Guest guest Posted May 12, 2002 Report Share Posted May 12, 2002 Dear Sirs, i have been following the postings, the email which sparked this debate was that of facing obstacles and troubles in this journey of life inspite of being a bhaktha of the Devi (chanting LS was a medium of expressing one's devoution). By our devoution to Her, do the troubles vanish? or is it that we will get the strength to face the troubles and overcome them? I guess what iam trying to get at is that, do we have a right to assume that we by virtue of being a bhaktha of her should not face any troubles at all? Or vice versa a bhaktha who faces troubles, can he/she assume that there is a fault in their devoution? The troubles I refer to is that which is due to us (past sins, mistakes etc and not those that are related to planets etc..) Could it be that the problem may not be with the chanting of LS at all? regards Vishy --- ambaal2001 <seshagir wrote: > Dear Sir, > > Even though I do not have much understanding on > this, after > reading some of the recent posts, I am posting some > of my > *personal feelings/thoughts* on this. I respectfully > disagree > with what you have written. This is a long post, so > I thank > you for indulging me (if u decide to read it :-) > > Our mind has a great tendency to rationalize and > many times > our ego will greatly mislead us, at least it has > done so in > my case. > > For two years, since I joined this list, I started > thinking of > myself as a great devotee of HER. I would also look > at my > friends and say to myself "what fools these people > are, always > talking about a job, a career, family etc. with no > regard to > any higher ideal in life." I also did this with my > parents > and relatives ! I soon started thinking "I am > someone special. > Even to think about HER requires HER grace, > therefore i am > special to HER. Why, I am better than most people." > Then some > small problem would confront me, and would change my > outlook. > > For example, something as simple as a train coming > and blocking > the road for 45 mins (which is very common over > here) would > be enough to do it !!! In that instant of depair, I > would > blame and violently curse God that in spite of all > my love > and devotion to HER, all kinds of obstacles were > being placed > in my life and that if this is what happens, then i > don't want > any part of it. As another example, I used to read > the Gospel > of Ramakrishna and then sit in front of HER picture > and cry > for hours "YOU are my only support. Who else can I > turn to ?" > (some things you have almost quoted verbatim in your > post) In > the back of my mind, I would be thinking, "at 8pm on > TNT they > are showing Predator", at 7:55 pm I would say > (almost like > I was Shyama Shastry pleading in his compositions) > "I love YOU > very much, please come and out of YOUR boundless > grace, save > me quickly" and then I would run out to watch TV. > Whenever it > was convenient for me, I would pray and proclaim > that I love > only YOU, nothing else matters, but when it was not, > I would > totally forget and sometimes deliberately try to > avoid HER. In > this way, I kept fooling myself. This was/is the > extent of my > "love" for HER. I am mentioning all this because > even though > in my case the danger in this line of thinking is > very grossly > apparent, in other cases, *it might be more subtle*. > > > I too never did my sandhyavandanam (SV). Like Ravi > mentioned > somewhere, I would chant the lalitA pa~ncharatnam, > aShTottaram > etc. everday, but never do my SV. The thought that I > am very > special to HER was always in my mind though. Now I > have started > realizing that love is not an unregulated flow of > emotions. > It is born of out of knowledge and correct thinking, > and in > order to get to this stage, some disciplining of > the mind > is required. I think you have misunderstood the > purport of > Shri Krishnamurthy's email. Maybe he can correct me > if I have > understood him wrong. I think he was implying what I > have > said, that we are all not like Ramakrishna > Paramahansa. He > loved HER and talked to HER like his own Mother. > Maybe one > in a million is as spiritually advanced as him (Shri > Ramana > Maharishi was another such person), and maybe these > rules, > scriptural injunctions etc. do not apply to them, at > least > in the sense we are familiar with. They have gone > beyond these. > For the rest of us, these rules are important, > otherwise our > ego will lead us astray, yet all the while we will > be thinking > that we are doing things out of love for HER. > > I recall a post on another list where > Paramacharyal's words > were recalled "We sometimes say we trust our > mind/heart and > accord to it a higher status. But in the matter of > dharma, > mind comes last. After all mind, manasaakshi in > tamizh, is > only saakshi or witness and not the judge. When all > other > avenues have been exhausted, then we can say 'ok you > mind, > you have been witness to everything, i am quite > lost.. what > do u think I should do', not before that". > > The above is my personal opinion only. Even in 1000 > lifetimes, > i cannot hope to achieve the devotion that most > people on this > list have, so i don't have the moral authority to > say much. > I shared my thoughts because i thought there was a > pitfall in > the line of reasoning that your post espoused. I > will be > thankful if the flaws in my thinking are corrected. > These days > I am quite content to do my sandhyavandanam and > nothing else. > Even this is a great struggle for me, 95% of the > days my mind > tries to think of some excuse to not do it. As > regards posting > to the list, I do so only in the hope that service > done to > other real devotees will stand me in good stead in > my future > births :-) If Ravi's requirements to be a member of > this > list are taken seriously, I would REALLY be the > first person > to have to leave. That is where matters stand with > me. In two > years, if there is anything I have realized, it is > the > hopelessness of my case and the limited avail of my > own efforts. > > Regards, > Sridhar. > > > > AND in case a person does not have a Guru- why > not address > > Ambaal Herself thus- 'O MOther, You are my > everything . You > > are my GUru, and God and Self. > > I am repeating these names out of Love for You . > I am > > repeating these names in order to gain Pure LOve > for You. > > Please guide me. Mother , Whom else can I turn to? > O MOther > > - i want to come closer to You. If you feel that > my > > chanting these names are wrong , please correct > me. If you > > feel that I need a Guru to initiate me, please > guide to one > > who will teach me about You'... > > > LAUNCH - Your Music Experience http://launch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Dear Sri Sridhar, Your mail is the perfect reflection. It does't startle me, because in the current rapidity of Kali Yuga and the enormous disturbances everyone encounters by way television, cinema, closed mind set for a quicky in materialistic results, it requires enormous strength to go near Her - by any means say be a disciplined Upaasaka, total surrender, simple love to the deity, etc. By materialism, I don't deprive everyone of comfortable living, or question the need for prosperity, but an avaricious outlook for great money (e.g. both owners of finance companies, as well as the greedy investors in Chennai in the last few years). Sridhar, people who have been initiated to Gayathri chanting, must chant Her manthra everyday without fail, as that itself is a great Sri Vidyopaasanai. To quote Sri Muralidhara Swamigal, Chennai, for bakthi, one must have total belief that the Archa murthy or a god's picture, Yantra which one wishes to worship, is the embodiment of God Himself. Then only, one progresses in the upaasanai and obtain results. Another humble opinion: Worship must be been done religiously -- constantly, everyday, with regularity. That habit enables steady progress. Over a period, one tends to remember God only at least during that short puja period. I have written whatever came to my mind. E&OE pls. Regards, L Vaidyanathan ______________________ Everything you always wanted to know about cars and bikes,now at: http://in.autos./cricket/tracker.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Hi everyone, I just join your group maybe a week and I will like a copy of the Lalita Strotram. I must say that Ifeel very blessed by MAA because I am from Guyana South America and I grew up in a home that was practising Durga Puja every year. I just love her and try to do her Puja every Nowrathrie. I have been following the discussions for the past week and I have to agree that Maa is kind to all her children and she knows innocent and love and she also knows when her children knowingly do wrong things. Yet she forgaves us all and pray that we will improve our life and be better children Jai Maata Di anavadya <prasad wrote: Namste.Vande Mataram. Please do not think I got some thing to tell above Sri Sridhar's and Sri Kaushik's words. I felt like ,I like to share my experience, as I am also reciting LS and.... that too, without initiation from a Guru!(Oh my god!!) When water in a lake becomes still, you can see the bottom of the lake clearly. Try to calm down your egos,mind/mental distractions and all such kind of distraction due to iha loka;Mother surfaces out from/as your innerself and then, you can see what our Mother of All is intending you/us to do. Whom can we pray except Mother, when there is nothing besides HER? - It is my own quote. How else can you pray/aproach HER, without reciting LS? - quoted in PhalaSruti of LS. and ONLY devoted should recite LS.No one else. Me too, without having Guru,I am reciting LS, for pleasure, and to feel that innerself.It gives me intense pleasure.After each recitation,I will be thrown back nearer to my own innocent but powerful innerself. So, I am in nowhere near to tell who should recite LS or what will be the consequences of reciting it without initiation.For my experience, I never got a chance to lookback whether LS reciting is wrong/right decision? - Anyhow, how can I reconsider my decision of chanting HER 1000 names, When I see , SHE is everything and there is absolutely nothing besides HER. BUT STILL..., I recently restrained my roommate to not to chant LS, because I sensed lot of foolishness(not innocense),kritaGhnata in him (he is also unaware of power of LS)and more over my innerself, without second opinion, just like that told me to not to encourage him to recite even a single word of LS in any means by him.I really do not know for sure why I got this instinct. So dear devotees, please see what Mother said thru the postings of Sri Kaushik and Sri Sridhar and lot more other devotees of HER.If one really know the meanings and power of LS, and are innocent enough to not to interfer ego with Love towards HER.......like this my way of thinking goes if I like to prove that I am right in reciting LS without initiation, But I do not want to do that. As I do not believe in that proof and also my that deduction may wrongfully encourage others to recite LS, without being able to conceive the nector arising from that recitation. BUT I continue to recite it ,because my innerself still shows me green lights in that direction. I might be wrong,Oh Mother, through your kind devotees , please rectify me.Namastubhyam. Om Sri Matre namaha. Prasada Reddy. Sponsor var lrec_URL="http://rd./M=225940.2049433.3518213.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=170\ 5075991:HM/A=1061772/R=0/id=flashurl/*http://www.fullaccessmedical.com/t/7428/21\ 1/2458684356";var lrec_flashfile="http://us.a1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/a/1-/flash/misc/fam_lrec_group\ smail_0429b.swf";var lrec_altURL="http://rd./M=225940.2049433.3518213.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=\ 1705075991:HM/A=1061772/R=1/id=altimgurl/*http://www.fullaccessmedical.com/t/742\ 8/211/2458684356";var lrec_altimg="http://us.a1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/a/1-/flash/misc/fam_lrec_groupsma\ il_0429.gif";var lrec_width=300;var lrec_height=250;on error resume nextSub banner_click_lrec_FSCommand(ByVal command, ByVal args)call banner_click_lrec_DoFSCommand(command, args)end sub AUM shrImAtre namaH AUM namaH shivAya AUM namaH shivAbhyAm Archives : http://www.ambaa.org/ (Edited) : /messages// Contact : help LAUNCH - Your Music Experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 No controversy here but if you arecasking people to calm down their egos,I have a curious question for you...how could you judge your roommate. Right and wrong is a perception and how could you decide that you sensed kritaghnata in your roommate. What makes you so sure that your instincts are correct?? Is all this not your own superego and does not worship of LS mean surrendering the ego, so what tattva have you learnt?? You need to question if you are merely reciting verses. Do go to he ambaa web site and read the excellent translation put up by the scholars in this group, maybe that will assist!! Try to calm down your egos,mind/mental distractions and all such kind of distraction due to iha loka;Mother surfaces out from/as your innerself and then, you can see what our Mother of All is intending you/us to do. Whom can we pray except Mother, when there is nothing besides HER? - It is my own quote. How else can you pray/aproach HER, without reciting LS? - quoted in PhalaSruti of LS. and ONLY devoted should recite LS.No one else. Me too, without having Guru,I am reciting LS, for pleasure, and to feel that innerself.It gives me intense pleasure.After each recitation,I will be thrown back nearer to my own innocent but powerful innerself. So, I am in nowhere near to tell who should recite LS or what will be the consequences of reciting it without initiation.For my experience, I never got a chance to lookback whether LS reciting is wrong/right decision? - Anyhow, how can I reconsider my decision of chanting HER 1000 names, When I see , SHE is everything and there is absolutely nothing besides HER. BUT STILL..., I recently restrained my roommate to not to chant LS, because I sensed lot of foolishness(not innocense),kritaGhnata in him (he is also unaware of power of LS)and more over my innerself, without second opinion, just like that told me to not to encourage him to recite even a single word of LS in any means by him.I really do not know for sure why I got this instinct. I might be wrong,Oh Mother, through your kind devotees , please rectify me.Namastubhyam. Om Sri Matre namaha. Prasada Reddy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Dear Sridhar, I absolutely agree with you.You are very correct - rather than jump to conclusions and decieve oneself, one should follow the words of one's Guru or the scriptural injunctions. I agree with you . with my present wavering mind, I am not fit to even mention the word'Bhakthi' or 'Love' .. Though it is true that The Mother responds to innocent single pointed devotion, it is also true that such cases are very rare. As you very well pointed out , our minds run to a thousand different things every other minute and it requires great effort to fix it on God constantly . sorry to waste your time.. please do ignore my blabberings, bala >"ambaal2001" <seshagir > > > Re: LS-Consequences >Sun, 12 May 2002 18:41:11 -0000 > >Dear Sir, > > Even though I do not have much understanding on this, after >reading some of the recent posts, I am posting some of my >*personal feelings/thoughts* on this. I respectfully disagree >with what you have written. This is a long post, so I thank >you for indulging me (if u decide to read it :-) > >Our mind has a great tendency to rationalize and many times >our ego will greatly mislead us, at least it has done so in >my case. > >For two years, since I joined this list, I started thinking of >myself as a great devotee of HER. I would also look at my >friends and say to myself "what fools these people are, always >talking about a job, a career, family etc. with no regard to >any higher ideal in life." I also did this with my parents >and relatives ! I soon started thinking "I am someone special. >Even to think about HER requires HER grace, therefore i am >special to HER. Why, I am better than most people." Then some >small problem would confront me, and would change my outlook. > >For example, something as simple as a train coming and blocking >the road for 45 mins (which is very common over here) would >be enough to do it !!! In that instant of depair, I would >blame and violently curse God that in spite of all my love >and devotion to HER, all kinds of obstacles were being placed >in my life and that if this is what happens, then i don't want >any part of it. As another example, I used to read the Gospel >of Ramakrishna and then sit in front of HER picture and cry >for hours "YOU are my only support. Who else can I turn to ?" >(some things you have almost quoted verbatim in your post) In >the back of my mind, I would be thinking, "at 8pm on TNT they >are showing Predator", at 7:55 pm I would say (almost like >I was Shyama Shastry pleading in his compositions) "I love YOU >very much, please come and out of YOUR boundless grace, save >me quickly" and then I would run out to watch TV. Whenever it >was convenient for me, I would pray and proclaim that I love >only YOU, nothing else matters, but when it was not, I would >totally forget and sometimes deliberately try to avoid HER. In >this way, I kept fooling myself. This was/is the extent of my >"love" for HER. I am mentioning all this because even though >in my case the danger in this line of thinking is very grossly >apparent, in other cases, *it might be more subtle*. > > I too never did my sandhyavandanam (SV). Like Ravi mentioned >somewhere, I would chant the lalitA pa~ncharatnam, aShTottaram >etc. everday, but never do my SV. The thought that I am very >special to HER was always in my mind though. Now I have started >realizing that love is not an unregulated flow of emotions. >It is born of out of knowledge and correct thinking, and in >order to get to this stage, some disciplining of the mind >is required. I think you have misunderstood the purport of >Shri Krishnamurthy's email. Maybe he can correct me if I have >understood him wrong. I think he was implying what I have >said, that we are all not like Ramakrishna Paramahansa. He >loved HER and talked to HER like his own Mother. Maybe one >in a million is as spiritually advanced as him (Shri Ramana >Maharishi was another such person), and maybe these rules, >scriptural injunctions etc. do not apply to them, at least >in the sense we are familiar with. They have gone beyond these. >For the rest of us, these rules are important, otherwise our >ego will lead us astray, yet all the while we will be thinking >that we are doing things out of love for HER. > > I recall a post on another list where Paramacharyal's words >were recalled "We sometimes say we trust our mind/heart and >accord to it a higher status. But in the matter of dharma, >mind comes last. After all mind, manasaakshi in tamizh, is >only saakshi or witness and not the judge. When all other >avenues have been exhausted, then we can say 'ok you mind, >you have been witness to everything, i am quite lost.. what >do u think I should do', not before that". > > The above is my personal opinion only. Even in 1000 lifetimes, >i cannot hope to achieve the devotion that most people on this >list have, so i don't have the moral authority to say much. >I shared my thoughts because i thought there was a pitfall in >the line of reasoning that your post espoused. I will be >thankful if the flaws in my thinking are corrected. These days >I am quite content to do my sandhyavandanam and nothing else. >Even this is a great struggle for me, 95% of the days my mind >tries to think of some excuse to not do it. As regards posting >to the list, I do so only in the hope that service done to >other real devotees will stand me in good stead in my future >births :-) If Ravi's requirements to be a member of this >list are taken seriously, I would REALLY be the first person >to have to leave. That is where matters stand with me. In two >years, if there is anything I have realized, it is the >hopelessness of my case and the limited avail of my own efforts. > >Regards, >Sridhar. > > > > AND in case a person does not have a Guru- why not address > > Ambaal Herself thus- 'O MOther, You are my everything . You > > are my GUru, and God and Self. > > I am repeating these names out of Love for You . I am > > repeating these names in order to gain Pure LOve for You. > > Please guide me. Mother , Whom else can I turn to? O MOther > > - i want to come closer to You. If you feel that my > > chanting these names are wrong , please correct me. If you > > feel that I need a Guru to initiate me, please guide to one > > who will teach me about You'... > > _______________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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