forms of God (Shanmatham)

[Guest guest]

Respected devotees,

 

Shri vijaya ganapathy writes...

 

" Adi Sankara re-established the " Shanmatham" -- Worship limited to

six forms as revealed in our Vedas and as per this the PARA BRAHMAN

can be mediated only in any of these SIX FORMS. They are ;

Ganapathyeem, Kowmaram , Sowram, Vaishnavam , Shaivam and

Shakthm " .

 

True, the first major classification of hinduism was made by shri

Adi shankara Bhagvadapda. but only in a larger framework of hinduism.

 

but, there are many other indigenous forms of worship among Hindus -

there are village gods/goddesses ( grameen devatas and devis) and

there are kula devatas and kula devis (clan deities) so, we have

hindus worshipping 'madurai veeran' or 'muneeshwerar' etc....or annai

velanganni amman etc!

 

so, i do agree with Ravi when he says "One cannot limit the forms God

can assume and not even specifically to our anthropomorphic

conception. He has taken the form animals (such a Wild Boar, in one

of the leela-s). And he can assume any form> he chooses."

 

we cannot ignore the worship of

1) minor deities

2) clan deities (kula devatas)

3) village deities ( grameen devatas)

4) avatars etc....

The 'sun' god is mot just worshipped in saurashtra alone! during the

festival of 'pongal' in south india, the sun god is worshipped as

part of 'thanksgiving' for the bounty of harvest.

 

there are the clan deiies for example-madurai veeran who are

worshipped for their heroic deeds.

 

then what about avatars.... the thiruviladiyil puranam elaborates

this...

 

and lord rama and lord krishna are such avatars too! (avatars of lord

narayana) divine manifestations who took human form to

establish 'dharma' !

 

Sanatana dharma is so called only because it is full of 'compassion' -

all forms of worship are allowed... to each according to his/her

disposition... thus you have devotees worshipping 'Manasi'

(nageshweri devi) for 'progeny ! devotees worshipping 'ala maram' or

tree...

 

Hari AUM!

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

[Guest guest]

Respected Shri Shankaran,

 

Thank you for your respone. You state rather correctly,

 

"th meditator eventually becomes the meditated" and the

difference ceases to exist, he takes on the qualities of the

meditated. "

 

This is true.it is called bhramaa-keeta nyaya. the analogy of the wasp

and the caterpillar, which states how the caterpillar gets

transformed into a wasp by intense thinking of the latter. Even so,

the Jiva becomes Brahman itself by meditating intensely on the latter.

 

so, you are correct- as you contemplate, so you shall be. This

thumb rule applies very much to any object of

continuous concentration, be it a mantra-deity, or a

butterfly as in the case of a caterpillar inside a

pupa.

 

here, i would like to narrate a story which is often narrated by

Sadhus in religious discourses.

 

One day, a wandering sadhu came upon a boy herding

buffaloes. He was hungry, and the boy readily obliged him

with some milk. After drinking to his satisfaction,

the sadhu began to feel generous, and asked the

herdsman, 'What would you like? I'm feeling fine, I'll give

it to you.'

 

The boy laughed and said,'I really don't need anything. I do nothing

all day long but herd my buffaloes, and am fully satisfied with that.

Besides, sadhu-maharaj, you came to me as a beggar and I

gave you alms. How can I expect anything from you in

return? I am the giver, not you.'

 

The sadhu was taken aback by the reply, and realised that this was no

ordinary buffalo-herd. But still feeling expansive he asked, 'What is

it that you love most in the world?''Why, this buffalo', the boy

replied innocently, 'the one whose milk you just drank. She is the

largest I have, she gives me 10 gallons of milk everyday, she is

broad and strog, so loving and beautiful, I love her

best of all.'

 

All right', said the sadhu, 'please do one thing. Go sit in that cave

and imagine that you are this buffalo. Think of her, keep her picture

in mind, completely self identify with her, become her ! As you sit

doing all this, repeat to yourself "Bhaisoham, bhaisoham"(I am a

buffalo, I am a buffalo). Don't worry about a thing, I'll look after

your buffaloes.'

 

The herdsman did exactly as the sadhu said, and after 3 days when the

sadhu entered the cave, he found the boy sitting motionless with his

eyes closed, repeating, "Bhaisoham, bhaisoham".

 

The sadhu said, 'So young man, how have you progressed? Come out

now.'

 

Out came the reply,'Don't call me a young-man! I am a buffalo. Can't

you see that? Look at my broad back! How can I leave this small cave?

My horns are too broad to go thru the enterance. Now don't be

foolish; go away and leave me alone or I'll gore you and toss you

out with these beautiful horns of mine.'

 

But the sadhu persisted and said, 'Try to remember my boy, I

told you to sit and do this. Now, instead of

repeating, "I am a buffalo", start to identify with Shiva

and repeat "Shivoham, Shivoham"(I am Shiva, I am

Shiva).'

 

The herdsman did that, and in about fifteen minutes he was in a deep

trance(samadhi). He realized his goal: The Universal Soul in the form

of Lord Shiva.

 

The sadhu was astonished. Tears came to his eyes and he said to

himself, 'This fellow sits only three and a half days and achieves

and I have wandered around practising without success for so many

years.'

 

Then he had to take that buffalo herd as his guru, and

finally he also realized.

 

we all know the story of Shri Ramakrishna paramahamsa .What took his

guru thirty years to achieve, Ramakrishna achieved in a few days."

 

This proves that time is not the critereon; if the desire is strong

enough the result must occur without delay. All has to be

forgotten except the name and form of the deity. Hence it

is important to choose a mantra and deity to which one

has very strong inherent affinity for, the Guru can

be very helpful here as he can look behind the make

believe world of our imaginations.<

 

Both name and form are essential for worship. One part of

the mind takes the shape of an object; that is form.

Another part of the mind identifies and distinguishes it;

that is name.&To go directly to the highest form of samadhi is almost

impossible. Even Ramakrishna had to worship Mother Bhavatarini for

many years before his consciousness became one-pointed enough to

achieve The Formless.

 

this is what is meant by " tadrupam" and "tanmayam" !

 

Hari Aum!

[Guest guest]

, "M. S. Ravisankar" <ravi@a...> wrote:

>

>

> 3) As per advaita-vedAnta, upaasana can never directly give final

> emancipation. The only way final emancipation is attained is via

jnAna. At

> the best, upaasana can lead only to krama mukti. Sankara takes up

this

> matter in brahma suutra bhaashhya and says that upasana can give

things like

> aishvarya praapti, krama mukti etc (depending on the situation).

Immediate

> emancipation (sadyo mukti) is only by jnAna. And not all upasana-s

will also

> lead to krama mukti. Hence, there is no guarantee that even

upaasana of the

> six you stated will lead to krama mukti. Lot has to go with the

attitude of

> upAsAna than the form chosen for the upAsana.

>

 

 

 

The role of upasana and bhakti were very confusing to me until I read

the Gita commentary of Acharya. Not that it's all clear now; at least

I have a better understanding than before.

 

As Ravi has stated, Upasana can act as a means to obtain a variety of

results. Any dharmic puruShartha is not condemned by the Vedas.

That's the reason why we see a lot of kaama and artha pradaana wishes

listed in the phalashruti; even in hymns like sahasranama.

 

Technically moksha is possible only though GYana. The problem of

samsaara is unique and cannot be solved either by sat-karma or

upasana.

 

For a mumukshu the role of upasana is totally different. The moksha

formula being

"karmaNaa chitta shuddhiH , upaasanayaa chitta ekagrataa or chitta

samskaaraH GYaanena shoka nivR^itiH" once we obtain purity of mind

through right action; practicing spiritual meditation or Upasana

gives a steadfast mind (ekagra chittam) where enquiry is possible.

 

Until a worldly gain is sought, Upasana becomes a means to fulfill

that. But when we don't see any value in worldly things (vairagya)

and seek Ishvara alone, we get two things, freedom from rebirth and a

steadfast mind. The reason why we are freed from rebirth is because

of the acquisition of Vairagya.

 

If one does not engage in the acquisition of GYana after acquiring

chitta-ekagrata, he gets to Brahma-loka after death (you can also

call it Kailasa, Vaikunta , Manidvipa etc..).

 

It is here that we have an option. Once a person attains chitta

ekagrata through upasana he can either do the enquiry here or in

brahma-loka. To get to brahma-loka and do the enquiry and get

liberated is called `krama mukti' and to do it here in this world and

in this birth is termed `sadyo mukti'.

 

Aravind

[Guest guest]

, "seeksha" <seeksha@h...> wrote:

> The problem of

> samsaara is unique and cannot be solved either by sat-karma or

> upasana.

>

> ...once we obtain purity of mind

> through right action; practicing spiritual meditation or Upasana

> gives a steadfast mind (ekagra chittam) where enquiry is possible.

>

> Once a person attains chitta

> ekagrata through upasana he can either do the enquiry here or in

> brahma-loka.

 

Thus there seems to be at least 3 major stages of spiritual growth:

 

a) Good work - to develop the right attitude.

b) Upasaana - to develop ability to focus/concentrate

c) Enquiry - to acquire higher knowledge, or dispel ignorance.

 

The opportunity of Human life (indeed all forms of Life) is for the

sole purpose of progressing in these stages. This may be a simple

answer to the question: why are we born?; or the broader question:

why is there living beings and non-living things?

 

I think, the three stages are apparent in the spritual texts,

Bhagavad Gita etc.

 

The three stages are seem apparent in the eight limbs of Ashtanga

Yoga - Yama, Niyama, Asana, Pranayama, Pratyahara, Dharana, Dhyaana,

Samadhi.

 

The three stages are also emphasized in the Devi Mahaatmyam in the

three Charitras. The Mahaatmyam also enables/assures progress through

the stages. For details see THE ESOTERIC SIGNIFICANCE OF THE DEVI-

MAHATMYA where SRI SWAMI KRISHNANANDA provides excellent insight into

why the three stages are gradual, sequential, and essential for

spiritual growth.

--> http://www.sivanandadlshq.org/religions/devi_mahatmya.htm

 

Now to Nadopaasana. Here is a thought for exploration by those

talented in Carnatic and/or Hindustani music. What is the

classificaiton based on: ragas, talas, song content, or other music

denominations, or combination of them, that maps to the above three

stages. I am an ignoramus in area of music (besides several others).

But I would be very surprised if such a mapping is proved impossible

or meaningless.

 

Thanks to the wonderful devotees in this group who have motivated the

discussions.