Guest guest Posted September 19, 1998 Report Share Posted September 19, 1998 >mpw6678 > >on this issue, i've happily and respectfully read the postings of ramchandra and raju and am unable to approach their insights. i understand that once outside the well, the ladder or rope is no longer needed; however, i enjoy sri ramakrishna's insight that to escape the well, a ladder will do as nicely as a rope or a bamboo pole. each is left in the well by its respective user. the absolute is all that is. brahman satyam, jagat mithya. in light of this, my limited understanding feels that to remove one thorn, another thorn is not necessarily needed, especially when all thorns work to (re)move another object and not to transcend objects. the worldly feeling that a thorn must be removed is the only reason any notion of a thorn, or that one thorn is more efficient than another, exists. to me, a hierarchy of thorns seems unprofitable. > >maxwell. Greetings Maxwell: Thanks for your observation and let me clarify your questions regarding thorns. Please understand no attempt is made to compare the relative merits (demerits) of thorns and I agree that fundamentally all thorns must be removed. Let me divert your attention from thorn to thought. My current thought is how to get rid of thoughts from my mind. Momentarily, I recognize that I created a new thought in this process of removing thoughts! How to rid of all thoughts from the mind? The one and only way to avoid thoughts is to go beyond thoughts! As long as we confine our selves as intellectual individuals we can get rid of a thought only by another thought. Invariably, we get trapped within an endless loop of cyclical thoughts! Thoughts become habitual and they are influenced by Vasanas (habits) acquired through the perception of body, mind and intellect. Lord Krishna in Bhagavad Gita recognizes that perception is the root cause of thoughts and he advises to adopt one of the three Yogas - Karma, Bhakti and Jnana.. Karma Yoga: Conduct acts without expecting results (fruits)from actions. Instead of perceiving that we act, we become the witness of our actions. (Act spontaneously without selfishness) Bhakti Yoga: Accept that you are an agent of the Nature and you have the obligation to serve. Implicitly we are willing to forgo our identity and actions and are diverted to the benefit of the Nature. (Total surrender of Ego, the cause of all thoughts). Jnana Yoga is strictly not necessarily a path but : Have the WISDOM to accept and adopt the path of Karma and/or Bhakti Yoga. Actually, these Yogas are inseparable and those who adopt to one of them necessarily follow the other two. When we adopt our life according to the prescription laid down by the Gitacharya, we conduct our actions with the Yagna spirit. The scripture (Gita) claims that we can liberate ourselves from the boundaries of body, mind and intellect and reach the state of permanent happiness. Sankara's Advaita Yoga thesis elaborates Jnana Yoga or the Yoga of merging with the Supreme Reality or Nirguna Brahman. Karma Yoga stresses the moral responsibility of human beings to complete their duties without looking for rewards. With the Yagna spirit, the human realizes that community service as an opportunity and also the reward. To practice Bhakti Yoga, faith, conviction, and the attitude of surrender are the essentials. For the Bhakta with the total surrender attitude, actions and rewards are the gifts of God. Though the Bhakta has the determination to have the communion with God, there is always a distance that persists between them. According to Sankara, the existence of distance implies the absence of total surrender of ego. Sankara describes that Karma Yoga prepares the human soul to ethical ascent toward the ideal from actual. Sankara further explains that Bhakti Yoga prepares the imperfect human soul to religious ascent toward the Perfect Soul (God). Sankara finally observes that in Jnana Yoga, duality does not exist between the ideal and the actual or between the perfect and the imperfect. According to Sankara, Brahman is the ultimate reality. The universe belongs to a lower level of reality. Sankara never denies the multiplicity of the world of experience, he only assigns a lower order of reality to it. Nirguna Brahman (Absolute Consciousness) is therefore, so unique that nothing on this side of experience, however sublime or elevating, can approximate to it. Any attempt to describe it is like attempting to describe sweetness to someone who has never tasted sweetness. Consciousness is always present and never absent. The disappearance of consciousness is the highest level of the experience of consciousness. It can neither be described nor be understood without the EXPERIENCE! At that stage there will be no more actions, thoughts, Karma Yoga, Bhakti Yoga and Jnana Yoga including Advaita philosophy! Basic understanding of Advaita is necessary and the following chart will serve that purpose. The new members of the list can understand the Advaitin terminologies. The Advaitic Cosmology chart is from the ‘Essentials of Hinduism,' by V. Krishnamurthy, Narosa Publishing House, India (1989). Advaitic Cosmology Atman - Brahman - Symbol OM (Also Para Brahman, the Supreme Absolute) ============================================ || || ======================= ========================== Para Sakti Apara Sakti (Supreme Power of Brahman) (Not-so-supreme power of Brahman) CHIT SAKTI - the power of Prakriti, Maya, Pradhana, Avyakta, Cognition. Pure Consciousness Jada, Avidya, Kshara & Kshetra The Spirit and source of all ============================ energy and known as the abstract form of Brahman =========================================================== || || ====================== ========================= Jiva Iswara spirit under a material Spirit, viewed in relation envelope and is under to matter or Brahman constant spell of Maya or conditioned by the intellect. Avidya. He is also the Saguna Brahman or the concrete. experiencer and witness to form of Brahman who is worshiped the three states of for His grace to descend. Consciousness. Also, called the Purusha, the occupant of the vehicle ======================== ============================ Spiritual Content of Jiva Spiritual Content of Iswara ======================== =========================== || || ======================= ========================= Jivatman Paramatman ======================= ========================= \\ // \\ // \\ // =================================== Tat Tvam Asi (Essentially Identical) ================================== || ======================================== He is kshetrajna, the Knower of the Field. He is Aksharam, the imperishable. He is Purushottama, the Supreme Person. He is Avyay, the Changeless. He is the ParaBrahman. ======================================== Glossary: Prakriti - the totality of all nature and all vAsanA Maya - Deceptively hides the spirit behind the matter and makes false projections. Pradhana - the most fundamental and under the will of Iswara, it produces the five elements and thence the universe. Avyakta - the unmanliest because it is not perceptible to the senses Jada - insentient Avidya - cosmic ignorance Kshara - the perishable because it alternates between manifestation and non-manifestation. Kshetra - the field, because it is the base of all action. -- Ram Chandran Burke, VA 22015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 1998 Report Share Posted September 19, 1998 Sri Rama chandran wrote in response to Maxwell's question. In a message dated 9/19/98 5:37:13 AM, you wrote: << Consciousness is always present and never absent. The disappearance of consciousness is the highest level of the experience of consciousness. >> To practice Bhakti Yoga, faith, conviction, and the attitude of surrender are the essentials. For the Bhakta with the total surrender attitude, actions and rewards are the gifts of God. Though the Bhakta has the determination to have the communion with God, there is always a distance that persists between them. My heartly pranam to Sri Ram Chandran . Thank you for kindly responding with beautifull insights. I am very happy to read what you wrote. Also thanks to Maxwell for raising the question on my Samsaye. Namaste. Raju Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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