Guest guest Posted December 5, 2001 Report Share Posted December 5, 2001 SrI: SrImathE Ramanujaya namah: Dearest Srivaishnavas, There was a point in one of the posts: (under a different subject) >The prapatti did by Sri BharathAzhwAn, for Sri rAmA to return to ayOdhyA >did not yield result, though the act of performing the surrender was clearly done according to the books, whereas VibheeshaNa saraNAgathi yielded results for him, though it was not done according to the books. I mean to say that actually VibheeshaNA was in the sky and emberumAn was in the ground when the saraNAgathi was done. ============================== I discussed with Sri Hari at great length and based on that discussion given below is the clarifcation/ enrichment for our understanding. Swamy Desikan has taken up the above cases in great detail. (as he can visualize Dec 2001 discussion in our list 700 years ago:-) It is all in his abhaya-pradAna sAram. (it is a rahasya grantham and needs to be studied under a bonafide AChArya. However, let us refer the same without going into details for clarifying our doubt (or my doubt). Swamy has ascertained the meaning of SrImath rAmAyana's incidents that are related in the above context. The prapatti done by SrI bharatAzwAr was perfectly successful. Also, the prapati done by SrI vibhIshaNAzwAr was also in accordance with SAstra. Firstly, let us see the Prapatti (SaraNAgati) done by SrI bharatAzwAr [Refer foot note 1]: When SrI SeeTA PiraaTTi and SrI rAman were in SrI chitra kUtam forest, SrI bharatan (SrI bharatAzwAr) came and pleaded before SrI rAman and requested him in several ways to return back to ayOdyA and ascend the throne. At last, SrI bharatan did prapatti at the divine lotus feet of SrI rAman and did the same prArtanA to SrI rAman. But SrI rAman did not return to ayOdyA. Is the prapatti of SrI bharatA a failure? No. It was only successful. To conclude this, one has to study the SAstra properly and fully and then make conclusion. It has to be noted that, before bharata's prapatti, one other prapatti at SrI rAman's feet (which was done by thousands of dEvas) was expecting its result. The dEvas (demi-gods) who assembled during the yAgam done by SrI daSarata wanted freedom from the evil rAvaNan. Therefore, they did prapatti at the lotus fee of SrIman nArAyaNan. SrIman nArAyaNan gave "abhayam" and thus promised them the result of their prapatti. Therefore, SrI rAman (who is SrIman nArAyaNan in incarnation) did not immediately return back to AyOdyA. SrI rAman, as per his previous satya sankalpam (unchangeable real will) which he had for the prapatti done by dEvas, proceeded. By doing so, he never made the prapatti done by SrI bharatAzwAr to fail. This is the very important point to be noted. He immediately gave his SrI pAdukA (SrI SaTakOpa swAmi) to SrI bharatAzwAr. SrI pAdukA is representation of his tiru-vadi though tiruvadigal (divine lotus feet) is the direct phalam (fruit) for the prapatti done by SrI bharatAzwAr. Here, SrI bharatAzwAr's prapatti succeeded to an extent and he made paTTAbhiShEkam to SrI pAdukA of SrI rAman and did all divine services to it. Even layman appreciated SrI bharatAzwAr's excellence and noble nature. SrI rAman made the prapatti of dEvas to succeed by killing rAvaNan and then completely made the prapatti of SrI bharatAzwAr to succeed by returning to AyOdyA (quickly by pushpaka vimAnam) and ascending the throne. It has to be noted that SrI bharatAzwAr did not do any other efforts other than the only prapatti which he did at citra kUtam for SrI rAman to return to AyOdyA and ascend the throne. The prapatti of SrI bharatAzwAr was thus completely successful. SrI rAma thus made the prapatti of dEvas as well as the prapatti of SrI bharatAzwAr successful without any mutual contradiction or clash between them. Next we take up SrI vibhIsha-AzwAr's SaraNAgati (prapatti):[refer footnote 2] The prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr was perfectly as per Sastra. It was a perfect SAstra-vidhi-vihita niyata-panchAnga-bharanyAsam. He was standing in air above the sea and this never affect prapatti's angams. One can remember SrI drOwpadi's SaraNAgati and the physical condition that she had during that time. The angam and the five angis of prapatti as per SAstra are perfectly present in the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr. 1. AnukUlya sankalpam in the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr: SrI vibhIshanan did updEsam to rAvaNan and asked him to return SrI seetA to SrI rAma. Therefore, he wanted to do and did that which is pleasing for the tiruvuLLam of SrI rAman. 2. prAtikUlya-varjanam in the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr: When SrI AnjanEyan came to the court of rAvaNan as messenger of SrI rAman, the evil rAvaNan attempted to do harm to SrI AnjanEya. SrI vibhIshaNAzwar at that instant, wanted to stop rAvaNan from harming SrI AnjanEya and rescued SrI AnjanEya from the evils of rAvaNan. Also, SrI vibhIshanAzwAr immediately (after his debate with rAvaNa in court) simply left all his wealth and all that is associated with rAvaNa and came to surrender SrI rAma. 3. mahA viSwAsam in the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr: SrI VibhIshaNAzwAr clearly had the firmness in his mind that SrI rAma is "sarva-lOka-SaraNya" - the protector/refuge for entire universe. Also, he came to do prapatti at the lotus feet of SrI rAman who was surrounded by millions of vAnara soldiers without any fear though he very well know that these soldiers of SrI rAma will cause harm to him because he is coming from rAvaNa's place. His mahA viSwAsam "rakshayatIthi" is indeed great. 4. GoptrutvavaraNam in the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr: SrI vAlmikI rAmayaNa words in the very same context "rAghavam SaraNam gata:" clearly brings out the gOptrutva-varaNam because the verse conveys the upAya-varaNam - requesting SrI rAman to be his (vibhIshaNa's) upAya - rakshaka protector/ refuge. 5. kArpaNyam in the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr: The loud voice & words of SrI VibhIshaNa out of his ananya-gatitvam and Aakincanyam like "swarEna mahatA mahAn", "rAvaNO nAma durvrata", "praNAdaSca mahAnEsha: tatOsya bhayamAgatam" etc., clearly brings out the kArpaNyam. Thus the prapatti done by SrI vibhIshanAzwAr is having all the required SAstra-prescribed five angams. With these five angams, the angi, is clear from the words "rAghavam SaraNam gata:nivEdayata mAm kshipram". That is, the Aatma-rakshA-bhara-samarpaNam done by SrImath VibhIshaNAzwAr is clear here. "nivEdayata" in this context not just means "inform my arrival" but stresses the prapatti angi. Therefore, his SaraNAgati is SAstra-prescribed sAnga-prapadanam. The concept of sahEtuka (and nirhEtuka) krupA in this context has been discussed in detail in these lists few years back and the tiruvuLLam of SrImath SaTakOpa, SrImath nAtamuni, SrImath yAmunAchArya, SrImath rAmAnuja has been brought out by scholars like Sri Satakopan swamin, Sri Anand K Karalapakkam and others. Let us not take up again. SrI rAman himself did SaraNAgathi before samudra-rAjan. But that prapatti failed definitely. This is because, SrI rAman (being paramAtmA SrIman nArAyaNan) does not have the qualifications which are prescribed for one to do prapatti (bhara-nyAsam). Also samudra rAjan is not qualified to accept prapatti (bhara-swIkAram). Please note that prapatti is only a sAdyOpAya. The sidhdOpAya is SrIman nArAyaNa. The other sAdyOpAya is bhakti (upAsanam as told in vEdAntam with its own angams). Prapatti/bhakti is to be practiced only as per the prescriptions of Sastras. If done as per SAstra, they will never fail because the sAdhyOpAya anushTAnam by jeevan does vaSikaraNam of the sidhdOpAya paramAtma SrIman nArAyaNa and the paramAtmA SrIman nArAyaNa gives the results without fail. Bhakti and prapatti are not the same. They are different but they give the same result (in this case, nitya bhagavath kanikaryam). Each has its own prescribed angams. The yOgyata (qualifications) for a person to do bhakti is different from the yOgyata for a person to do prapatti. All these are defined in the SAstra Erudite scholars may kindly correct me. Anything good is due to Sri Hari's lucid explanation and points and all mistakes and faults are mine. [1] "muRpAdarAna dEvargaL paNNina prapattikkAga rAvaNa vadattukku ezhundaruLugayum piRpAdArAna SrI BharatAzwAn paNNina prapattikkAga mINDum tiruvabhiShEkam paNNi rAjyam paNNugayum virudhdamAna padiyAlE SrI bharatAzwAnukku prapatti paNNina pOdE parama-palam cadakkenat talai-kaTTiRRillayEyakilum, avarukkuk kaikEyi varattAlE prasaktamAna avadyam tIrum-padi, maravadiyait tambikku vAn paNayam vaiththup-pOi vAnOr vAzha (SrI periyAzvAr tiru-mOzhi 4-9-1) enkiRapadiyE appOdu sAkshAth palamAna tiruvadigaLukkupf prathi-nidhiyAna SrI SaTakOpanAlE saphalatvam solli, pinbu pUrva-prati-jnyAtmAna dEva kAryam talai-kaTTinavARE SrI pushpaka vimAnattAlE sAkshAth palamAna tiruvadikaq swayam-AagatangaLAi ayatna labdangaLanapadi sonnAn." (abhaya-pradAna sAram, adhikAram 3 SaraNAgathi tAtparya prapanjakam) [2] "sarvagnya samhitAdhikaLil sonna AnukUlya sankalpAdhigaLum adanga ip prakaraNattili kANalAm…" (swAmi SrIman nigamAnta mahA dESika's SrI abhaya pradAna sAram, adhikAram 4 prakaraNa tAtparya nirNayam) AchAryan ThiruvadigaLE SaraNam Regards Namo Narayana aDiyEn dAsAnu dAsan _______________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2001 Report Share Posted December 7, 2001 Hari Hari, Many many thanks to Shree. Madhavakannan for the mail on Sharanaagati. Adiyen would like to add few words in this regards. Adiyen has listened to Upanyaasams describing the 6th angam of Sharanaagati i.e. "Aatma Niksheepam". Learned Bhaagavathaas may throw more light on this. If Adiyen is wrong, may kindly be excused and corrected. Hari Hari Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2001 Report Share Posted December 7, 2001 Pranams Sriman Madhavakannan After reading this one doubt arised. Hope you will clarify. When Lord knows saranagati made by vibhishenan was correct as per perfect sastra vihita(even if a jeevatma didn't surrender as per sastra, Lord would take that jeevatma also) and He also knows that He is going to take him, Why did Lord asked every others opinion? Pranams raji sridhar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2001 Report Share Posted December 7, 2001 SrI: SrImathE Gopaladesika mahadesikaya namah: Dear Smt Raji Sridhar, Your question made me enjoy Sri Rama's KalyANa guNAs. He was Lord's incarnation. dharmO vigrahavaan. Still, He hid the Lordship qualities in Him during this avtaar. AtmAnAm mAnusham manyE rAmam dasarathAthmajam. He called himself as just son of Darasaratha, a mere human being. When VisheeshaNan surrenders to Rama, Ramam being dharmO vigrahavaan, letss other key personnel in His group to give their opinions. That is His Greatness. He could have simply said, "I know. No body need to talk. I am accepting VibheeshaNan. " Knowing Rama's valour others would have swallowed their words that they had in their minds. Sugreevan said, "He is from the enemy's camp; His own brother; It is a tactical move on RavaNan to send him here. Also, He has got a very dangerous weapon with him. (what visheeshaNan had was only a gadhA in his hand. nothing else. how could that be a very dangerous weapon which can destroy Rama. (vyAkhyAna chakravartthi Sri Periyavaacchaan PiLLai in his Ramayana thanislOkam vyAkhyAnam says: Sugreeva did not mean the gadhA as the dangerous weapon. He meant that posture of VibheeshaNan.. "anjali mudhrA" and tears rolling won his cheeks.. That anjali mudrA and uttering "saraNam" perforing SaraNAgathy, is the most dangerous weapon to conquer Rama! (what a beautiful explanation!) It is Rama's kalyAna gunA' sowseelyam to have asked for Sugreevan's HanumAn's comments before he decides. Rama was a king; Sugreevan was also a king; Rama had actually sought Sugreevan's help in his venture. So it was natural for Rama to have asked others for their opinions. Sugreevan said" He ie bad with wrong intention. Do not accept him. Hanumaan said, "He is good; He helped me (when I was captured.). Accept him. Rama said, "I take Sugreevan's statement as well as Hanumaan's. I will take Sugreevan's statement "he is bad":. Hanumaan's statement "Accept him." WHY? Rama says."anyone who surrenders- whoever that being is- it is my vow to protect him (or it)." our AchAryAs have been moved by the this categorical declaration and pledge and always glorify this in their Sri Sookthis. The meaning of this slokA (sakrdEva prapannAya ... vratham mama.") is: That individual who has surrendered himself only once pleading that he is to be protected, to him, I assure complete protection and this is my vow." Later Rama immediately performed VibheeshaNa pattAbhishEkam then and there befroe even winning over Ravanan. I have heard this is upanyasam. It seemss Sugreevan asked as to why he did that? What will happen if tomorrow Ravanan comes and surrenders? You have already made VisheeshaNan the king. Rama answered." I will give Ravanan (if he comes and surrenders) ayOdhyA.." (what a quality and kalyANa guNA!) [it is not even Rma's kingdon now. It is Bharatha's (or PadhukA's)How could Rama say that? Rama's brothers are not like other brothers .. namely, Sugreevan, Vaali; Ravanan, VibheeshaNan, et al. Here they are daasa bhUthars and Sesha bhUthars.] Please forgive me for my indulgence. Learned scholars correct /supplement this. SrI SeethalakshaNa Hanumath samEtha Sri Ramachandra parabrahmaNE namah: Regards Narayana Narayana NarayaNa dAsan madhavakkannan ----Original Message Follows---- RAJI SRIDHAR <sridharaji Madhavakkannan V <srivaishnavan CC: bhakti-list Re: Clarification on VibheeshaNa and Bharatha's SaraNagathi Fri, 7 Dec 2001 08:10:36 -0800 (PST) Pranams Sriman Madhavakannan After reading this one doubt arised. Hope you will clarify. When Lord knows saranagati made by vibhishenan was correct as per perfect sastra vihita(even if a jeevatma didn't surrender as per sastra, Lord would take that jeevatma also) and He also knows that He is going to take him, Why did Lord asked every others opinion? Pranams raji sridhar _______________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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