanam, says that > >Shruthir dwividou prokthaha >taantriki vaidiki chaethi.... Ganesh ji , i like to know whether this this statement is from the devi bhaagavatam or the vaishnava bhaagavatam. does any other purana has any statements like this , especially in the so called vaishnava puraanaas. WELL, LOADS OF THESE KINDS CAN BE SEENIN PADMA, KURMA AND SKANDHA PURANAM. >Tantra is defined as tam trayate ysmaath tantrethi prakeerthithaha. thank you very much for the defnition. shrii baalaaparameshvarii tiruvaDigale sharanam. with regards and namaste to all kumar. ______________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com AUM shrImAtre namaH Archives : / : http://www.geocities.com/kaamaakshi/ : http://www.escribe.com/religion/ambaa/ Contact : miinalochanii & lotus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 5, 2000 Report Share Posted August 5, 2000 I am not going to debate whether it is Himsa or Ahimsa here, but I know they are there --- proyogas are very much possible. I see a historical point of view for these proyogas. In the earlier days where monarchies are in place, we used to be ruled by good kings and bad kings. Though the good kings are peace lovers, they used to get disturbed by the invasion of bad kings. They had to fight otherwise the peaceful citizens get disturbed by the war! So they identified a psychological warfare, which is tantra. Using which one can cause enormous pain to the people who are with bad intents. "yOsmAndvEshTi taMvO jaMbhE dadhAmi" (Sri rudra namakam) means: "I offer the people, who hate me, unto your mighty jaws (so that you can eat them!)." Prayogas are of two types Agneya vidyas, and maraka vidyas. Through agni you can initiate them and through other means also you can initiate them. But they are supposed to be used by only PurascaraNa siddha. (who has practiced enough). While I was writing my commentary book on Satarudriyam (published by chinmaya mission), I came across many books which talk about prayogabhaga (tantric application part) of Srirudra. The puscaraNa siddha is supposed to use them ONLY, strictly on only for peaceful purposes. If you feel that the society is genuinely threatened, then you have an obligatory responsibility to protect the society in which ever way is possible to you. Vishwamitra did this and many other great seers have done this. I have written a separate book which describes how to become purascaraNa siddha for each prayOga, but then I choose to withhold from publishing such a book, because I am afraid it may be used for wrong means... I drew my ideas mainly from Acharya Bhatta Bhaskara and Sayana. Also the following book is very important in terms of AgneyaprayOgas (through fire): Vidyarnava tantram Prachya Prakashan PostBox No: 203 Varanasi 53252 With the permission of our my teacher, we have conducted certain prayogas such as "varunasthambhana" (atharvanaveda) in order to stop the unnecessary rain, which is causing severe floods. At one point of time, one of our ashrams were targetted very much by the decoits, inmates were being beaten up very badly.. Because these attacks were repeatedly happening, my teacher (H.H. Swamini Saradapriyananda, who attained mahasamadhi on April 17th of this year) called me from Bombay (I was working in Bombay those days). She told me that some thing needs to be done and she wanted me to stop them so that people who are coming to the ashram will not get terrified. Then, with the help of other brahmacharis, (now Swamy Jnanananda) I have performed a tantra prayoga called "cOra Stambhana", the tantric part is conducted using the 3rd anuvaka mantras of SriRudram. The very same day --- One of the thiefs who stole the valuables from the inmates of the ashram, turned up at the ashram while I was offering the Purnahuti (finishing part of the yagna). He confessed the crime and voluntarily offered himself to the police, but he was pardoned by my teacher. A week after the yagna is performed, allt the other decoits who caused pain to the ashramites, related to another decoity, started surrendering to the police. The validation of the proyoga is done from those decoit's experiences. Some of them complained that they are getting nightmares, a very tall black man with blood stained mouth is trying to punish them, he is asking them to surrender to the authorities (I know him as Sri Mahakala Rudra). They can't eat and what ever they eat it gets thrown out. They vomit becuase of the rudras who go in to the stomach in the form of food and turn poisionous, "yO rudrou yEshAM annam ishavaH"... I bow to the rudras who use the food as the arrow in order to inflict enormous pain!. Some of those decoits were from the boarders of the state. They planned to attack the ashram, because it is in a remote area, they came in a car and beaten badly most of the brahmacharis. But they could not get much to their loot because there are no valuables in the ashram. By the way, all most 8 years passed by after performing the prayoga, there was never again such theft incidents took place in the ashram. I mentioned this incident to let you know that these things are still existing but can be used effectively, that too *only* for peaceful purposes. You know there is a prayoga --- if performed before commensing the construction of a new home, then that home will never face any fire accident!... Yours, Madhava Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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