Where is the God?

November 5, 1998

Namaste to everyone in the list

In 'Talks on Upadesa Saram', Swami Dayananda says:

"If the Lord created the world, is He inside the world or outside of it?

If you say that the Lord is inside the world, that means someone else must

have created the world! The Lord cannot be outside the creation because

there is nothing outside the creation. Then where is the Lord? The

creation is the Lord! The Lord is thus, the Creator as well as the

creation, just as I am creator of my dream and I also am the dream - my

creation."

Many religions are based on exactly assumption that the Lord is outside His

creation. What would be the simple logical proofs of "...there is nothing

outside the creation"?

Thank you

Lilia

November 5, 1998

>Lilia Stepanova <ls691035

>

>Many religions are based on exactly assumption that the Lord is outside His

>creation. What would be the simple logical proofs of "...there is nothing

>outside the creation"?

>

>Thank you

>

>Lilia

If the Lord is outside then the questions comes - what is that outside and

who created that outside. If that outside is also created then that

out-side comes inside the creation . Hence by definition and by logic,

creation has to be infinite. Hence creation is also Brahman - the

infiniteness! He can not be inside the creation, He cannot be outside the

creation - only choice left is He and the cration are one and the same -

Hence the Upanishadic statements - Sadeva soumya idam agra asiite, ekameva

advitiiyam -- etc. Existence alone was there in the begining and it is one

without a second. Has to be unlimited if it is one without a second.

etova imaani bhuutani jaayante ..... etc also follows - Brahman is that

from which the whole universe raise, is sustained and goes back in to it,

since there is nothing other than it.

Hari Om!

Sadananda

K. Sadananda

Code 6323

Naval Research Laboratory

Washington D.C. 20375

Voice (202)767-2117

Fax:(202)767-2623

November 5, 1998

At 11:11 AM 11/5/98 -0500, sadananda wrote:

>sadananda <sada

>

>>Lilia Stepanova <ls691035

>>

>>Many religions are based on exactly assumption that the Lord is outside His

>>creation. What would be the simple logical proofs of "...there is nothing

>>outside the creation"?

>>

>>Thank you

>>

>>Lilia

>

>If the Lord is outside then the questions comes - what is that outside and

>who created that outside. If that outside is also created then that

>out-side comes inside the creation . Hence by definition and by logic,

>creation has to be infinite. Hence creation is also Brahman - the

>infiniteness!

So the answer to "Where is God?" is -- Everywhere there is a Where, and

Everywhere there is not a Where, There is God!

--Greg

November 5, 1998

Gregory Goode wrote:

>

> So the answer to "Where is God?" is -- Everywhere there is a Where, and

> Everywhere there is not a Where, There is God!

>

> --Greg

Greetings:

Everywhere contains the question, 'where' and also contains the answer

'here,' and 'ever'!

--

Ram V. Chandran

Burke, VA

November 5, 1998

Show me a place where God is, I will show you the place where my

Consciousness is. God is sarvavyAptam as my Consciousness is.

[i do hope members do not take this response as petulant and obnouxous,

but I think my response is correct.]

Regards

Gummuluru Murthy

------

Yadaa sarve pramucyante kaamaa ye'sya hr^di shritaah

atha martyo'mr^to bhavatyatra brahma samashnute Katha Upanishhad II.3.14

When all the desires that dwell in the heart fall away, then the mortal

becomes immortal, and attains Brahman even here.

------

November 5, 1998

Lilia,

You ask a difficult question. Images work for me when trying to understand.

Maybe this one will help.

Picture a circle -- empty inside. Nothing. This is Godoutside of creation.

Now picture an M in the center -- movement. This is creation. Both can be

true. God can be nothing, outside of creation, manifest within creation.

All that is manifest and all that is unmanifest can be god without

contradiction. Maybe we are God's breath as exhale/movement and reabsorbed

again. To see this way requires a non-liner view of time. This part, I see

as a figure eight -- an infinity sign. What we know of time is prehaps a

fragment of what is encompassed along that cyclical pattern. We draw lines

showing beginning and end, yet that may be purely out of our need to form a

concept of time so that we can order our experience. Some might say that

all of eternity is contained in a perpetual now (as a point at the center

of the figure) and the past and future are part of creation arising from

that still point in the center.

Anyway, that's just how I can imagine something so sacred and beyond

comprehension.

Hope it helps

Let me know!

Tamra

November 6, 1998

I tend to think even God abides by certain rules, maybe set by

himself/herself or possibly just a matter of physics or nature. It

could be that I refer to something different when I say God than you do.

I am finding that many people use the word God and mean something quite

varied by it.

At risk of being stoned to death, could you give me your definition of

God?

Love and light,

Eric.

----Original Message Follows----

"T. Temple" <joklumji

Lilia,

You ask a difficult question. Images work for me when trying to

understand.

Maybe this one will help.

Picture a circle -- empty inside. Nothing. This is Godoutside of

creation.

Now picture an M in the center -- movement. This is creation. Both can

be

true. God can be nothing, outside of creation, manifest within

creation.

All that is manifest and all that is unmanifest can be god without

contradiction. Maybe we are God's breath as exhale/movement and

reabsorbed

again. To see this way requires a non-liner view of time. This part, I

see

as a figure eight -- an infinity sign. What we know of time is prehaps a

fragment of what is encompassed along that cyclical pattern. We draw

lines

showing beginning and end, yet that may be purely out of our need to

form a

concept of time so that we can order our experience. Some might say that

all of eternity is contained in a perpetual now (as a point at the

center

of the figure) and the past and future are part of creation arising from

that still point in the center.

Anyway, that's just how I can imagine something so sacred and beyond

comprehension.

Hope it helps

Let me know!

Tamra

------

To from this mailing list, or to change your subscription

to digest, go to the ONElist web site, at and

select the User Center link from the menu bar on the left.

------

Discussion of Sankara's Advaita Vedanta Philosophy, its true meaning,

profundity, richness and beauty with the focus on the non-duality

between mind and matter

November 6, 1998

God --

Existent consciousness not limited by time, space or anything else. The

intelligence behind and the stuff of all "universes." All-knowing and

all-powerful.

This one is understood from many points of view, may be given many names and

stories may be assigned. God is seen as immanent or transcendant,

incarnating or not, made up of disparate unlikely forms, or without form.

Behind all the ideas is one about whom we can say very little. God is not

entirely a subject or object, cannot be said to exclusively inhabit only one

form or one place or one time as do the other things we are more skilled in

describing.

Aikya Param

P.O. Box 4193

Berkeley, CA 94704-0193

Advaita Vedanta for Today (graphics)

http://members.tripod.com/aikya/

Advaita Vedanta for Today (text version)