Axiamatic principle

[Guest guest]

At 06:06 PM 3/15/98 +0000, Chandrasekaran. V wrote:

> Lately we find many postings alluding to superiority of

>one Deity over the other (Durga and Lakshmi, Sri Krishna

>fighting against Parameswaran (instance in Thiruvaimozhi) etc.)

>This is but a multi-century old disgusting argument that had

>done nothing but lay bare the bosoms of the arguing parties

>and showed only how unfortunately mistaken they are about

>our one and only God.

 

 

This e-mail list was conceived as a list for Sri Vaishnavas

and others to share and experience the glories of Sriman

Narayana, to enjoy the outpourings of Azhvaars, to learn

as much as possible the wisdom of Sri Vaishnava acharyas,

etc. Sri Vaishnava acharyas ranging from Parasara, Vyasa,

etc. of Vedic antiquity, the Azhvaars, Sri Ramanuja, Swami

Sri Desikan, Sri Manavala Maamuni, and the present day

Acharyas such as Srimad Andavan, Srimad PP Andavan,

Azhagiya Singar, Ramanuja Jeeyar, etc., speak in one

voice when it comes to the singular supremacy of Sriman

Narayana and that all other devathaas spoken in the

Vedas get their powers as a gift from Sriman Narayana.

 

Thus, in this private e-mail list, the supremacy of Sriman

Narayana is axiomatic. It is not a matter open for argument.

Acceptance of this principle, or, at least accepting not to

challenge this principle, must be a prerequisite for

membership into the Bhakthi list. Any discussion about

Vedic verses and/or Azhvaar paasurams that leave room

for interpretation must be conducted within the boundaries

of this principle. If this principle is diluted, Bhakthi e-mail

list cannot truly represent Sri Vaishnavas.

 

Further, it must be noted that the archive of this list is

available to the general public through a web site bearing

the title "Sri Vaishnava Home Page". Thus, it is not

unreasonable for someone browsing the archives to

assume that the collective view expressed is authentic

Sri Vaishnava POV. Therefore, it is important for us

to not dilute the basic Sri Vaishnava belief that Sriman

Narayana alone is supreme.

 

All new members must be made aware of this principle at

the time they join the list. Current members who are

ambivalent about this must be reminded of it. Members

who are not Sri Vaishnavas are welcome to participate and

educate us, as long as our faith that Sriman Narayana

is uniquely supreme is not derided.

 

 

Let me end this with a quote from Thiruvaaymozhi 3.9.1:

 

 

"sonnaal virOdhamithu aagilum solluvEn kENminO,

ennaavil in_kavi yaanoruvarkkum kodukkilEn,

thennaa thenaavenRu vaNdu muralthiru vEngadatthu,

ennaanai ennappan emperumaan uLanaagavE."

 

 

Free translaton:

---------------------

"Some may take offense, yet I shall say it,

please listen, my songs are for no one but my ruler,

my master, the Lord of Thiruvengadam!"

 

 

Why does the Azhvaar feel the above may

cause offense to some? To answer this question

think of a commoner going about telling everyone

that he has no romantic interest towards the crown

princess. Why would anyone want to do this? There

is no need to express this lack of desire. In fact

expression of such disinterest may even provoke

retribution from the royal court censuring his audacity.

Why state the obvious? Yet, the Azhvaar states

the obvious. Why? To guide the rest of us who

seem to get confused from time to time.

 

(The “princess analogy” is from Sri Uttamoor Swamy’s

commentary.)

 

 

-- adiyEn

[Guest guest]

Dear members,

Please accept my heartfelt apologies for posting the mail

regarding the 'supremacy of deities' by which I seem to have

unknowingly offended some members of this mailing list.

I deeply respect the principles of this mailing list. I

apologise to the administrator of this list for violating them.

I forgot about the principles of this list when I realised

the Truth that God is one and only one. As a matter of fact I

didn't have any intention of starting an argument on that matter

by that post. I felt it could bring in some thought into the

Universal Truth. Personally I think I didn't give any impression

in that post in the lines of arguing supremacy. I was actually

only questioning the argument about Supremacy itself. If I

didn't make my point clear and had offended the members, again

I feel sorry.

Again the example of "expressing absence of desire for

the royal crown" Sri Parthasarathy had mentioned only goes along

with what I had opined in the post. ie. when one has purest,

unshakeable faith in his bosom for his Supreme Lord why should

he even ponder over/ reassure/ think and compare with other

deities? Why should he in other words express the obvious

explicitly by say, eliciting instances of his Lord establishing

Supremacy over other deities. Is that the only way one can praise

the Glories of one's Lord. One can, I strongly believe, meditate

upon the glories of his Lord and crave for his pAdAra vindham

without diminishing the glories of other deities. I sincerely

believe so.

 

adiyArkku adiyEn,

chandrasekaran.

[Guest guest]

My compliments to Sri Dileepan on his lucid statements.

 

The issue of SriVaishnavam's exclusive devotion to Sriman Narayana has been

quite the point of contention for many non-SriVaishnavas and more

liberalized members of our community, both within and outside this forum.

I would like to share with these individuals that, at least from my

observation, our following of this vital aspect of our tradition is based

on more than just zealous faith or ethnocentric values. It seems that the

vast majority of us who adhere to this "axiom" do so as a result of some

deeply held personal experiences that have convinced us of the authenticity

and validity of the teachings of the AzhwArs and AchAryans, and has evoked

in us the desire to strive towards the ideal of utter subservience towards

Sriman Narayana and His adiyArs.

 

Such personal experiences at times may be clearly tangible for each of us,

and at other time we may not be quite sure what has led us to this faith.

And, sometimes such experiences may be far too personal to discuss openly.

But, all of us know, for our AchAryans teach us this, that this level of

dedication is solely the result of Perumal's Grace.

 

Does this mean that we feel ourselves superior to those who worship the

other Deities? I think not. But, I personally feel that the very fact we

do not see ourselves as the agents of our own religious values, evokes (or

should evoke) in us a sense of humility and thankfulness for the

opportunity to experience this unique set of religious principles, and the

prayer that others will also be given such an opportunity.

 

dAsan,

 

Mohan

[Guest guest]

At 07:41 PM 3/21/98 +0000, Chandrasekaran. V wrote:

>Dear members,

> Please accept my heartfelt apologies for posting the mail

>regarding the 'supremacy of deities' by which I seem to have

>unknowingly offended some members of this mailing list.

 

 

You are gracious in extending an apology. However, my post

was not intended as a rebuke against you or any other individual.

It was meant to reiterate one of the important principles Sri

Vaishnavas hold dear. This principle often gets forgotten or

misunderstood even by Sri Vaishnavas.

 

 

 

> I forgot about the principles of this list when I realised

>the Truth that God is one and only one. As a matter of fact I

>didn't have any intention of starting an argument on that matter

>by that post. I felt it could bring in some thought into the

>Universal Truth. Personally I think I didn't give any impression

>in that post in the lines of arguing supremacy. I was actually

>only questioning the argument about Supremacy itself. If I

>didn't make my point clear and had offended the members, again

>I feel sorry.

 

>From an Advaitic POV it may be presented that all deities

are really one and therefore all deities can be equally revered.

As you know, Sri Vaishnavas do not accept this. Thus, if

equality of deities is presented in this forum, someone or

another is bound to respond.

 

Further, I see nothing wrong in freely declaring the unique

supremacy of Sriman Narayana relative to other deities,

here in this forum. While I may not make a daily habit of

it, but in principle members of this list must not feel inhibited

to make such declaration if they feel like it. After all, the

Azhvaars have routinely done this. Thondaradippodi

Azhvaar goes to the extent of offering his very head to do

this. "thalai aRuppundum saavEn saththiyam kANmin aiyaa,

silaiyinaal ilangai seRRa dhEvanE dhEvanaavaan."

 

 

> Again the example of "expressing absence of desire for

>the royal crown" Sri Parthasarathy had mentioned only goes along

>with what I had opined in the post. ie. when one has purest,

>unshakeable faith in his bosom for his Supreme Lord why should

>he even ponder over/ reassure/ think and compare with other

>deities? Why should he in other words express the obvious

>explicitly by say, eliciting instances of his Lord establishing

>Supremacy over other deities.

 

 

Again, I submit to you that Azhvaars have routinely done

exactly this. In any case, your complaint is valid only if

comparison is the only mode of worship. That is clearly

not the case here. To my knowledge comparisons have

occurred in the most part only as responses.

 

Please realize, when equality of all deities is presented it is

not unreasonable for someone to correct that misconception.

Further, I don't know how equality of all deities and the unique

supremacy of Sriman Narayana can coexist for Sri Vaishnavas

as you seem to wish. In other words, how could one expect

an Advaiti to accept sEsha/sEshI relationship while still

maintaining the essence of his/her advaitic belief?

 

>One can, I strongly believe, meditate upon the glories of his Lord and crave

>for his pAdAra vindham without diminishing the glories of other deities. I

sincerely

>believe so.

 

 

Sri Mohan Sagar's post answers this concern very nicely.

 

 

 

-- adiyEn