Guest guest Posted May 29, 2001 Report Share Posted May 29, 2001 Respected members of the group I have been a member of this list for sometime, and have been keenly following whats being written. This is my first posting to the group. We havent actually 'seen' the lord in person, but accept that he exists, and worship him in the archa form. My q is, is this knowledge abt the existense of the Lord a result of what we 'experience' and/or the proof provided by the scriptures and the works of our great alwars and acharyas?? Basically, i want to know whether it is at all possible for my faith in HIM to be just that, a complete faith, without looking for any pramaNa. Do I need to be told that fire is hot, or do i need to touch it and know for myself, or is it possible to just "know"?? Thanks in advance sincerely Bhadri --- nArAyaNane namakke parai tharuvAn Get 250 color business cards for FREE! http://businesscards.lycos.com/vp/fastpath/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2001 Report Share Posted May 31, 2001 SRI: Dear Sri Bhadri, You query is genuine and is well intended. Everyone gets such queries in the beginning. Sri MS Hari of Singaproe has been writing tutorials on our sampradayam for beginners like us. You may like to browse them in http://members.tripod.com/~sriramanujar and click under Visistadvaita tutorial. They are basic lessons and will answer such doubts /queries. Get back if there is any doubt Regards Narayana Narayana aDiyEn ----Original Message Follows---- "bhadri" <bhadrivaradarajan bhadrivaradarajan bhakti-list faith in HIM Wed, 30 May 2001 01:11:11 -0400 Respected members of the group I have been a member of this list for sometime, and have been keenly following whats being written. This is my first posting to the group. We havent actually 'seen' the lord in person, but accept that he exists, and worship him in the archa form. My q is, is this knowledge abt the existense of the Lord a result of what we 'experience' and/or the proof provided by the scriptures and the works of our great alwars and acharyas?? Basically, i want to know whether it is at all possible for my faith in HIM to be just that, a complete faith, without looking for any pramaNa. Do I need to be told that fire is hot, or do i need to touch it and know for myself, or is it possible to just "know"?? Thanks in advance sincerely Bhadri --- nArAyaNane namakke parai tharuvAn _______________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2001 Report Share Posted May 31, 2001 Sri Bhadri, I think the question to ask is where this level of faith comes from in the first place? How is it possible to place our faith in somone that we have not "seen," or know anything about? What is it that it is motivating us from within to accept His Presence and seek to adore Him in the form of the archa. Our Acharyas teach us that this faith is the product of the Lord Himself, who solely out of His Compassion and Boundless Desire to help and save us, stays within as our antaryAmin and leads us in the path that leads us back to Himself. It is He who places this faith in us in the hopes that someday He can put it to good use in meeting His Goal. The seed level of this faith is present in almost everyone. But, often times, because of our self interested desires, such faith seems to be vacillating and skeptical. At one moment, when things are not going our way, we seek Him out to help us. If our prayer is answered, we feel happy and revel at how our Chosen Ideal is connected to us. When things do not go our way, however, the very same believer can instantly become the skeptic, doubting Him or His Capabilities, or sometimes even questioning the meaning behind His creation or even His very Existence. Faith, it appears is like an oil lamp that vacillates with the wind. What is needed then is a cover, something that turns the lamp into a lantern, so that not only does this faith become steady, it also burns all the more strongly such that it turns to Love. Such a level faith is something that none of us can gain by ourselves. The complexities of spending eons virtually unaware of Him and pursuing selfish desires have made us helpless victims to the laws of karma. The only thing that can save us is His Mercy, His Compassion, which He provides just when we are ready in the form of the AchAryan. Our AchAryans use the analogy that the Teacher is like a fisherman who is sent to retrieve brass pots that fell overboard from the sailing vessel of their Owner. The fisherman finds the pots to be at different levels in the water, just as we souls are at different levels of attachment to our ego based on our prArabdha karmas. The talented and experienced fisherman has just the right equipment (the Vedas, itihAsas, and Prabhandam) and just the right method (samAsrAyanam and/or bharanyAsam) to connect each pot to his fishing line and bring it up from the water back onto the ship, and back into the hands of the Rightful and True Owner. I hope this helps as a start. adiyEn rAmanuja dAsan Mohan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2001 Report Share Posted June 2, 2001 Sri Bhadri wrote: >....... >Basically, i want to know whether it is at all possible for my faith in HIM to be just >that, a complete faith, without looking for any pramaNa. >....... Dear Sri Bhadri and fellow members, There are a few things that can be 'known', as we all know, without being told or experiencing it first hand. For e.g. a new born instictively knows how to feed from its mother. Nobody tells and neither can this be told. Similarly, the ability to defend oneself when in danger. All creatures do this instinctively - for the very first time and everytime when required. In both cases, there is an implicit trust - the baby trusts its mother and we have some faith in ourselves when we fight back. But unlike feeding or defending, faith in God develops as a result of some exposure. However, in my opinion, trust or faith in The Supreme Power can, and usually does, develop without 'experiencing' God directly. But once it develops, faith can exist without any pramaNa. The only pramanA, if it can be called so, is whatever we happen to know at that point. In fact, that is exactly how it is for millions of people. Many just don't know much about their religion, perhaps a little here and there, but they just believe in whatever they know. So I guess my answer is yes, it is possible for faith in Him to be just that. However, to keep it forever and enjoy the experience, one has to understand the philosophy or rationale underlying one's faith, learn a few works of great saints and scholars and practice it on a daily basis. This eventually will help in true 'realization'. Hope this helps. As always, I request the members to correct me. Reverently, Sriram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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