Re:Upakarma, rites, rituals etc

[Guest guest]

>>If we go back even further in time when the label

>>"bharatha kandam" might have been coined for

>>these "rituals" South India might just be on

>>the periphery of the classical "bharatha kande".

>okay. I actually went to the Saranagathi Journal and read the

>chapters that mentioned about Space (earth and other regions) and

>Time

>I also happen to have the translation from Sanskrit-English

word->word of Srimad-Bhagavatham along with the "Moolam". I mean to

say >this translation is not like a summary of a chapter or summary

of a

>Skandha where one gives his/her own bhaashyam and a meaning. It is a

>word-word, sentence-sentence translation.

 

Vaykaranam (Grammar) does not prove the validity of a statement. The

vyakaranam is but an angam used to proving a statement but is not the

entire proof itself. By the way for you information, there is

something called SamAsa in Vyakarana. Panini Maharishi states that

samAsa is "samas-tasya padasya vivaranam......"

 

One word can have multiple meanings. Similarly when one word is split

according to the samasa it houses lots of meanings. Appaya Dikishita

proved that All nAmAs of the Vishu Sahasranamam connote Shiva expcept

the nAma "Narayana". So as you can see, Vyakarana is only an anga

used in vakyanams, it is not the entire proof itself.

>The rest of the varshas he mentions as "Bhoga-Bhoomis"

>unequivocally.

>Nonetheless there the people also might perform rites and rituals as

>they wish. There people are supposed to enjoy a lot of worldly-bliss

>etc. There is detailed description of all the enjoyments also.

 

The Mahasankalpam performed before the aarambhan of almost every

ritual/karmam includes:

the entire universe, the sapta lokas and narrowing down to the

Bharata Varsha and then to the final place.In the process, the rivers

that flow, the crops that grow in these areas, the forests ,

important towns and the temples that are there are listed.

 

I don't think it would be wise to exclude Uncle Sam's country from

the list :-) (Namely North America)

>Now, of the 18 puranas the Bhagavatham is considered to be part of

>the 6-Satvic puranas and among them the most authentic and the

>greatest. Sri Krishna himself has said that he is the Bhagavatham

>itself to Uddhava and Vidura before the end of his avatar. ("Srimad

>Bhagavatham Swayam Harir-evah")

>So there's no doubt about its authenticity

 

No matter how high/famous a purana is, if it at any time contradicts

the sruthi, then either

 

1.) The Understanding of the Purana is not correct

2.) It has to be synchronised with the sruthi

OR

3.) The purana is rejected.

>Infact there's now a lot of debate about Jesus' visit to India

>during

>his missing 16-17 years and he meeting the great saints of Himalayas

>and other religious areas of Bharatha-Varsha.

 

This is the biggest story I have heard since ages. Maybe the person

who came up with this story would win an Oscar or best joke of the

year award.

 

It is no surprise to me the some of your counterparts in the bible

belt of south USA claim that Hinduism originated from Christianity.

 

This reminds me of the "Koopa Manduka" Story. Koopa Manduka means

frog in the well. I am sure I do not have to be explicit here.

>Whatever may be God's decision...it is his nirnayam that "bharatha-

>varsha" is the undoubted punya-bhoomi and the karma-bhoomi

 

The same god during the avataram of Trivikrama placed his foot on

earth thus making the entire earth a punya bhoomi not just india

alone.

 

--Malolan

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

In response to Pradeep's opinions:

> So I just went on to mail what I read from an authentic

> translation,

> co-related and cross-verified from other sources...that's all.

> There's no personal opinion here.

 

To elucidate more, many people are little aware of the fact that when

tudying the prasthana trayam or any other work for that matter, a

sadhaka has to undergo a RIGOUROUS study of the various

angAs.Traditionally, a study of samskrutham used to take 12 years.

 

Only when the Sadhaka is competent enough to understand the nuances

of the Angas, he goes upon to Understand the various vakyams of the

Sruthi.

 

I said it once and will repeat again, "a mere translation" can have

many effects, the literal meaning of "tat tvam asi" would be

untenable to many schools of vedanta.

 

I mentioned the example of Appyya Dikshita, it is apt enough to place

the importance of grammar when it comes to understanding the sruthi.

 

A mere translation/transliteration is not enough. One word can have

numerous meanings, not just one or two. A samAsa is a compound word

which when split can give a different meaning from the original word.

 

>

> One of the responsed accused that I belong to come clan and that my

>

> counterparts ( i dont know who) make claims that Hinduism

> originated

> from Christianity. Well when I say that "bharatha varsha" is the

> main

> karma-bhoomi and that some say that even Jesus came there to get

> enlightened...how could that be "interpreted" as hinduism follows

> christianity ? That was not my claim anywhere.

 

While some people started claiming that the Taj Mahal was infact a

Shiva Temple, I was not surprised when the same people started

claiming that Jesus was enlighted under the himalayas.

 

If Jesus was enlightened in the himalayas, why would christianity

oppose idol worship?It is interesting to note that pictures of other

gods are idols and it is a sin to worship them, but pictures of jesus

or the virgin mary is divine in nature. What an example of hypocracy!

 

Similarly, the same people (except this time on the other side of the

Atlantic can be found making claims that Hubble is wrong and Hinduism

Originated From Chrisitanity)

 

>

> And about the "trivikrama" avatar where the author of that response

>

> claims that Lord's foot touched the entire world and not just

> the 'bhaaratha-varsh". Ofcourse "yes".

 

Conclusion: The whole earth should be considered punya bhoomi because

she was blessed during Trivikrama Avataram.

>

> But I think even Vyaasa knows about that right...and so does Suka

> who

> tells the Bhagavatham!!! Infact it is a charithram that is well

> discussed in the Bhagavatham. Its not something that was discovered

>

> recently by someone in "Uncle Sam"'s country!!! But Sri Suka still

> maintains that 'BharathaVarsha' is a Karma-Bhoomi in the same

> purana.

 

Did'nt we just see you write in the previous mail that BharathaVarsha

is alone the punya-bhoomi?

> This Bhaagavatham is the essence of reading all the vedas. When

> Vyaasa still felt unhappiness after doing such great works, Narada

> asked him to write the glories of the lord in a way that would

> instill bhakti in the minds of those who read it. That's what is

> the

> Bhagavatam.

 

For your information, Every Work other than the Vedas are considered

only secondary to the Vedas. Even the Brahma Sootrams and Bhagavad

Giitam are considered as Srmuthi.

 

Srimad Bhagavatam is not in contradiction to the Vedas, only the

successive understanding of different hierophants, authors and

readers are in contradiction to the Sruthi Vakyams.

 

Srimad Bhagavatam cannot preach indifferent from the Sruthi! What is

required is a synchronised understanding at every level.

 

> Why does one need all the rituals and yagnas which only give us

> meritorius enjoyments like heaven at best? And these rites and

> rituals that involve agnihotrams seem to have so many restrictions

> about where they should be performed (place, time, varshas, etc.)

 

There is no restriction of place time and varsha, it is just mere

laziness which creates the so called "restrictions"!!!!

 

"Aalasyam hee manushyanaam shariirasya mahAn ripu:"

"Laziness is the greatest enemy of man"

>

> But Bhakti to Lord, reading his pastimes, reciting his glories

> (which

> is the essence of the Bhagavatam) can take us straight to him. That

>

> Bhakti can be done from anywhere on the earth. It is the simplest

> and

> like a nuclear missile in this age which liberates much faster.

> Naama

> Sankirthanam is the most advocated method for Kali.

 

Agreed. But Bhakti Yogam is very difficult even in this Kali Yugam.

The Superhighway to moksham is Sharanaagati. Read Saranagati Gadyam

of Bhagavad Ramanujar.

> to discuss about bhakti, leelais of the lord, his glory than

> discussing the correct procedure for rituals, when where how to

> perform them and whether they should be performed at all in some

> places etc.

 

Performance of Nitya Karmas is one of the required angas of

Panchasamskaaram and Bharanyaasam. Please note that this list is

devoted to discussion of Bhagavad Ramanujar siddantham and how

ramanujar expounded Bhakti and SharanAgati.

>--Pradeep

 

---Malolan

 

 

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