Faith: [Ultimate reality]

[Guest guest]

>

>Ram Chandran <chandran

>

>Greetings:

>

>Pure Religion on the other hand Identifies that the ultimate reality

>(God) is the root and source of all that science studies. Can

>scientific methods be applied to knowing the "ultimate" questions, such

>as "Where did I come from? Where am I going? Is there a optimum way to

>live my life? Did I exist before I was born? Will I exist after I die?"

>

>Religion is based on faith (belief) and conviction and can’t be

>scientifically evaluated for its content and relevance. Scientific

>facts can be logically tested and either they are rejected or accepted.

>There is no logical way of testing religious viewpoints and we can’t

>reject them using scientific methods. The viewpoints that are rejected

>using scientific methods fall short of the definition of ‘Religion.’

>

 

 

Dear Shri Ram Chandran,

 

I am attaching a discussion on faith with Ramana below and it may be of

interest to you. No doubt the common notion in recent times is that faith is

illogical, blind, meant for the less capable who cannot enquire on their own

etc. However this need not be what seers meant by faith in earlier times.

 

D: Devotee; M:Maharshi

 

A visitor asked: Sri Bhagavan said last night that God is guiding us. Then

why should we make an effort to do anything?

 

M: Who asks you to do so? If there was that faith in the guidance of God

this question would not have arisen.

 

D: How shall I secure that firm faith?

 

M: Exactly. It is for such as these who want instructions. There are persons

who seek freedom from misery.They are told that God guides all and so there

need not be any concern about what happens.

If they are of the best type they at once believe it and firmly abide by

faith in God. But there are others who are not so easily convinced of the

truth of the bare statement. They ask "Who is God? What is His nature? Where

is He? How can He be realised?" and so on. In order

to satisfy them intellectual discussion is found necessary. Statements are

made, their pros and cons are argued and the truth is thus made clear to the

intellect. When the matter is understood intellectually the earnest seeker

begins to apply it practically. He argues at every moment, "For whom are

these thoughts? Who am I?" and so forth, until he is well established in the

conviction that a Higher Power guides us. That is firmness of faith. Then

all his doubts are cleared and ne needs no further instructions.

 

D: We also have faith in God.

 

M: If it had been firm no questions would have arisen. The person will

remain perfectly happy in his Faith in the Omnipotent.

 

D: Is the enquiry into the Self the same as the above mentioned faith?

 

M: The enquiry into the Self is inclusive of all, faith, devotion, jnana,

yoga and all.

 

So faith (at least for Ramana and a few others) is *not* the denial of logic

or reasoning. Rather it is the culmination of

of the process of logic and reason. Neither the popular religious swamis nor

the acclaimed scientists of today seem to have understood this. Hence the

widespread acceptance that faith is opposed to reason, and religion is

divided from science.

 

 

Regards,

 

----Viswanath

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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