Guest guest Posted March 2, 2001 Report Share Posted March 2, 2001 After hearing many warnings from members on the text, how to read it, and how it will destroy a devotee if he does something unguided, I thought I will share a post which I sent some time back to advaita-L. I am posting this not with an intention of saying what you mentioned is wrong. But to highlight a greater principle in worship which is more important. In brief, ambaaL sees the attitude behind the action, than the action itself. If it is love that propels the action, SHE will not mind anything. After all SHE is our mother, isn't SHE? This is a verse from shivAnandalaharI highlighting the life of great kaNNappa nAyanAr. Thank you. Ravi ----------- >From shivAnandalaharI maargaavartitapaadukaa pashupateraN^gasya kuurchaayate gaNDuushhaaMbunishhechanaM puraripordivyaabhishhekaayate | kiMchidbhakshitamaaMsasheshhakabalaM navyopahaaraayate bhaktiH kiM na karotyaho vanacharo bhaktaavataMsaayate || 63|| Near the kalahasti hill (in present day Andhra Pradesh, close to Tamil Nadu border), there lived a hunter tribe. Leader of the tribe was nAgan and his wife was tattai. For a long time they did not have a child and finally by the grace of Lord subrahmaNya they gave birth to a male child and he was called tiNNan (because he was strong and huge at the time of birth). With time and he grew and one fine day, his father nAgan bestowed the leadership to the tribe to tiNNan. As a celebration for that occassion, a big hunt was arranged. The whole forest reverberated with the sound of hunters and many animal were hunted. It so happened one wild boar, managed to escape and tiNNan took that as a challenge and started following it. Along with him two of his body guards also chased the boar. Finally, they managed to catch and kill it near the ponmugali river (far from their village). On the other side of the hill was a hill with a temple for Lord shiva. When tiNNan looked at the hill, something attracted him so strong, he left job of cooking the boar to one his assistant and started with the other to the hill. On the hill, in the temple, looking at the Lord, tiNNan became ecstatic and spell bound. He had no mood to leave the place. Overcome by emotion, he hugged the shiva-linga and stayed there. Looking at the flowers etc., he asked his assistant about it and he was told, that a priest comes here to worship in the day time. Filled with the desire to worship the lord, tiNNan went back to the river bank. But he was in such a divine mood, his assistant thought he is mad and left to the village to report to his father nAgan. Not even noticing it, tiNNan was busy preparing the food. He carefully cooked the wild boar and tasted the good pieces and collected it a leaf cup (tamil donnai) for the lord. Then gathered some flowers and carried them in head (as his hands were full with bow and cooked food). Finally took a big mouthful of water and walked back to the hill. There, maargaavartitapaadukaa pashupateraN^gasya kuurchaayate His worn leather slippers became the kUrcham (brush) for the lord of jIvas (pashupati) to remove the old flowers. gaNDuushhaaMbunishhechanaM puraripordivyaabhishhekaayate The water he carried in his mouth became the sacred water of purAri's abhishhekam. Then he adorned the Lord with the flowers in his head. kiMchidbhakshitamaaMsasheshhakabalaM navyopahaaraayate The well cooked and tasted flesh of the wild boar became the naivedyam for the lord. Then tiNNan stood guard all night to protect the Lord and next day morning left for getting food. The priest who came there was shocked looking at the left over meat, bones, etc. With tears, cleaned the place and performed the puuja and left. This cycle of tiNNan worshipping in the night and the priest in the day continued for four days. On the fourth day, overcome by grief, the priest pleaded intensely to the Lord for help. That night, Lord appeared in the dream and asked him to hide in the temple next night. The appointed hour came, and our tiNNan trekked back to the hill with food, flowers, and water. To his shock he saw that one of the eyes of shiva bleeding. Overcome by sorrow, he wailed, cried, and tried few herbal remedies. None worked. Finally he remembered his tribe's saying that flesh is healed by flesh (UniRku Un marundiDal vENDum). Out of boundless love, plucked his eyes with the arrow and pasted it on the lord's eye. What a wonder, the bleeding stopped. No words are adequate describe the joy of tiNNan. The priest was amazed at his act. As if it is not enough, the other eye of the lord started bleeding. Now tiNNan had no need for running around. He knew the medicine. To make sure of the eye's position, he kept his leather slipper near it (on the linga), and got ready to pluck his other eye. Lord not interested in testing his devotee any further, appeared and stopped him. Since he pasted (apputhal) his eyes (kaN), he was called kaNNappa. bhaktiH kiM na karotyaho vanacharo bhaktaavataMsaayate || 63|| When there is bhakti in heart, what is not possible. Thus the hunter became a celebrated devotee of the lord. God does not see our action, but the attitude behind the action. If there is no love behind the action, and even if one gives ganges water from Gold vessel, He will not care for it. Why should He, when karasthe hemaadrau girisha nikaTasthe dhanapatau gR^ihasthe svarbhuujaa.amarasurabhichintaamaNigaNe | shirasthe shiitaaMshau charaNayugalasthe.akhilashubhe kamarthaM daasye.ahaM bhavatu bhavadarthaM mama manaH || 27|| When given with love even gaNDuushhaaMbunishhechanaM puraripordivyaabhishhekaayate Such is the greatness of the Lord. AUM shivAyai namaH AUM shivAya namaH AUM shivapriyAyai namaH AUM shivaapriyAya namaH AUM jaganmAtre namaH AUM jagatekapitre namaH AUM namaH shivAyai cha namaH shivAya -- Ravi Get email at your own domain with Mail. http://personal.mail./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2001 Report Share Posted March 2, 2001 Shri Vidya Peetadhipathi Shri Vidya Gurave Namah. ----------------- In principle, we are trying to achieve a BhakthI that is Pure, and totally selfless in its Love for Ambaal. The Soundarya Lahari says "ThuriyA kApi Thvam!" - "Who is Greater than you O Mother". The Mother's Love for us is unconditional. Muthuswami Dikshithar in his wisdom, says "Shri KamalAmbyAH param nahi Re, Re Chitta" - "There is no entity greater than Shri Kamalamba". However, we must ask ourselves the following questions ... Are we not subject to the influence of the six enemies of human beings - Kaama, Krodha, Lobha, Moha, Mada and Matsaryam ? Are we bhakhthas of the calibre of kaNNappa nAyanAr ? Is our love for the Mother absolutely pure and undiluted, and is our motive always so pure ? If we are still under the influence of the six enemies mentioned above, do we not need the protection and guidance of our Revered Gurus, to be able to overcome these Shad Ripavah and then feel the unfettered love of our beloved, Shri MahAtripurasundari. Do we not pray, saying "mAtar me madhukaitbhagni, mahishaprANApahArodhya may ?Oh mother, destroyer of the demon Madhukaita, please liberate me from MahishAsura? " My opinion in this matter is that not only do we need the guidance of our Pujya Gurus to help overcome adversities, but also to prepare us to absorb without being affected, the "Sukham" that Shri Maata has to offer to us ? And while I acknowledge that bhakthas of the calibre of Kannappa nAyanAr are not limited to any form of worship, It has always been traditionally acknowledged that Shri Vidya Upaasana ( Sapthashathi Parayanam included ) should be imparted by a proper Guru who is knowledgeable in these matters. Ultimately it is for each individual to decide which way to praise ambaaL, but I respectifully submit that our "mAthA SampradAyeshwarI, sAdhvI" would also be pleased at our observance of these traditions and practices. Om Shri MAthA Shri mahAthripurasundaryai Namah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2001 Report Share Posted March 4, 2001 Thank you Mr Ravi, for bringing out the thought that has been vaguely in my mind which I could not bring out. It is true that the bhakti in the heart is more important than all the rituals and other incidentals. Let me share the thought I had about 21 years back when I first visited VaraNasi for the first time. We have been tought all along in the south that the pronunciation of a mantra is most important and any error in pronouncing the syllables will cause a great harm to the sadhaka - so much so that I had been scared to do the daily gayatri for fear of pronouncing the words wrongly. When I had been to VaraNasi in 1980, for the first time, I was struck with surprise at the way the pandits there, read out the gayatri. VaraNasi being acclaimed as the seat of knowledge in the Indian folklore, I was surprised to hear the rendering of gayatri there which would have been definitely denounced by our southern gurus. Thinking over the matter, after a decade thereafter, it occured to me that all the pandits in VaraNasi (or for that matter all those in the northern India) can not go to hell and that God must be giving them credit for their intentions rather than for their pronunciation. I regret that I did not do the daily gayatri for almost a quarter century after my upanayanam, for fear of errors in pronounciation Regards Narayan ---- you wrote: > After hearing many warnings from members on the text, how to read it, > and how it will destroy a devotee if he does something unguided, I > thought I will share a post which I sent some time back to advaita-L. I > am posting this not with an intention of saying what you mentioned is > wrong. But to highlight a greater principle in worship which is more > important. > > In brief, ambaaL sees the attitude behind the action, than the action > itself. If it is love that propels the action, SHE will not mind > anything. After all SHE is our mother, isn't SHE? > > This is a verse from shivAnandalaharI highlighting the life of great > kaNNappa nAyanAr. > > Thank you. > > Ravi > > > ----------- > > > > >From shivAnandalaharI > > maargaavartitapaadukaa pashupateraN^gasya kuurchaayate > gaNDuushhaaMbunishhechanaM puraripordivyaabhishhekaayate | > kiMchidbhakshitamaaMsasheshhakabalaM navyopahaaraayate > bhaktiH kiM na karotyaho vanacharo bhaktaavataMsaayate || 63|| > > Near the kalahasti hill (in present day Andhra Pradesh, close to Tamil > Nadu border), there lived a hunter tribe. Leader of the tribe was nAgan > and his wife was tattai. For a long time they did not have a child and > finally by the grace of Lord subrahmaNya they gave birth to a male > child > and he was called tiNNan (because he was strong and huge at the time of > birth). With time and he grew and one fine day, his father nAgan > bestowed the leadership to the tribe to tiNNan. As a celebration for > that occassion, a big hunt was arranged. The whole forest reverberated > with the sound of hunters and many animal were hunted. > > It so happened one wild boar, managed to escape and tiNNan took that as > a challenge and started following it. Along with him two of his body > guards also chased the boar. Finally, they managed to catch and kill it > near the ponmugali river (far from their village). On the other side of > the hill was a hill with a temple for Lord shiva. When tiNNan looked at > the hill, something attracted him so strong, he left job of cooking the > boar to one his assistant and started with the other to the hill. > > On the hill, in the temple, looking at the Lord, tiNNan became ecstatic > and spell bound. He had no mood to leave the place. Overcome by > emotion, > he hugged the shiva-linga and stayed there. Looking at the flowers > etc., > he asked his assistant about it and he was told, that a priest comes > here to worship in the day time. Filled with the desire to worship the > lord, tiNNan went back to the river bank. But he was in such a divine > mood, his assistant thought he is mad and left to the village to report > to his father nAgan. Not even noticing it, tiNNan was busy preparing > the > food. He carefully cooked the wild boar and tasted the good pieces and > collected it a leaf cup (tamil donnai) for the lord. Then gathered some > flowers and carried them in head (as his hands were full with bow and > cooked food). Finally took a big mouthful of water and walked back to > the hill. > > > There, > > maargaavartitapaadukaa pashupateraN^gasya kuurchaayate > > His worn leather slippers became the kUrcham (brush) for the lord of > jIvas (pashupati) to remove the old flowers. > > gaNDuushhaaMbunishhechanaM puraripordivyaabhishhekaayate > > The water he carried in his mouth became the sacred water of purAri's > abhishhekam. Then he adorned the Lord with the flowers in his head. > > > kiMchidbhakshitamaaMsasheshhakabalaM navyopahaaraayate > > The well cooked and tasted flesh of the wild boar became the naivedyam > for the lord. > > Then tiNNan stood guard all night to protect the Lord and next day > morning left for getting food. The priest who came there was shocked > looking at the left over meat, bones, etc. With tears, cleaned the > place > and performed the puuja and left. This cycle of tiNNan worshipping in > the night and the priest in the day continued for four days. On the > fourth day, overcome by grief, the priest pleaded intensely to the Lord > for help. That night, Lord appeared in the dream and asked him to hide > in the temple next night. > > The appointed hour came, and our tiNNan trekked back to the hill with > food, flowers, and water. To his shock he saw that one of the eyes of > shiva bleeding. Overcome by sorrow, he wailed, cried, and tried few > herbal remedies. None worked. Finally he remembered his tribe's saying > that flesh is healed by flesh (UniRku Un marundiDal vENDum). Out of > boundless love, plucked his eyes with the arrow and pasted it on the > lord's eye. What a wonder, the bleeding stopped. No words are adequate > describe the joy of tiNNan. The priest was amazed at his act. As if it > is not enough, the other eye of the lord started bleeding. Now tiNNan > had no need for running around. He knew the medicine. To make sure of > the eye's position, he kept his leather slipper near it (on the linga), > and got ready to pluck his other eye. Lord not interested in testing > his > devotee any further, appeared and stopped him. Since he pasted > (apputhal) his eyes (kaN), he was called kaNNappa. > > > bhaktiH kiM na karotyaho vanacharo bhaktaavataMsaayate || 63|| > > > When there is bhakti in heart, what is not possible. Thus the hunter > became a celebrated devotee of the lord. > > God does not see our action, but the attitude behind the action. If > there is no love behind the action, and even if one gives ganges water > from Gold vessel, He will not care for it. Why should He, when > > karasthe hemaadrau girisha nikaTasthe dhanapatau > gR^ihasthe svarbhuujaa.amarasurabhichintaamaNigaNe | > shirasthe shiitaaMshau charaNayugalasthe.akhilashubhe > kamarthaM daasye.ahaM bhavatu bhavadarthaM mama manaH || 27|| > > When given with love even > > gaNDuushhaaMbunishhechanaM puraripordivyaabhishhekaayate > > > Such is the greatness of the Lord. > > AUM shivAyai namaH AUM shivAya namaH > AUM shivapriyAyai namaH AUM shivaapriyAya namaH > AUM jaganmAtre namaH AUM jagatekapitre namaH > > AUM namaH shivAyai cha namaH shivAya > > > -- > Ravi > > > > > Get email at your own domain with Mail. > http://personal.mail./ > > AUM shrImAtre namaH > > Archives : http://www.ambaa.org/ (Edited) > : /messages// > > Contact : help > > Your use of is subject to > > ------------------------------- Get your free email from AltaVista at http://altavista.iname.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2001 Report Share Posted March 9, 2001 Dear Group members, Shri Kanchi Paramacharyal had this to say on Mantra Upasana, Sri Chakra Pooja, Saudarya Lahari and Kundalini Yoga ( in Book 6 of "Dheivathin Kural" series, dealing with Saundaraya Lahari in about more than 700 pages in Tamil ) : A rough translation of the parts relevant to our discussion topic ( with gaps in between) is given below. About the necessity of niyama " The first 41 slokas of Saundarya Lahari are Mantra Shastra. It contains Mantra Yoga, Kundalini Yoga etc. Only very few people, who are able to absorb it by following very strict niyamas, will be able to derive benefit out of it. Even if there are small mistakes in it, it can give raise to undesirable effects. We may be tempted to think: 'After all, we are performing the Upasna of our own divine Mother; will she not tolerate our minor mistakes ?' No, it is not proper to think so. Her leela is diverse. Hence she has created several paths for her Upasana, some of which are easy and pleasant, while some others are tough and ugra. Each path has to be followed with its prescribed rules only. There are a lot of pleasant and easy ways like visiting temples, recitation of sthothras, singing Bhajans/Keerthan and listening to Harikatha Upanyasa etc. But if one chooses to ignore these easy paths and deliberately takes up Japa, Yoga and Sri Chakra Pooja, but still prefers to perform them without the prescribed niyama, then Ambaal will surely consider it an an affront or sacrilege. Those who are incapable of following the prescribed niyama should understand themselves and also that these are meant for a very few eligible persons only. ................. About Sri Chakra Upasana 'It has been advised by people knowledgeable in Shastras that Sri Chakra Upasana has to be done with great care and attention. Still Bhagvan Shri Sankaracharyal has sung ( in Saundarya Lahari ) that Ambaal is happily united with her consort in the Prana-sthan in the Pancha Brahma Asanam, with extreme love for all of us, her children. Hence, why is it necessay for us, her children, to be too cautious in her Sri Chakra Upasana; is it not sufficient tht we perform the Upasana for my own Mother and Father more easily, according to what we know, and what is is possible, according to our mind's dictates ?' It appears to me that Bhagwan Sri Shankaracharya was anxious about such thinking on our part. Granted, that we can perform Upasana out of love, for our divine Mother and Father without too much of rigid rules. BUT IN THAT CASE, YANTRA ( SRI CHAKRA) SHOULD NOT BE USED. Mantras and avaahana should not be used. What is permitted is to have a picture and perform Puja with flowers and Nama Parayanam. We can add Bhajan and Keerthan. In such cases, the Sadhaka usually has not reached a stage of spontaneous gushing of true profound love of God , and is unwilling to perform Upasana according to rules and niyama, but still performs the Upasana with an actual superficial love (while assuming by himslef to be having abudant profound love ). What happens in such cases is that the Sadhaka does not derive the real essence of the benefit of the Upasana. If one does not have the required attitude/aptitude to perform Upasana according to the rules and niyama, Sri Chakra Puja should NOT be performed. 'na shreyo niyaqmam vina' . ( There is no shreyas without niyama). Not only that, if the niyama is not correctly followed, only undersirable effects will occur. Such Yantra Aradhana should not be taken up by all and sundry. Inadvertently, people should not take up such Yantra Aradhana.. .... About the need for indriya nigraham for Ambaal Upasakas "In one of the last slokas in the Saudarya Lahari, Acharya says to Ambaal :' Your Pada Pooja Kramam is not easy to know for those with wavering indriyas. For example, even Devas like Indira ( who are all enjoying the Swarga Loka) are even ineligible to enter beyond your outermost compound ( the outermost Nava avarana wall ) which is several millions of miles away from your central seat'" . ........... About Mantra Shastra "Some Sthothras like Saundarya Lahari contain Philosophical allegories ( 'Thathva Roopakam' : I am not sure if this English translation is appropriate) . These allegories have to be properly instructed only to those mature enough to understand them; others (not so mature) might misunderstand them and hence they are considered to be secret. However there is a more important matter. That is the Mantra Shastra. Mantras are full of power ( Veerya ). They are to be protected secretly and are to be provided only to appropriate adhikaris. It is like the law that only a person who has the appropriate license can possess a revolver. Similarly, Mantras and their Aksharas etc belong to the category which needs to protected carefully as secrets. In Saundarya Lahari such Mantra / Yantra matters are much more than the allegories. ........... About our mistakes "Nowadays there are two types of mistakes: 1. those who have practised Mantra Upasana for generations and those who are qualified for it ( proper adhikaris) have neglected the Mantra Upasana and have become highly secular ( Loukika) ; 2. Whimsical adoption of any Mantra Upasana by unqualified persons and that too without adopting the Shastraic rules : I am not sure which is a greater problem : whether it is the non-performance of Mantra Upasana by the qualified or the vice versa ?" ......... About Kudalini Yoga "About Kundalini, I want to caution, not once, but many many times. If an aspirant wants to practise Kundalini Yoga, he should very carefully try to get a guru , who has the following qualifications: The Guru should have obtained Kundalini Yoga siddhi himself; such a guru should never be working for his own personal benefit; the guru should monitor his students carefully and should be capable of taking them to higher steps one by one. The aspirant should be in a position to firmly believe in such a guru. Unless he gets such a Sadhguru, nobody should either start the practise of Kundalini Yoga by taking it up by himself or with the current crop of self-proclaimed " yogis" . I want to warn again and again that this is a matter which requires utmost caution . Though Mantra Yoga is not as serious as Kundalini Yoga, it is also a subject where abundant caution is warranted. Mantra Yoga also creates the same results like Kundalini Yoga, through the vibrations in the Nadi-s caused by Shabda. Gurumukha Upadesam ( Initiation) for Mantras is supremely important. It is for these reasons that Mantra Shastra matters are not discussed in detail in (my) public discourses. They are to be discussed only with Upasakas or those who want to become so, with good shraddha (faith). There is absolutely no use of knowing the Mantras without the prescribed initiation. For example, even if you have high quality imported bulbs, wiring and switches in the house, will they work without the electric connection from the Power House ? Similarly, without the Guru's power -- Athma Shakthi - self-initiated Mantras are useless. It does not matter if there is no benefit. However, if the Shabda Veerya is not absorbed properly, undesirable results may ensue. So, I will slightly modify the above example : Consider the Mantra Shabda itself as electricity. Can we physically ( literally) bring electricity ? We will only get electric shock. Only if we get the Mantra through the medium of the Guru ( like wire) as Initiation ( like bulb), its power will be controlled and we will get the benefit ( light) . Similarly, as the electricity flows unseen through the wire, the Mantra also should flow only secretly. " About Saundarya Lahari Parayana "Saundarya Lahari is not only a Sthothra with Mantra Rahasya-s, it is also a supreme Bhakti Sthothra. Bhagvan Shankara made it into a Sthothra not only for ShriVidya Upasakas, but also for ALL, only with the view that ALL could perform its parayana, as a way to enable them to keep the mind on Ambaal for sometime while doing so. There is no mistake in such Bhakti oriented parayana. Such sthothras - pregnant with Mantra Shastra-serve the purpose of making us understand that we have such potent shastras. It is sufficient if ALL know as to what are the Shastras that we do have. However only those who are quite keen to go deeper into Shastras and to properly learn as to what are within the Shastras and properly practise them, need to proceed further to get initiated appropriately. Others should not proceed further. Such Slokas, do generate the well being of the mankind, by virtue of the Mantra Shakthi inherent in their Shabda, even if their meaning is not known or understood. Generally, any Shothra, if recited with Bhakti, does generate well being. A Sthothra is not mere Shabdas and words. It captures the "Athmic Power" of its author( Sthothra Kartha) who has created it with a noble intention that all should get the benefit out of the Shothras. Hence the "living" Sthothra causes the well being of those reciting it. Also, the Devata who is praised in the Sthothra does take care, which indeed creates the ultimate well being of the devotee. Moreover, the author's "spirit" also does recommend to the Devata on behalf of the devotee and induces the Anugraha. When the devotee further regularly practices the recital, and as he/she accumulates its beneficial effects, he will gradually get an urge that he/she should properly learn it and get initiated from a guru and further practise it more vigorously. Then - ONLY THEN - can the devotee learn from the guru all the secret meanings also." I hope the above views of the Aharya do clarify some of the issues. ( All errors in translation are mine, to which corrections are welcome). Pranaams to all. Kameshwaran , krama@m... wrote: > Shri Vidya Peetadhipathi Shri Vidya Gurave Namah. > ----------------- > > In principle, we are trying to achieve a BhakthI that is Pure, and > totally selfless in its Love for Ambaal. The Soundarya Lahari > says "ThuriyA kApi Thvam!" - "Who is Greater than you O Mother". The > Mother's Love for us is unconditional. Muthuswami Dikshithar in his > wisdom, says "Shri KamalAmbyAH param nahi Re, Re Chitta" - "There is > no entity greater than Shri Kamalamba". > > However, we must ask ourselves the following questions ... > > Are we not subject to the influence of the six enemies of human > beings - Kaama, Krodha, Lobha, Moha, Mada and Matsaryam ? > > Are we bhakhthas of the calibre of kaNNappa nAyanAr ? > > Is our love for the Mother absolutely pure and undiluted, and is our > motive always so pure ? > > If we are still under the influence of the six enemies mentioned > above, do we not need the protection and guidance of our Revered > Gurus, to be able to overcome these Shad Ripavah and then feel the > unfettered love of our beloved, Shri MahAtripurasundari. > > Do we not pray, saying "mAtar me madhukaitbhagni, > mahishaprANApahArodhya may ?Oh mother, destroyer of the demon > Madhukaita, please liberate me from MahishAsura? " > > My opinion in this matter is that not only do we need the guidance of > our Pujya Gurus to help overcome adversities, but also to prepare us > to absorb without being affected, the "Sukham" that Shri Maata has to > offer to us ? > > And while I acknowledge that bhakthas of the calibre of Kannappa > nAyanAr are not limited to any form of worship, It has always been > traditionally acknowledged that Shri Vidya Upaasana ( Sapthashathi > Parayanam included ) should be imparted by a proper Guru who is > knowledgeable in these matters. > > Ultimately it is for each individual to decide which way to praise > ambaaL, but I respectifully submit that our "mAthA SampradAyeshwarI, > sAdhvI" would also be pleased at our observance of these traditions > and practices. > > Om Shri MAthA Shri mahAthripurasundaryai Namah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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