HINDU PHILOSOPHY-SHIVA VISHNU WORSHIP

[Guest guest]

===============================================================================

(Note from Moderator: I got the attached from this member through my personal

mail, and responded to him through personal mail earlier. I had thought that it

was only a personal mail to me, and so responded to him personally. I have

attached my response to him at the end of this mail. Even though the position

of viSisTADvaita on anya devatA worship is well-known and has been discussed

extensively before, still the following extract from SrI Sa'nkara's vyAkhyAnam

for the 10th Slokam in SrI vishNu sahasra nAmam introductory part Slokam 10

(pavitrANAm pavitram.. ), is quoted widely by advaitins to argue the equality

between all devatA-s. If you respond to this mail, please respond with

authentic quotes in support for the points you bring out, and keep the

discussion at a purely philosophical level.).

============================================================================

DEAR FRIENDS,

 

THE VISHNU PURANA SAYS:

 

'BHAGAVAN WHO IS KNOWN AS JANARDANA IS ONE ONLY.HE GETS DIFFERENT

NAMES BY HIS ACTIONS OF CREATION,PRESERVATION AND DISSOLUTION AS

BRAHMA,VISHNU AND SIVA'.(1.2.60)

 

WHEN THE ONE PERSON DWELLS IN ALL BODIES,THEN THE TALK OF YOU,HE AND

I IS FUTILE.ALL THAT IS HERE IS ONE.THAT IS ACHUTA.THERE IS NOTHING

HIGHER THAN HE. HE IS I.HE IS YOU.HE ISALL THIS WHICH IS OF THE FORM

OF THE ATMAN. GIVE UP THE DELUSION OF DIFFERENCE.

 

Sri Mahesvara said in Bavisyat purana:

'The fools who perceive Me and Brahma as other than Visnu are men of

perverse thought'.

Mahesvara said in Kailasa Yatra in Harivamsa:

'You are origion of all creatures,similarly the middle and the end(ie

the creator,preserver and the destroyer)

from you the whole universe began and in you everything merges'.

O! omnipresesent deva i am you. O! janardana! YOU are i alone. there

is no difference between us in name or reference'.O! govinda whatever

eminent names are current for you in the world they are my names

too.no doubt need be entertained about this'.

O janardana let worship of you be mine too, gopala,he who hates you

is a hater of me. there is no doubt of this.

"I am called Bhutapati as i am your expansiveness.there is nothing

devoid of you'.

 

O universal Atman! you are i. the reason for our appearing

differently is for the purpose of the world.whatever assurance of

freedom from fear has been promised by you is vouchsafed by me too.O!

sankara you should see yourself as non-diffrent from me.(visnu to

sankara).

 

"He is i;He is thou;and all this world with all the devas,asuras and

men is he. people under the delusion of nescience see difference

(between all this)'.

 

 

cdr bvn

 

Tue, 24 Dec 2002 21:16:39 -0800 (PST)

"Narasimhan Krishnamachari" <champakam

Re: HINDU PHILOSOPHY-SHIVA-VISHNU WORSHIP

"VAIDYA" <vaidya

 

 

It appears that you have extracted your message below from Sa'nkara's vyAkhyAnam

for Slokam 10 of vishNu sahasra nAmam. I would like to mention the following

before I try responding to your position:

 

1. These ideas of advaita and viSisTAdvaita have been discussed for the past

several hundred years. So you are not really inventing new issues here that

have not been addressed. The same vishNu purANam in many places declares that

Brahma, Siva, etc. all get their power from vishNu, that they take their births

like us because of karma etc. I can refer yout some of these, but I do not

think it is going to serve any purpose.

 

2. You may be aware that just as in vishNu purANa and other smRti-s there have

apparently conflicting passages like this, in the veda-s also we encounter

apparently conflicting statements. The way tht my AcArya-s have interpreted

these is in what they consider an internally self-consistent manner. The same

vishNu purANam quote that you have given starts with the declaration in the

previous Slokam as follows:

 

"When the same mighty Deity, JanArdana, invested with the quality of darkness,

assumes the awful form of rudra, and swallows up the universe. Having thus

devoured all things, and converted the world into one vast ocean, the Supreme

reposes upon his mighty serpent couch amidst the deep; He awakes after a

season, and again, as brahmA, becomes the author of creation". In other words,

this statement unequivocally says Who is the Might deity who assumes the other

roles, and who reposes on the mighty serpent couch etc.

 

The way we interpret these statements is: JanArdana is the Suprem Being. He

becomes the antaryAmi of rudra, the antaryAmi of brahmA etc., and enables them

to perform their respective functions. He is an antaryAmi in me and in you and

enables us to function as the being that we are. The interpretation that "I am

vishNu in truth", or "I am Brahman in truth" is not accepted by viSisTAdvaitins,

just as the statement "Siva is vishNu in truth", or "BrahmA is vishNu in truth"

is not accepted. They are a tiny part of vishNu in our belief. I am not

interested in converting anyone's views, but I just would like you to understand

that the great souls who have propounded the viSisTAdvaita philosophy were very

realized souls also, just as Sa'nkara was.

 

The same vishNu purANa that you quote, also says the following:

 

"All the gods are impure because they are born in karma and are subject to

karma" ( V.P. 6.7.77)

 

vishNu dharma says: "All beings in this world from brahmA down to a clump of

grass are all born in karma and are in the grip of samsAra".

 

In the bhakti list, issues such as this have been discussed, and you can go

through them to get a pespective of the different arguments. If you still want

me to give more evidence of my views, I can spend the time and do that.

 

-Krishnamachari

[Guest guest]

LORD MAHAVISHNU is the supreme personality of Godhead this is clearly

established in Srimad Bhagavatham which was the last book written by Sri

VyasaMuni after writing various scriptures but Bhagavan (Lord Krishna) says

that worshipping or serving all other Gods or any living being is equal to

worshipping me.

 

 

(Dear SrI Bahttathiry: Where does it say in SrImad bhAgavatam to worship living

beings as equal to worshipping Lord Krishna? I have repeatedly requested you to

support your statements, and I find that you just keep making statements

-Moderator).