QUALITY of a srivaishnavan - Sri Visu's comments

[Guest guest]

SRIMATHE RAAMNUJAYA NAMAHA

 

Many thanks to Sri Visu for making me think more on

this subject.

He says,

> Even though Smt. Jayasree captions the quality as

"desirable", she tends to

> make it obrigatory

 

This is about the purachinnangal.

I was very careful in dealing with this topic that I

almost behaved like a 'madhil mEl poonai'.

All that I wanted to convey was that the purachinnagal

was not the be-all and end-all of a sv.

 

The individual may or may not adorn them, led by his

circumstances and he is the best judge of his

circumstances.

(I have heard the horrific tales of how my people in

Tanjore had to wipe out the oordhwa pundaram, hide

their shigai and poonool and run for life when the

anti-brahmanic triade was carried out by the DMK in

the seveties.)

In today's conditions too, things are not very rosy -

something we must acknowledge.And there may be other

reasons too whiich I leave to the individual to judge

and decide.

 

I wanted to sound less dogmatic and less ambiguous too

in this aspect in my post.

But to a deep-probing mind, the ambiguities become

well-detected:-))

So let me tell why I made it look obligatory while I

was actually clubbing it along with the desirables (I

used the term 'basic' as an inter-changeable one to

'desirable'- another proof that I didn't want to say

the last word on this issue)

 

# I thought I will be offending scores of sv-s if I

say that the purachinnangal are 'just' desirables and

nothing more. I didn't want to do that - a true sv

must not hurt others (attractive quality) and I try to

be one!

 

# It is said that Sriman Narayana comes to reside in

the body that is adorned with the purachinnangal - it

is for this reason, dwaadasa manthras are recited when

one wears the thiruman kaapu- Though symbolic, I

didn't want to appear to be on the adverse side by

making debatable remarks.

( another point to note: Almost 99.99% of sv-women do

not follow the srichooram code in daily life. Still

are they not sv-s? -I know I am touching upon another

controversy. But let us speak out)

 

# I strongly believe that the purachinnagal alone do

not make one a sv, the must-be and attractive

qualities also are to be adopted in all earnestness.

So I want to say there is more to do with

aga-chinnangal than to be complacent with the

purachinnangal.

 

# And lastly I have my own debates and inferences why

the purachinnangal came to acquire so much importance

over and above the other qualities.

 

For this I can quote the words supposedly spelt by

Yama dharma raja and Sri Krishna. As I couldn't get to

know the exact source, I didn't use the following in

the previous post.

Thirumazhisai Alwar has said that Yamadjharman

instructed his messengers to prostrate before the

sv-s. The sv-s can be identified in the following way.

" Ye baahu moola parichinha shanka-chakra:

Yeva lalaada palakelasa oordhwa pundra:

Ye kanda lagna thulasi nalinaaksha mala:

Teh vaishnava: bhuvana maashubha vidhrayanthi"

The sv can be identified by the shanku-chkra chinnam,

oordhwa pundaram and the thulasi maala.

 

Sri Krishna was said to have instructed his dwaara-

paalagas, before leaving the fort of Dwaaraka, to

allow sv-s inside, who can be identified by the

shanku-chakra dhaaranam and the oordhwa pundaram.

" chakraangitha: praveshtavyaa:

Yaavadaagamanam mama,

Naamudhritha: praveshtavyaa:

Yaavadaagamanam mama"

 

The insistance on pura chinnangal in the above two

instances made me wonder, why they had not laid the

stress on the other spiritual qualities (the must-be

and the attractive in our reckoning). In fact the

qualities of people in those days (pre-kaliyuga)

pursuing athma-vidhyai must have been of a highest

order, irrespective of the sect they belonged to.

 

May I reason out this way?

The mental and spiritual qualities of the seeker,

irrespective of his sect are the same. Like the

different streams rushing to unite with the same

ocean, these seekers are in the same direction. But

only the 'kozhu-kombu' (that which they cling to) is

different. For some it is Vishnu, for some it is

Shiva.

 

Therefore, the need must have arisen to differentiate

a sv from others, just by seeing, i.e., by appearance.

The sv-s who were the highest epitomes of the

srivaishnava-lakshna, adorned the purachinnangal to

show others that they are Emperuman adiyar.

Today it is the other way round.

The purachinnangal seem to remind us that we must live

to be a sv! (no offence meant)

I agree with the following words of Sri Visu:-

 

It seems to me that the external imprints

> (purac/cinnaGkaL) are symbols of character and not

of baptism.

>

> Unlike the other three components, the imprints need

not serve any purpose

> for the initiate. On the other hand they proclaim to

the community that this

> person being a Shri vaishNava can be expected to

demonstrate a certain

> behavior.

 

 

In the case of Muththanathan (in Sri Visu's post),the

purachinnangal were regarded as symbolising the inner

sublime qualities that they come to symbolise.

Muththanathan was an exception than a rule in those

days. The imposter was spared of his life, because of

the purachinnam

Today if someone attempts to do a Muththanathan, we

know what will happen to him. Because the purachinnam

does not corresspond to the aga-chinnam in today's

context.That is why we keep harping upon the other two

types of qualities to anoint one as a true sv!

 

Now once again to Sri Visu:

 

, the

> story makes a point that is valid today.

>

> It seems to me that the pundram is a trademark which

carries with it a

> warrarnty. Under the product warranty, I would have

sued muttu/nAtan and

> claimed compensation!

 

 

Muththanathan is not the original, only a duplicate.

The company will not comply with Mr Visu's demand!!!

 

I beg to differ from Sri Visu on the warranty clause.

I think warranty is out of place in this context.

Warranty deals with replacement of the defective

parts.

In spiritual realms (even in mundane affairs)the

defective ones are not replaced. The faulted one has

to face the consequences of his mistakes / sins

(Theory of karma -cause and effect)

But there is a gauranty offered to the sv -

and true to the implication of this word gauranty,

a wonderful service is offered by none other than

Sri Ramanuja himself.

 

In his (apparantly) last dialogue with the lord

before he left for the 'Ponnadi'of Emperuman, he was

said to have extracted a gauranty from the lord that

He grant mukhthi to all those who have connection with

him (Ramanuja sambhandham).

That is why the need to surrender at the feet of an

acharyan who binds you with Ramanuja sambhandham which

in turn facilitates the ascent to moksham.

This guaranty is indeed the hope of every sv that he

will attain his 'ponnadi' someday due to his Ramanuja

Sambhandaham!

 

Reaching out to the acharyan alone will not help

unless the sv as an individual, follows the other

qualities. The 'gauranty' can not be expected to come

to one's rescue (automatically and logically) at the

end of the same birth, unless the sv stands up to the

other faculties of mental and spiritual nature.

It is very clear from the must-be qualities (emphasis

on MUMUKSHPPADI Avashyaa-peshitham)that they offer

Absolute gauranty to moksha to the sv who is sincere

in his efforts.

 

Now the question from sri Visu:

>

> Finally, I would like to address a question: We have

had very little

> discussion on: How does a Sri vaishNava handle

non-vaishNavAs. I cannot

> imagine a dossier of Sri vaishNavas that will omit

such an important

> question. The question is of special interest to

teenagers and young people.

>

 

The answer is obvious.

The attractive quality is essentially about the

inter-personal relationship of the sv.

A detailed version of these qualities are listed in

Taittriya upanishad, (Sheekshavalli, 11.1 to 11.4)

The advice from the Guru, starting with

'satyam vada: dharmam chara' ( speak the truth, follow

the dharma)and

ending with the art of giving -"Bhiya deyam, samvidha

deyam"

and the other advices in the same chapter precisely

deal with how one must conduct himself in body, speech

and mind.

In his interaction with a non-sv, if the sv stands

steadfast in keeping up with his purity in the

tri-kaaraN,

that is the ultimate good he will be doing to the

sect he swears by.

History will then come to speak about not just one

Kulashekara alwar, but many.

That is the ultimate triumph

of SRI VAISHNAVISM,

of MANKIND

and

of CREATION itself!!

 

AHIMSA PARAMO DHARMA:

Ahimsa through body, speech and mind!

 

The lead has already been given by Nammalwar,

 

POLIGA, POLIGA,POLIGA

POYITRU VALLUYIR CHABHAM..(3128)

....

...

VERRUPPINDRI GYAALATHTHU MIKKAR

MEVI THOZHUDU VUIMINEERE.. (3135)

.......

OKKA THOZHUGITTREER AAGIL

KALI YUGAM ONDRUM ILLAIYE!(3137)

 

jayasree sarnathan

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Srimathe Ramanujaaya Namaha:

I don't understand much of what has been said in this thread due to

my agyana(ignorance). But I would just like to add one thing. Azhwar

says - "NETRIYIL NINDRU ENNAI AALUM NIRAI MALARPPAADANGAL SOODI".

Just wearing the thiruman the lotus feet of emberuman is good enough

that will automatically lead to him. Even if we put it for the heck

of it or without knowing the reason of it, those Sri-vaishnavas who

see us will respect us and bless us which will eventually lead to

understanding of what it is. The outside ignorance must be cleansed

first, then the inner ones. As Poigayaar did through 'VAIYAM

THAGALIYA...' that was followed by Poodhatthar with 'ANBE

THAGALIYA..' leading to the knowledge of Perumal 'THIRUKKANDEN'.

Whether we are capable of wearing it or not, whether the sorroundings

let us do it or not is a different issue altogether. I definitely

feel, THIRUMAN must be worn by everyone who claim themselves to be

Sri Vaishnavite. If a person claims to be a Sri Vaishnavite, that

person should realise the importance of wearing the lotus-feet of the

ultimate and his MRS:-) Shri Mahalakshmi on their fore-head that

keeps reminding them they are governed, protected and taken care of

by the lotus-feet. That is why we say THIRUMAN KAAPPU which means

protection. In fact I asked my father about why even perumal in all

the kovils have the THIRUMAN and I got the reply that he does what

his adiyar does. As he says, "MAMA PRIYAHA" who are none but

SriVaishnavites of-course, he does it too. He wears what his Bakthas

wear. He wears his own feet just because his adiyar wears it. Isn't

this more than sufficient to say that THIRUMAN is of-course the key

thing to start with and just wearing it itself will be sufficient(for

the beginners at least) with a little knowledge rather than not

wearing it and talk about every veda and vedanta? Please do not call

it as a pura-chinnam. It is his esteemed feet. It is not a simple

symbol. It is his holy feet that gives us the knowledge about him.

Shri Vedanta Desikar has sung 1000 poems on those two lotus feet of

ultimate and he hasn't sung so many for anybody/thing else:-) I am a

25 year youth who suffered a lot, for wearing THIRUMAN when I went to

school and college and I eventually stopped wearing it not being able

to tolerate the criticisms I had undergone. But am sure I will be

back to myself very soon wearing them and proudly announcing to

everyone that lord is right here with me by placing his lotus-feet on

my fore-heads. I am sorry in case I had offended any one. I didn't

mean to. I just showered my feelings and also what I thought would be

a little value added contribution to this list.

Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan,

Lakshmi Narasimhan.

 

bhakti-list, jasn sn <jayasartn> wrote:

> SRIMATHE RAAMNUJAYA NAMAHA

>

> Many thanks to Sri Visu for making me think more on

> this subject.

> He says,

>

> > Even though Smt. Jayasree captions the quality as

> "desirable", she tends to

> > make it obrigatory

>

> This is about the purachinnangal.

[Guest guest]

bhakti-list, "lazy_nerd" <vlakshmi2@c...> wrote:

> Srimathe Ramanujaaya Namaha:

> I don't understand much of what has been said in this thread due to

> my agyana(ignorance). But I would just like to add one thing.

Azhwar

> says - "NETRIYIL NINDRU ENNAI AALUM NIRAI MALARPPAADANGAL SOODI".

> Just wearing the thiruman the lotus feet of emberuman is good

enough

> that will automatically lead to him perumal Please do not call

> it as a pura-chinnam.

 

I am a

> 25 year youth who suffered a lot, for wearing THIRUMAN when I went

to

> school and college and I eventually stopped wearing it not being

able

> to tolerate the criticisms I had undergone. But am sure I will be

> back to myself very soon wearing them and proudly announcing to

> everyone that lord is right here with me by placing his lotus-feet

on

> my fore-heads.

 

 

Dear sri lakshmi narasimhan,

It is precisely due to problems such as these, I find many people not

ready to wear or rather retain the Thiruman in the forehead when they

go out.

I have heard many people telling that they would rather go without

thiruman than to be made to hear the 'nakkal' and 'kindal' that some

one or the other takes graet relishment in flinging out. That, to

them, seems to be a serious offence than whatever they are likely

incur for not wearing the thiruman.

In big cities or in temple towns one may not be coming across such

experiences. But it is not so in many other places. But inspite of

all this, we find many sv-s sporting sri choornam regularly. that

much for their concern for the belief in their custom and let us

appreciate them for that.

 

 

I am sorry in case I had offended any one. I didn't

> mean to. I just showered my feelings and also what I thought would

be

> a little value added contribution to this list.

> Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan,

> Lakshmi Narasimhan.

>

> bhakti-list, jasn sn <jayasartn> wrote:

> > SRIMATHE RAAMNUJAYA NAMAHA

> >

> > Many thanks to Sri Visu for making me think more on

> > this subject.

> > He says,

> >

> > > Even though Smt. Jayasree captions the quality as

> > "desirable", she tends to

> > > make it obrigatory

> >

> > This is about the purachinnangal.