part 2 - 3-Alwars by Sri Bhuvarahacharya

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On Nov 11, 10:40am, Mani Varadarajan wrote:

> Re: 3-Alwars by Sri Bhuvarahacharya

>

> Sri Anbil Ramaswamy writes:

> >

> > I do not know how he says that the Alwars were just suffering humans like

any

> > of us but but maybe were endowed with superior vision.

> >

> > Swami Desika clearly says that the Alwars were HIS own incarnations

(Abhinava

> > Dasaavataaram Panni - Vide Rahasya Traya Saram)

> >

>

> One needs to dig deeper and more broadly into our pUrvAcArya's

> works to see how they viewed the Alvars.

>

> Regarding Desikan himself: his statement from Guruparampara Saaram

> that the Alvars were a new daSa avatAra (10 incarnations) of the

> Lord needs to be properly understood in context. Desikan is saying

> nothing different from Sri Bhuvarahachariar Swamy. The Alvars

> were graced by the entrace of the Lord into their hearts, cutting

> asunder their ignorance and showing Him to them as He truly is.

 

Coming to the reference from swami desikan it was

suggested indirectly that swami desikan had meant the lord entering the

bodies of azwars once they are born as baddha jivas and not as

thiru avathAram of lord HIMself. From the the tamil i learnt for

several years i can only get a meaning from the lines of swami

desikan "parAngusa parakAlAthi roobaththAlE abinavamAga oru

dasAvathAraththaip paNNI", that the lord did take incarnation of

dasAvathAram. the word paNNi means "DID" or "having done". Swami

desikan didnot say "dasAvathAramAga pugunthu" ie he didnot say

that he "entered" or pugunthu in the form of a dasA vathAram in 10

azwar's bodies.

 

I would request everyone to refer to Sri vangipuram swamigaL vyAkyA

nam for Srimad rahasya tray sAram of Swami desikan where these appears.

It is important to note that Sri vangipuram swamigaL has not only made

vyAkyAnams for srimad rahasya trya sAram but also for several swami desikan

slokams and most importantly swami desikan prabhandam. He has also

written vyAkyAnams on Lord Oppiliappan's suprapAdham, prapatti and

mangaLam. He also had thorough and indepthe knowledge of poorvAchAryAL's

work that is being mentioned above as the prerequisite. People wanting

to conclude on what they think as swami desikan might have meant

must first read these vyAkyAnams of Sri vangipuram swamigaL.

 

 

Coming to thirup paNAzwAr it is uncomfortable to note

that there was a total

misconception based on lack of comprehensive understanding of

swami desikan's works was presented such that swami desikan

somehow implied that "thirup pAnan" who simply appeared as the

(avathAram of Sri Krishna - as per our belief)

and who was not born in the normal way a

baddha jivan would be born, was a mere baddha jivan. One must

read Swami desika prabhandam in detail if they want to draw some

conclusion as to how Swami desikan considred azwar's avatharam and

aruLich cheyALs especially about thirup pANazwAr. This makes me

feel that i must write about the 3 pAsurams on "nam paNa NaTHAN"

that ends swami desikan's prabhadham "amirtha swathini" in great

detail, in saraNagathi journal at a later date. *If commanded* by

Sri Sadagopan and Sri Anbil Ramaswami, I will consider it as a

bAgyam to present the numerous insights and further and related

quotes of swami desikan on thirup pAnAzwAr. It will run

into several posts and hence it will be written in the

SDDS journal "saraNagathi" that is blessed by achAryALs

and bagwathALs such as Sri Anbil Ramaswamy and Sri Sadagopan.

 

> In any case, Sri Bhuvarahachariar is an esteemed authority

> on Divya Prabandham and the traditional commentaries thereon.

> Very, very few scholars today can match his erudition.

>

> Mani

>

>

 

The following arguments are presented for everyone in this forum

understand as to what is popularity and scholarship , erudition

in tamil and being well known in tamil

circles. It may be helpful for thsoe who enjoy

azwar poetry and would love to discuss them in this forum. One

may also want to expand their understanding of tamil circle and

tamil works and

understand as who is considered the most popular tamil author for

the TAMIL language. It would be beneficial also to know as to

what he delivered about azwars when commanded by Lord Arangan. I

would not otherwise present the argument in this way. It is

impolite to imply to someone and ask them indirectly to accept

someother on

the basis of mere popularity in certain circle alone. If such was

not meant i aplogise for presenting this interesting observation in

this way. For now, I may have to

take the same line that was taken earlier ie.. the line of

popularity erudition and nyAnam in tamil and azwar poetry.

 

Sri kambanAtAzwar was ordered by Lord Arangan when he went

to do samarpanam of his work Srimad kamba rAmayanam. Lord Arangan

asked him "did you deliver about sadagOpan (nammAzwAr ?)". The

result was that as instructed by Lord Arangan Sri Kamba nAtAzwAR

delivered sadagOpa ranthAthi.

 

Srimad kamba nAttAzwar is the master of all the tamil works

deliverd prior to his time and i donot think Sri kamba nAttAzwAr is

any less to anyone who are born then and are living now in 20th

century. I am aware of many tamil scholars who are proficient in

both drAvida vEdam and poorvachAryAL's work. I studied my

education in tamil medium and am exposed to the tamil community to

a large extent including the "kambar sangam", that did so much

research into Sri Kamban's work.

 

The paguththaRivu kazhagam and dravida movement in tamil

nadu considred Sri Kamban as the forefather of all the tamil works

that were delivered so far and to be delviered as Sri kamaban set

new standards in nadai and ilakkiyam itself. Infact dravidian

leaders such as Sri M.KarunAnithi (the CM of tamil nadu) and

Justice Mohan, Justice Ismail (former chief justice of madras high

court) were all one time president or thalaivar of kambar sangam.

The reason i am bringing this point is that even non religious and

non hindu persons were so much devoted to researching Sri Kamban's

work in Tamil country. Hence if some one thinks of proving

something on the basis of how popular a person in certain

community, one must see without fail Sri Kamban and his known

credentials in THE TAMIL SOCIETY. ie., If we see on the basis of

who is considred by all current tamil scholars in tamil circles as

the most knowledgable person in tamil poetry and as well as all

tamil works including azwar poems one must acknowledge without fail

that it is Sri Kamban. Whether or not our religion accepts Sri Kamban's

vyAkyAnams, it is important to note as to what he has delviered

about the azwars' birth when he was commanded by Lord Arangan

HIMself.

 

I donot mean to disrespect Sri Boovaraga swami in anyway.

I seek hs forgiveness if these arguments that are merely

presented to counter someone's argument that was presented above

in some way. If it may be understood by someone as it

it implies swami in anyway i seek their forgivenss as well.

I am still a student of prabhandam

and will learn inner meanings of prabhandams from many scholars

such as him. However, it is

argued in implication in this forum that one may consider some

presentations

merely on the basis of how the presenter is well known in certain

community. The community to be considred is TAMIL community in

chennai and Sri Kamban is the scholar in azwAr pAsurams and was

even commanded by lord Arangan to deliver on nammazwar. Lord

ARANGAN DIDNOT ASK MANY OF OUR ACHARYALS TO DELIVER ON NAMMAZWAR

BUT ASKED SRI KAMABAN. I CONSIDER THIS AS THE STRENGTH AND THE

MOST PORPULAR BASE erudition FOR THE PRESENTER OF SADAGOPAR ANTHATHI

OUR SRI KAMBANATTAZWAR. We still think he is unshakable for years

to come.

 

Having said that one can take a glance at the above pasuram

from sadagopar anthAthi.

 

In sadagopar anthAthi that he

delivered that

 

"bAvagath thAlthan thiru avathAram pathinonRip

poovagth thAR aRiyAtha vaNNam thannaiyE pugaznthu

nAvagath thAR kavi Ayiram pAdi nayanthaLiththa

kOvagath thAR kanRi enpuRath thAr sey kuRRavElkaLE "

sadagOpar anthAthi 78

 

it is said that the Lord took 10

thiruavathAram (AndAL is boomi devith thAyAr's avathAram) and

without these mortals of boologam knowing it (boo vagath thAr

aRiyAtha vaNNam). ie., at the time of HIS thiru avathAram as 10

azwArs, HE took such thiru avathArams without the booLoga vaasis

knowing it. And then Sri kamba nAAttAzwar goes on to say,

thannaiyE pugaznthu" ie by taking such avathAramas azwars the lord

praised HIMself through these pAsurams.

 

My final observation:

 

We all see our many current day achAryAs from their poorvasaramam. Once they

become achAryAL we stop calling them baddha jivAs even though we may have seen

their life as similar to a baddha jiva's life in their initial days of

poorvasramam. When we discuss their birth (and life) we still call as

avathAram and we no

more address them as baddha jivAtma. Same way even if we assume that the

Lord has simply chosen to enter their bodu only at the time of their birth,

or at the time of their appearance, we all know that they surrendered at the

feet of the lord and attained

mOksham. The moment the Lord supposedly entered their body they become

mukthAL. To my knowledge once they started delivering these pasurams

after becoming mukthAL, they never went back to their life of so called

baddha jivatams. Even if they were mere baddha jivAs prior to birth, when we

address them now after listening to their pAsurams that show us the path, can

we still call them as baddha jivAs ? Can't we not call them the same way as

similar to our achAryAs (who infact worship these azwArs) and address their

birth as avathAram whatever their poorvAsramam was ? I respected Sri Sudarsanam

iyengar when he conveyed me the same view of thenAchArya sampradhAyam with more

thorough analysis of swami deikan's work than presented earlier,

which i am not sharing here.

 

I discussed the same briefly with Sri VN Gopala desikachAr and he came

out with very eloquent explanations of the same point as to how our vadakali

sampradhAyam

accepts azwars as avathArams of Lord. *Some* of us mere chElAs and we still

have

to learn from these scholars prior to concluding many things ourselves.

Finally i apologise to Sri Mani and many others if anyone is offended by these

observations.

 

Sri Kamba nAttAzwar thiruvadiukaLE saraNam

thirup pAN azwar thiruvadikaLE saraNam

 

adiyEn

Sampath Rengi